Pros and cons of steel sailboats - Page 125 - SailNet Community
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post #1241 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Yeah ORACLE!!!!!!!!
Congrats ORACLE design team. You made a faster boat.

I just got new pics of the Sliver Project. I'll post them later. That is my way of presenting the "cons" to steel boats. You will not believe how fair the deck it.

Here is one shot. They are polishing the deck to get it ready for the contrasting non skid paint. The non skid will be laid out in "panels" to give it a more intersting look than just smearing nonskid over the entire deck.
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Last edited by bobperry; 09-25-2013 at 05:21 PM.
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post #1242 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

My clients are resourceful enough to avoid the extreme foolishness of buying the most expensive items they can find for everything on the boat. So your question is not only irrelevant, but insulting to them. Most buy a used main sail and hang it without doing anything to it, battens and all, then go sailing , getting around to a battenless mainsail later
All in mast furling mains have no roach and very few have battens, including your beloved Beneteaus .
Just met two more people wanting to build brentboats, in the last three days, both experienced, one very experienced in offshore voyaging. Just got a supper invite from one, after his viewing of this forum. Said we have a lot in common. Beautiful westerly is blowing that way. Sold a lot of books in the last few days .
What do all my critics in this debate have in common? Absolutely zero hands on experience in building, long term cruising in and maintaining a steel boat.
Steel boaters who read these posts, and don t oppose the disinformation of the critics, are passively allowing the resale value of their boats to be undermined by plastic boat salesmen ; again.
No problem for me, I'm retired ,and bought my gold in 1999 at under $300 an ounce.

Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"
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post #1243 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Cheer up Brent. It's not all that bad.

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post #1244 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
Yeah ORACLE!!!!!!!!
Congrats ORACLE design team. You made a faster boat.

I just got new pics of the Sliver Project. I'll post them later. That is my way of presenting the "cons" to steel boats. You will not believe how fair the deck it.

Here is one shot. They are polishing the deck to get it ready for the contrasting non skid paint. The non skid will be laid out in "panels" to give it a more intersting look than just smearing nonskid over the entire deck.
Stuff no stronger than bondo on a steel deck. Some get artsy fartsy with their first deck job, but abandon it after some serious cruising, when having fun becomes greater priority, that giving a hoot what amateurs and gullible "style over substance" consumers think.
Land living is borrowing money to buy what you don't need to impress people you don't like. Some take that kind of thinking to the sea, sadly.

Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"
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post #1245 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
My clients are resourceful enough to avoid the extreme foolishness of buying the most expensive items they can find for everything on the boat. So your question is not only irrelevant, but insulting to them. Most buy a used main sail and hang it without doing anything to it, battens and all, then go sailing , getting around to a battenless mainsail later
Then price everything used. It's really not that hard, Brent.

It's a shame that you, the most experienced authority on building and maintaining steel boats, refuse to help out the wannabe cruisers who are interested in a steel boat. The fact that you promote your boats without giving ANY kind of real numbers on what it takes to build it from start to finish is insulting to them.

Real costs may be irrelevant to you. But not to most sane people.

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post #1246 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
Steel boaters who read these posts, and don t oppose the disinformation of the critics, are passively allowing the resale value of their boats to be undermined by plastic boat salesmen ; again.
No problem for me, I'm retired ,and bought my gold in 1999 at under $300 an ounce.
Ah, chum in the water. This ought to be good.

Prepare for the onslaught of outraged steel boaters....

(Keep in mind, Brent just told you to "eat cake".)

PS - Brent, what kind of royalties do Bob and I get for helping you sell more books?


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post #1247 of 5317 Old 09-25-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Some people like an "artsy" deck. Look at that shot looking aft from the cockpit. Note how fair the deck is. It's almost a shame to have to paint the non skid panels on but in a contrasting color they will add some interest.

This deck came out of a CNC female mold so it was very fair to begin with and did not need bondo.
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post #1248 of 5317 Old 09-26-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Brent- over the last few weeks have had opportunity to socialize with owners of sisterships built in the last 2-3 yrs.
Couple of men leaving RI. to go through the Panama Canal to cruise the South Pacific.
Young man taking delivery in California then returning to oz with his bride and two infant children.
Mature couple of docs leaving R.I. to do the Salty Dog.
Young couple leaving R.I. to do Great Lakes for a couple of yrs. then caribe cruising
Us doing eastern us coast,caribe and then parts unknown.
This is just one small production builder. Believe if you got valiant owners or Tayana owners or PSC owners or bcc owners etc. the stories would be equally or more expansive. Statements about " plastic boat salesmen " are belayed by folks common knowledge.
Please accept glass,plank on frame,wood strip,cold molded, Al, carbon/foam, and steel all have undeniable merits.
You mentioned using ss at corners. That was interesting. Please drop the blanket indictment of "plastic". You have knowledge of pros/cons of your material. Speak to that.
? How do you handle wiring?electronic?compass?bottom paint? Engine mounting?shaft?electrolysis prevention

Bob-that owner gonna smile every time he looks back from the dinghy. Priceless

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post #1249 of 5317 Old 09-26-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Out:
I think you are wasting your time with Brent. He's like a broken record and I don't believe you can change that. He seems pretty unhappy with his position in the world of boat building and that's too bad. His attacks on everything and person not in the BS style has become tiresome. But I suspect he's stick with that reaction having run out of anything more cogent.

I know these pics are not very exciting to most people but the FRANCIS LEE is fully "tented" in the yard right now to keep it clean while painting proceeds. So, I can't get any good photos right now. But these two shots of the bootstripe show just how fair the hull is. Look at the reflections of the scaffolding in the topsides.

I think you nailed it Out. The row away factor is going to be sky high on this boat. But Kim's very lucky. Much of the time the FRANCIS LEE will sit at the end of Kim's dock in front of his house or on his mooring in front of the house. I look forward to seeing the boat on my own mooing for a day or two.
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post #1250 of 5317 Old 09-26-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Not many cars have reflections that perfect, let alone boats.

Very high quality work.

How many hours were spent fairing up the hull? Just the paint prep hours, not including the "construction" fairing.

I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken and opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
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