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  #181  
Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

yeah, okay.
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  #182  
Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
forget about this Spray design, a true disaster in any material.
Fixed it for you.

The Spray - proof that even a haystack will sail downwind. Every Spray I've seen has made those Dutch lee-board barge yachts look like high tech racers.
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  #183  
Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I don't know if people have failed to recognize it or if they simply reject the concept but I understand where BS is coming from.

His priorities (ONLY priorities it appears) are cheap, relatively simple construction and ultimate survivability at sea - icebreakers as it were.

Aesthetics other than the brutal, purely functional workboat type, simply don't enter into his philosophy.

That is simply a lack of artistry IMHO. Bob & I wrote earlier about a local log salvage boat named Beach Boy that was designed by Garden. It is absolutely beautiful and a log boat has as hard a life as any boat out there. Most of them look much of a muchness with BS's boats from an aesthetic POV but Beach Boy proved they don't have to - you simply have to care about it and have a designer with some artistry.

I find BS's origami process interesting but I'd sure like to see one done with the aforementioned artistry, especially re: the deck structures.
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  #184  
Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Lots of steel boats have been built by amatures in less then ideal conditions.IMHO there are even some good looking ones with chines.The Wylo II comes to mind.Folded plate construction(Origami) has been around for a while.Its not "Brents" he didnt originate it.He did not originate DIY either.He didnt invent ocean cruising,sailing, welding, or anything else as far as I can tell.The claim that he "pulls a hull and deck together' really means he has only tack welded it together.Its far from a complete shell.There is still many hours of welding to go just to get a empty shell.You can save alot of money fabricating fittings,using discarded wood for an interior.But even cheap epoxy is expensive(Yogi Barra?).For my area just a space to build in is expensive as hell.Trevor Robertson built his wylo Iron Bark in 2 years.Hes sailed her 100,000+ miles including wintering over in Antartica and Greenland. This is and interview with him and Annie Hill.Annie Hill & Trevor Robertson - YouTube
He seems like a nice guy.He probably wont insult your wife or belittle you for your choices.

Last edited by jak3b; 07-16-2013 at 03:37 PM.
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  #185  
Old 07-16-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by jak3b View Post
Trevor Robertson built his wylo Iron Bark in 2 years.Hes sailed her 100,000+ miles including wintering over in Antartica and Greenland. This is and interview with him and Annie Hill.Annie Hill & Trevor Robertson - YouTube
He seems like a nice guy.He probably wont insult your wife or belittle you for your choices.
Holy CRAP! Now these are people I can respect.

Look at this!

Smiley face

Smiley face

Iron Bark's travels

Go the Trevor and Annie!
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

^^^This, friends, is what happens when you wait just a little too long for winter haulout in Ontario.
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  #187  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones View Post
^^^This, friends, is what happens when you wait just a little too long for winter haulout in Ontario.
Heh-heh. I have some very deep sympathy for you guys in the winter. That's brutal.

I'll raise a warm beer northward this January and have a moment of silence while I adjust my flip-flops.
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  #188  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I have read this thread from beginning to end and would wish to offer the following observations.
1.I took the commercial welding course at the local voc. school when deciding if I wanted to have a steel/aluminuim boat. I wanted to know about TIG/MIG welding,use plasma cutters etc. I figured if I went that way even if I had K+M or Kanter build the boat for me at least I would know what was a good yard, what was good construction,what was good 5k series Al or 3 series SS etc.
2.I have sailed on AL and Fe boats. and at one time was very close to buying a Boreal
Fe can be done well. In general it is cheaper, faster and safer to have it done by a professional yard. For me the calculations showed it was cheaper to have a professional yard do it as I could make more money at my day job per hour then they cost per hour given they are so much more productive with that hour. Also availability and expense of subsequent innsurance etc. needs to be factored in. Fe make sense at >50-60' but not below.
Al requires great skill and a controlled environment to be done correctly. Design of all systems not only the structure of the boat must be done and installed keeping the issues with Al foremost in mind. It is a material which is very viable for boat construction but in my view can only be done effectively in a professional yard to design made orginally for Al.
Owners of metal boats need an additional knowledge base concerning the issues germaine to metal construction and maintenance. The Metal Boat Society was a good resource for me.
I went with solid glass hull and divynicell core deck/house etc. Hannah2 went with Al professionally built. Both are good decisions for "blue water boats". In the current era unless one wishes to go slowly, can avoid going to weather, have very limited comforts,can spend years of their life getting a boat ready for sea and can self insure a BS boat makes little sense.
I would encourage the OP to google the Dutch/French yards, speak with surveyors and see/sail vessels in this catagory before making the jump.
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Last edited by outbound; 07-16-2013 at 03:42 PM.
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  #189  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I respect people who sail to Greenland, Antarctica,NW passage but for me no thanks!.I want to be in an area that can natively support coconuts.San Francisco is bloody cold as far as I am concerned;-).
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  #190  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Thanks for the thoughts, smack.
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