Pros and cons of steel sailboats - Page 220 - SailNet Community
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post #2191 of 5317 Old 11-19-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by blt2ski View Post
One has to get them curves around things you know.........so why shouldn't one of them curvy's be in HIS photo's too!............
I reckon it'd detract too much from the boat.

C'mon, you've got to agree that this particular design would sell itself.. and the addition of a curved lovely would only hide the curves beneath.

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post #2192 of 5317 Old 11-19-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

naaaah, a curvy lovely would make the curves below look lovelier!.........that is my story, and I am sticken to it!
well, maybe not quite as I was describing......but a curvy lovely driving me boat! as I drive me dinghy!

She drives me boat,
I drives me dinghy!
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post #2193 of 5317 Old 11-19-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I can not believe it....I found the quinsential BS boat, in a post here in sailnet! wow....unbelievable.....I must be on a role tonight!......just amazing...........


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Originally Posted by Bilgewater View Post
I photo-shopped the registration number to protect the innocent.



Work in progress...Wait for it!



Wait for it!



Introducing "Shingle Boat"



If you can reno a house, you ran reno a boat!











THE END...

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post #2194 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I saw this boat yesterday and he is still SAILING...

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post #2195 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

The shingle boat is pretty scary!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
Cas:
I find that 40-8 rather handsome. It appears to be very well built. Pity to see it on the rocks.
I like the pointed bow hammerhead Munsons but those 'tailgate bow' ones just look weird to me. I wouldn't worry too much about it on the rocks though… it's what it's designed for. Munsons are beyond tough and have replaceable wear plates on the hull.

My dads research Munson sank twice on the Columbia River due to defective bolts on the jet drive, and both times he scuba dived to the bottom, hooked on a cable, and winched it all the way back up onto land without any damage to speak of.

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Whereas in a nice warm pilothouse I have to get fully dressed and rigged up before going out to deal with whatever.
A pilothouse makes a lot of sense if you're in latitudes/weather where it's physically impossible to survive a long watch without a survival suit. Brent's boats aren't designed around serving martinis on a tropical yacht club dock.

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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
So, though he'd love people to think it, Brent is ABSOLUTELY NOT "picked on" here or anywhere else.
I think you should re-read your posts in this thread if you really think that.

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Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
certainly no advantage over building your own, and far more costly.
Minney's Yacht Surplus in SoCal sells used blocks for really cheap… I'd have a hard time justifying the time of building one. Your blocks look tough as nails, but I doubt they can get to the low friction levels that a mass produced ball or roller bearing block achieves. A well made used block lasts nearly forever, I am mostly using ugly looking 1970s Schaefer blocks I salvaged for free off a derelict I found adrift.

Last edited by casioqv; 11-20-2013 at 12:31 AM.
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post #2196 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

When I was doing some work on Crane Island, I noticed A LOT of the folks that lived on the islands that did not have ferry service, had a boat that could do as the Munson 40-8. All were aluminum for the most part. A steel one or two here and there. but aluminum was the main one. There is another style or two of ALum boat used too, along with a few fiberglass ones. But would suspect aluminum is used as that is how you had to get things to the land, ie land the boat on the rock, unload,quickly and head back out, or if the tide was going out, you were stuck on the shore, or only land during flood tides!

I do agree the fronts on boats like the 40-8 were ugly if you will, but from a practical use standpoint, VERY functional and useful!

Marty

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post #2197 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I think this is a good looking Munson... it'll do 40 knots and is built for offloading supplies while pounding onto a rocky shore. My dads research Munson when I was a kid was very similar to this. Sorry for the lack of sailboat content!


Last edited by casioqv; 11-20-2013 at 01:10 AM.
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post #2198 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by casioqv View Post
...
There's nothing wrong with Brent's boats- they look and act the part for which they're designed: frugal high latitude self sufficient cruising. If I were doing that, they're exactly the boat I'd want.

If you honestly think Brent's boats don't suit the needs of his customer base, or that he's just a con artist you're way out of touch. I've read many of his customers blogs and they do some incredible adventures and the boats function flawlessly. You guys are all just jerking each other around because you don't get along at a personal level, but the attacks on each others designs make you all look unreasonable.
What makes a boat good is not the drawings you make of it but the level of satisfaction that they provide to the users and clients. That has normally a reflex in the number of boats built.

Regarding those two points I have only heard good comments regarding the owners and users of BS boats and it seems to me that there are a large number of his boats around, specially if we consider the tiny market they are pointing too.


Regarding boat designs, it is normally not an Architect that makes beautiful 3d renderings but an artist (or technician) specialized on that type of work to promote the boat. An Na does not have need of beautiful 3d renderings to design a boat. Of course the drawings will only look good if the boat is well designed but you can have a nice boat without all those nice 3d renderings and they are not the essence of the work of a NA.

What makes BS annoying is not his work but the very limited vision he has about yachts, yacht designs and their different uses and markets. His position regarding sailboats would be similar to the one that wanted to convince that a traditional Jeep is the right and only type of car to everybody and to all functions different types of cars are designed to provide. A ridiculous view and because he maintains this absurd posture and attacks all others that think rightly otherwise ( including BP) his boats end up to be denigrated too.

As you say there is nothing wrong with his boats but there is something very wrong with Brent position regarding sailboat design.

Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 11-20-2013 at 07:10 AM.
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post #2199 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I only put people in my drawings when I need to illustrate and ergonomic point.

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post #2200 of 5317 Old 11-20-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Classic:
I haven't given any thought to running lights. I imagine we'll put the on the pulpits as usual.

A note on 3D renderings:
Paulo is correct. Most designers have someone working with them who takes care of the 3D work. The 3D work takes shape from my 2D drawings that I produce in the normal design sequence. 3D renderings are very useful to help the client get a feel for the new boat. They also allow us to explore in depth different aesthetic options. I woud not be giving my clients "full design services" if I did not offer 3D modelling as part of the package. But it is not cheap. A design from me is going to cost the client betwee 8.5% and 10% of the build cost. I tell my clients up front that I was the design budget that gives me the freedom to do my very best work. I am not interested at all in producing a cheap design.

But 3D work is not about just producing pretty pictures. We can take our 3D files an send the to a CNC shop where they can carve molds or plugs out of foam full sixe. These
tools" will be used to produce the hull, keel, rudder and deck for the boat down to the last detail. This puts a huge burden on the design today to produce design documents that take the place of many hours of hand lofting on the shop floor in order to produce full size patterns and templates for the boat. But it also unsures that a good designer today can exersize far more control over the finished product.

I'm proud of what I do. I know I do it well. I am happy to show off my design work.
Here are some pics showing howthe pilot house/hard dodger came together for the 62' build at PSC right now. The last pic shows the foam mold after being CNC cut from the 3D file. This will be a 2.5 million dollar boat. No room for BS here.

If you look carefully at the 3D models you will see the drip groove running accross the back end of the pilot house. This is there to prevent water from dripping down into the cockpit. I can't think of everything but I can try.




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Last edited by bobperry; 11-20-2013 at 08:13 AM.
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