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  #4031  
Old 03-05-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

We have a similar SS anchor knocker plate on the custom 46'er I posted here. I'll dig up a rendering when I am back on my own computer. I am working with my intern today, again.
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  #4032  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Brent most modern grp boats have ss as substrate for bow rollers/sprite. Mine's 318 and not a speck of rust in spite of using only chain for rode. It's a casting I believe and quite pretty. The short sprite keeps anchor away from hull even when we run over the anchor a bit so the hull has remained pristine. Putting plate up there would be unpleasing to my eye but I see why it would be a good idea for many boats and have seen it done without detracting from appearance.
I once anchored at Isla Isabella , northwest of Puerto Vallarta. Next morning I couldn't get my anchor up, so had to dive for it in the murky water., in a swell. With combination of swell and the anchor jammed under a rock slab, the loads on it were huge . It caused the crown of the anchor to peel like a banana. When I got to PV, I saw a lot of yachts with bent and mangled anchors, bow rollers and bow sprits, from the same anchorage. That is why I believe a bow roller should be stronger than the biggest line which will ever go over it, both vertically and sideways, as a boat getting off a lee shore in a gale will put tremendous side loads on her bow roller. Lack of ability to take such loads was what put a lot of boats on the beach in Cabo in 82.
I believe cleats ,chocks and mooring gear should also be stronger than the breaking strength of the biggest line which will ever be used on them. Long, extended bow roller arrangements meant to keep the anchor clear of the hull, usually have no such strength, not vertically, and certainly not sideways.
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Last edited by Brent Swain; 03-06-2014 at 08:34 PM.
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  #4033  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by jak3b View Post
Here a nice story about a steel boat:
A big, bad, breaking wave caught us sideways and rolled the boat through 360 degrees. The hatches collapsed; the heater chimney was ripped clean off; the mast snapped at deck level and water poured in everywhere. Our inflatable dinghy was torn in half. Paul was reading in his forward bunk when we were struck … He came looking for me. I was upside down, unconscious and under a metre of water, in the shower room. My scalp was split open and there was a lot of blood. … He hauled me to my feet and I came to quickly but had very little understanding of events. I kept asking Paul, ‘What ocean are we in?’ …[According to Paul, the boat was upside down for several minutes.]

We had trouble activating our emergency beacon. … I was deathly cold, sitting in the cockpit. My clothes were soaked and I shivered uncontrollably. It was getting dark and I knew I would not make it through the night. The boat was taking on water [probably through the sink outlet and the loo, although Pete didn’t realise it at the time], the batteries were flooded and no pumps were working. We were sinking. After two hours there was no sign of rescue, nor had we any idea whether or not our signal was received by anyone. Paul found a 2-way radio and I transmitted our mayday message. No answer.
We sat in the slowly filling cockpit, sipping on a bottle of fine whisky and staring off into the wild waves and night. Boozing was the worst thing a couple of hypothermic boys can do, but there is the matter of style. I was resigned to the inevitable …

The boat was awash now and I told Paul to get ready. Two more waves and she went down. We stepped up into the ocean with no sign of a helicopter in sight but I held the strobe light beacon in one hand and tried to keep my head clear of the breaking waves. I drank a lot of sea water. Then, a lovely sight. Searchlights on the water from the low-flying helicopter coming towards us.
The pilots hovered clear of the huge waves and dropped one swimmer on a cable and then another. These brave boys hauled us to safety.

Everything was at the limit. The helicopter’s range, our ability to stay afloat, our strength, our hopes. They did it and we survived.

from here:
https://petepowell.wordpress.com/201...erein-we-sink/
I don't think you would lose the aluminium hatches on my boats, nor the one piece door on the boat Bob just posted a picture of ( no flimsy, yachtie style sliding hatches, made of fragile, dead vegetation)
I don't think you would rip the 4 inch by 1/8th inch wall stove pipe, welded into the decks of any of my boats. You could use them as mooring bits. I have only one thru hull in operation; the sink drain. I welded the handle on its ball valve at a 45 degree angle so I can use a push rod extension on it ,eliminating the need to reach past anything to turn it off. The only other one, the watermaker intake, is only open when in use. Deck stepped masts don't let water in. My half inch plexi ports are unlikely to break , unlike expensive, fragile, yachtie style, plastic opening ports. Hand pumps need no batteries.
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Last edited by Brent Swain; 03-06-2014 at 09:08 PM.
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  #4034  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Came back yesterday from helping a friend bring his outbound from BVI to the adult day camp at George Town. Was struck by how many steel boats where in there growing beards at the waterline. Most were hard chine but some beautifully executed. Several were fully developed hulls and gorgeous. Still when going by in the ding you could tell they were steel. Few flags on the sterns were U.S. mostly Canadian but clearly these boats can and do voyage. Huge variations in designs. The ability to execute a boat without the need for expensive tooling and molds is a significant advantage for metal boats.
It's unfortunate this thread has focused on origami as I did NOT see a SINGLE origami boat.
Brent- The world wants to know- other then yourself who do you respect as a steel boat designer/N.A.? Particularly interested in if you respect anyone building in plate and frame construction.
I have always admired Wittholtz, simple, functional, single chine boats, with rudders in the right place ,over the transom . Ganly also has some extremely practical, functional designs. Tanton also has some very practical, logical designs. As imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and his 31 and 36 footers are imitations of my own designs, I could hardly be critical of them.
I went looking for Tad Roberts in Silva bay a few days ago. No sign of him or his design office . With the heydays of boat design long gone, and the market awash in used boats being given away, there is nowhere near the future in designing pleasure boats that there once was. That, and demographic changes, will probably put most out of business, unless they think outside the box, and offer something different from what most are offering .
Youth would be wise to look elsewhere for a career.
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Last edited by Brent Swain; 03-06-2014 at 09:05 PM.
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  #4035  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
I don't think you would lose the aluminium hatches on my boats, nor the one piece door on the boat Bob just posted a picture of ( no flimsy, yachtie style sliding hatches, made of fragile, dead vegetation)
Actually, Brent, I kinda like my floating patch of dead vegetation with it's dead vegetation hatches and cast-bronze ports. It's not particularly fragile, either - but then perhaps not as rugged as yours.

"Petite"... rather than "butch".
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  #4036  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Well, there you have it:
Different strokes for different folks.
It's worked for many years.

I really do not want to be Brent anymore than he wants to be me.

We each do it our own way and we like our own ways. I enjoy watching Brent do it his way. He has much to teach.
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  #4037  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

With the age of the baby boomers starting to see the last sunset, boats will become a little less expensive ? Any type of design will need to have value to survive ? A blue water boat should also be more affordable. The young of today's world have less time to travel ? They have more choice in what to spend their limited time on.
Would you view this as truthful ?
Thoughts ?
Kind Regards, Lou
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  #4038  
Old 03-06-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou452 View Post
With the age of the baby boomers starting to see the last sunset,
Not quite there yet but I heard it put as "We're moving into the turnstiles now" - Jane Fonda after Henry died.
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  #4039  
Old 03-07-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

I really love the ebb and flow of threads like this. The water has calmed. The rhetoric is sensical. It is good.
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  #4040  
Old 03-07-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
. Ganly also has some extremely practical, functional designs.
Do you mean Dennis Ganley the New Zealander??

If so then yes I agree, he had penned some of the most capable blue water steel boats over this side of the world.

We considered the below 'tara' design when were looking for a cruising boat. At the time though there were no appropriate candidates.

Used Ganley Tara 39 for Sale | Yachts For Sale | Yachthub
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