Pros and cons of steel sailboats - Page 420 - SailNet Community
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post #4191 of 5317 Old 03-24-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
So what business does someone with so little sailing experience and zero steel boat or long term cruising experience, have giving such sanctimonius advice to those of far greater experience in the subject at hand, and telling us that we have it all wrong?
Simple. It's because you're wrong. Pretty much always.

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Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
They even have to make up quotes, so they will have something to disagree with!
Well, someone in this thread certainly has years worth of experience making up quotes. You can see many of them here:

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I don't think any of us hold a candle to the vast amount of experience you have in this particular department.


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post #4192 of 5317 Old 03-26-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
I reckon Alvah Simon probably knows a thing or two about owning, cruising, and maintaining a steel boat...

My April copy of CRUISING WORLD arrived today... Alvah has an article about his recent 7 months spent in a boatyard in NZ...

The title is "Rust Never Sleeps"... Ooops...




"Roger Henry" was still looking good from the outside when we last saw Alva.


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post #4193 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by SloopJonB View Post
Building boats and parts from scrap and scrounging is not seamanship - being able to handle a boat at sea IS.

They are not the same thing - most people are good at one or the other but not both.
Building proper solid lifelines out of sch 40 scrap stainless is far better seamanship that tig welding them out of the super thin walled extruded tinfoil which yachtieness demands. Building proper, solid mooring bits out of sch 40 pipe welded in, is far better seamanship than the dainty bolted down cleats which yachtienes demands. Seamanship begins with the building and design process.

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post #4194 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by slap View Post
You consider information from someone with zero knowledge in stability or structural design to be useful? More experienced boat design people would consider that laughably gullible!
Surviving 16 days pounding in up to 12 ft surf on a Baja lee shore, pounding across 300 yards of Fijian coral reef, T-boning a steel barge at hull speed, colliding with a freighter in Gibraltar, decades of ocean cruising in all conditions, without a single structural failure at sea, and a single season passage thru the NW passage, all with no structural damage whatever, is far more accurate that any calculations you could ever come up with.
Yet those who claim that such boats are not structurally strong enough , buy and cruise in boats which would have broken up in minutes in the same conditions, proving that they are definitely not the sharpest tools in the shed!
Perhaps it is time you gave NASA a call, and informed them that they can get rid of their wind tunnels and structural testing to destruction, as your computer is more accurate.
The stability curve of my boats is posted on the origami boats site. Have someone who can read English, interpret the last sentence for you.

Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"

Last edited by Brent Swain; 03-29-2014 at 10:30 PM.
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post #4195 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
I reckon Alvah Simon probably knows a thing or two about owning, cruising, and maintaining a steel boat...

My April copy of CRUISING WORLD arrived today... Alvah has an article about his recent 7 months spent in a boatyard in NZ...

The title is "Rust Never Sleeps"... Ooops...




Did Simon have any experience with steel boats before he bought that one? I understand he began with none. Did he build it from scratch? Did the person who built her comprehend the importance of thick epoxy inside, on clean, blasted and primed steel. Lack of adequate blasting , priming and epoxy inside is the main cause of steel corrosion inside. I have never said a steel boat wont be a corrosion headache, if you make a total screwup of the inside painting. I have just said that it will not be, only if you use blasted and primed steel, with a heavy coating of epoxy inside. Sadly too many steel boats make screwup of the inside painting I( Like Foulkes, Fehhrs or Amazons). I have never had the problems which Simon describes, despite my boat being about to turn 30 years old.
The only boats of mine which have had such problems, are those who's owners ignored my advice about adequate inside painting.
How would your plastic or wooden boats have fared in the conditions which Simon experienced?

If I remember correctly ,you could see the shape of each 4x8 ft sheet on that boat, meaning she was very roughly and poorly built , which probably continued to the inside painting job.

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post #4196 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
No rust on FRANKIE yet. Can't see that ever happening.
Is Frankie strip planked, carvel planked or cold molded? What kind of planking on what kind of frames? What kind of fastenings?

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post #4197 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by shank32095 View Post
I just got on this site because I was interested in purchasing an upper end 57' Steel Ketch down in KK Malaysia. I am beginning to think I am wasting my time as all I have read about is a bunch fools paying way too much attention and feeding this troll Brent who's only claim to fame is building extremely unsightly vessels he puts together from stuff he finds in the junk yard so he can then sell to another unsuspecting fool. He then sails off into the sunset for a year until the dust settles before returning to start collecting junk for his next victim. Just a bit of advise fellas, ignore as if he does not exist, make him invisible and he will go away, no BS, LOL. One thing I can assure you, I spent 30 years building custom homes in St. Augustine. Most of these were on the beach, many in the Coastal Construction Zone. If my company statement included that we could throw down a house in three months and save you a bunch of money using materials we found laying around and discarded, how long could I have stayed in business? Forget him already, he's a hack and nobody is going to inflict more damage on his reputation than the self-inflicted damage that he has already done. Reply if you want Mr. Swain but my opinion stands, reading your crap is a painful to the eyes as the vessel you build, I refuse to reward your bad behavior. You are deleted.
Then why are the strongest advertisers and proponents for my boats the people who put the most miles and years on them, and my only critics those with no such experience? .Why did Winston ,veteran of a circumnavigation choose one of my 36 footers for his pacific circle cruise, then another for his NW passage trip then a third, and his daughter choose one of mine ? Why did Steve, after having sailed from BC to New Zealand and back, choose one of mine for his Cape Horn to Aleutians and back cruise?
Sorta blows your theory!

Man, finally getting some good winds! Burned barley a sniff of diesel since Ladysmith! Great sailing lately!

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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Simple. It's because you're wrong. Pretty much always.
With zero experience with steel ,you couldn't possibly have the foggiest idea of what is right or wrong ( like all of my "zero steel boat experience", critics)

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post #4199 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
The stability curve of my boats is posted on the origami boats site. Have someone who can read English, interpret the last sentence for you.
We've already been over this. The "stability curve" is right here:

Pros and cons of steel sailboats

And it's not valid...even in English.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
Why did Winston ,veteran of a circumnavigation choose one of my 36 footers for his pacific circle cruise, then another for his NW passage trip then a third, and his daughter choose one of mine ? Why did Steve, after having sailed from BC to New Zealand and back, choose one of mine for his Cape Horn to Aleutians and back cruise?
Apparently because they like losing a lot of money when they try to sell them.


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post #4200 of 5317 Old 03-29-2014
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

It has always been my experience in life that people that are really on their game, at the top of their field of expertise, never feel compelled to constantly state how wonderful they are. Likewise insecure individuals who fail to achieve a consensus of success to which they feel entitled overcompensate by doing just that, continually expounding how they are the best and brightest. To be humble and allow ones work to speak for itself is the greatest success anyone can achieve.
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