Pros and cons of steel sailboats - Page 75 - SailNet Community
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post #741 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Glad I can contribute to the entertainment and education around here. We all muck in. I learn here too. I'm also entertained here. It's really a pretty good place to hang out.

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post #742 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
The suggestion that anything which was never photographed "didn't happen" was the looniest thing I have ever seen posted. It deserved my entirely appropriate challenge .
To anyone that interpreted the post like that, please seek help, you have serious brain damage and need immediate help.

Watch great footage about the story of one man’s slow odyssey around the UK:
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post #743 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Oopps! I had to edit my last post. Not sure how I did that but it was 4:30 am and before coffee.

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post #744 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by chall03 View Post
No it wasn't and No it didn't.

Clearly it is rather difficult to now go and photograph and document the French Revolution.

IT IS NOT DIFFICULT for you however to produce some figures, some fact, some substance here to support your case. Dude even if you faked them it would of taken less energy than the hyperbole and conjecture that you continue to litter this thread with.

I like steel boats, I actually didn't mind your boats, obviously there are those that have built them, and cruise them, that's great. I actually enjoyed your initial contributions on here, but I am now seriously having the urge to ram BS designed boats on sight.

Take a hint Brent.
Personally, I'd be somewhat satisfied seeing some current pics of Brent's own Steel Perfection. What does a boat that gets $50 and 2 hours of maintenance per year, for 30 years, look like - as it really is...now? Pics of the perfect steel under the foam - pics of the perfect paint job - pics of the perfectly good old line and sails - pics of the salvaged parts - pics of the $2 blocks that have held up perfectly for years - that kind of stuff.

Whaddaya say, Brent? It's not like this stuff is the Ice Age or anything.


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post #745 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Personally, I'd be somewhat satisfied seeing some current pics of Brent's own Steel Perfection. What does a boat that gets $50 and 2 hours of maintenance per year, for 30 years, look like - as it really is...now? Pics of the perfect steel under the foam - pics of the perfect paint job - pics of the perfectly good old line and sails - pics of the salvaged parts - pics of the $2 blocks that have held up perfectly for years - that kind of stuff.

Whaddaya say, Brent? It's not like this stuff is the Ice Age or anything.
You can see the pics of my boat etc on the origamiboats site. Posted pics of my blocks on anythingsailing.com before I gave up on that site. Dont have the means of posting pics out here on the cruising grounds.

Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"
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post #746 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Thank you Brent. That was informative. What do you do welding? Do you grind edges to45 degrees to pull a good puddle? What do you think about flame zincing? Is there advantages to using closed cell sheets or do you foam in place? What about fire and toxic fume threats? Do you use heat sinks welding? Do you tack and wander to decrease distortion?
I use mostly 6011 for uphand and overhead and 7024 for horizontal downhand
I use 316 stainless sticks for stainless and stainless to steel welding
I grind edges to 45 for full penetration, where needed. The chine and centreline etc are already open.
Flame spraying is an excellent way of eliminating paint job maintenance. I wrote extensively on this subject a few posts back.
Tried sheet foam, and no matter how hard I tried to get a sealed vapour barrier in front of it, it kept things soaking wet behind them with condensation
Sprayfoams is the only realistic long term solution I have found. Friends tried sheet foam and found it cost as much as spray foam by the time they were done, and a huge amount of work.
A friend priced the foaming kits now available in Home Hardware. They look like a couple of propane bottles that you hook up to a mixing nozzle .He said they cost about half the cost of having a foamer come in, and are easy to use.
One of my 36 footers caught fire in Frisco Bay .Dispite intense heat, the fire went only as far as where he had painted it with cheap latex paint. The fire would go no further. Couldnt get enough oxygen.
I try to keep my welds short, to minimize distortion, more in some places than others.
Any reasonably skilled amateur shouldn't have to hire anyone to build his boat. Used sails are far cheaper than the cost of materials, let alone time, so there are exceptions, but few.
With my book and plans, and Alex's video many have been building their own boats, with no problems. The book is pretty dog eared by the time they are done, but they found the answers they needed there.
I find my boats are easy to build right side up, and building one upside down would be a waste of time. Overhead welding is not that hard to learn, and I minimize it with my building methods. Integral tanks add a huge amount of structural strength to my boats, the tank top being a large horizontal, fully welded steel bulkhead, structurally. While that is irrelevant in my single keeler, it makes a good, very strong attachment point for my transverse keel webs, on my twin keelers. Without the tank top there, one would have to run the transverse supports to the centreline, making the centreline useless as as tankage. This would leave the only option for tankage, much higher up, raising the centre of gravity and reducing stability.

Thanks for finally asking real questions on this thread, to finally break the stream of adolescent drivel.

Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"

Last edited by Brent Swain; 08-28-2013 at 04:08 PM.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Glad I can contribute to the entertainment and education around here. We all muck in. I learn here too. I'm also entertained here. It's really not a pretty good place to hang out.
Few things are more satisfying than solving someones seemingly difficult problems, with a simple and effective solution..

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post #748 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

The Sliver Project FRANCIS LEE has ben taken out of the shed to have the CF mast dry fitted. The boat is now back in the shed but we did get some very nice photos of the boat while it was outside. Nice to be able to stand back a bit and admire the proportions.
Thought you guys might like a little simple and effective eye candy.

Now it's time to get the cove and bootstripes on and dress the boat up. I have very detailed drawings that show the exact locations of all the stripes and the layout of the contrasting non skid panels. Details are very important to me. If I am going to work hard to make sure the boat performs as designed I sure as hell want to control the way it looks. Of course, this has to be done working closely with the client.
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Last edited by bobperry; 08-28-2013 at 05:05 PM.
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post #749 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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You can see the pics of my boat etc on the origamiboats site. Posted pics of my blocks on anythingsailing.com before I gave up on that site. Dont have the means of posting pics out here on the cruising grounds.
Naa. Those origamiboats pics will be ancient and, as usual, very misleading in regards to what you're claiming about how perfect your boat is...today. And I know you don't want to ever mislead people, Brent. Heh-heh.

That's cool. I didn't think you'd cough up any proof. It's always easier to just make stuff up from the "cruising grounds".

Oh look, Bob's presented yet more photos of actual boats he's designed for actual people! Ones that are actually being built - and actually sailed! I'm not sure you're qualified to carry his evidentiary jock-strap, Brent!


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Last edited by smackdaddy; 08-28-2013 at 09:33 PM.
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post #750 of 5317 Old 08-28-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

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Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
Oopps! I had to edit my last post. Not sure how I did that but it was 4:30 am and before coffee.
I think it still needs work Bob.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
"It's really not a pretty good place to hang out."

I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken and opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
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