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  #771  
Old 08-29-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Or, you can check out today's pic of FRANCIS LEE.
Today the bootstripe was laid out. It's just two parallel lines. There is not enough sheer spring to the boat to have any spring in the bootstripe. But if you look carefully at the closeup shots we found a wee bit of an optical illusion. The stripes were laid out with a laser so we know they are dead straight but right in the ends they appear to kink up a tad bit, ONLY at one narrow angle range and distance to the hull. The shots taked from the loft level, looking down on the boat do not show this. The painters at the yard are not concerned. But I must admit it has ne thinking. I may need to run down to Seattle in the morning to put my mind to rest.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Probably a reflection of the curvature of the hull. Looks great to me. Places accent on the finest of the hull. Don't worry - be happy.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Out:
I'm sure you are correct. The stern, while extremely narrow is very full in section and that may be driving this effect. I just like to be comfortable with what I see and understand why I am seeing it.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Hull curvature, along with at the ends, the lines will literally be farther apart due to the hull shape. Hence why the ends in the photos look like they are curved. My boat, while not a double ender, much less a BP boat design, has some similar feelings at the ends on the boot stripes. IT is even more apparent with a flat transom vs a double ended boat!

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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Marty:
It's me, Bob. I know that stuff. But look at the shape in the ends of FRANCIS LEE, especially aft. It is very, very different aft than your boat. There is no flat counter that can really stretch out the bootstripe in order to maintain a vertical height. It's almost vertical anyway. I'm not concerned. I just got a bit spooked looking at that photo. The client went to the boat this afternoon and he's happy. When the client is happy I am happy.

Go Seahawks!
Nitey night. Got to get up early and meet some salmon up close and personal.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Bob,

Its a combo of the lines, and hull curvature, along with the lens angle in the camera at the point it was taken. Yeah a good camera and lens will do wonders to get close to the real thing.....but in the end, probably not in reality. Lots going on. Enjoy the night, catch some salmon n the AM, heading to ludlow for the weekend. If I can get packed in time.

Need to get back to csr and see how the project is developing.


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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

As I said, “I have sailed all the other boats mentioned” (not the Brent Swain). That is why I chose to list them. I am a delivery skipper and brokerage “on call” skipper. I sail a lot of boats.
When you are confronted by a person with more experience than yourself and that person’s experiences contradicts your theories, do you automatically call him a liar? Is that the Sailnet way?
The first 10 pages of this thread answered the OP’s questions. A sticking point early on concerned the “speed” of a steel boat. The answer is that hull material of a heavy displacement boat is inconsequential to the sailing performance of that boat. It matters little if the hull is carbon composite or plate steel. The proper shape for that displacement is what is important.
The 4 other boats mentioned by me fall into the general category of “average”. They are NOT “4 of the best blue water boats in the world” as stated by Mark2gmstrans. The Brent Swain design, as frequently shown, is just an adaptation of a purpose built boat. It is steel and can easily be adapted to a different purpose. I would choose a slightly different adaptation, but still with a full keel, and have a boat that, YES, will sail equal to or better than all the other boats mentioned.
If any of you are having trouble understanding this, as Mark2gmstrans is, I suggest that you force Mr. Perry to give you the straight scoop for once, as the source of your ignorance rests squarely on his shoulders.
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  #778  
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Personally, I'd be somewhat satisfied seeing some current pics of Brent's own Steel Perfection. What does a boat that gets $50 and 2 hours of maintenance per year, for 30 years, look like - as it really is...now? Pics of the perfect steel under the foam - pics of the perfect paint job - pics of the perfectly good old line and sails - pics of the salvaged parts - pics of the $2 blocks that have held up perfectly for years - that kind of stuff.

Whaddaya say, Brent? It's not like this stuff is the Ice Age or anything.
Come on Smack, the guy is sailing and it is easy to find pictures of his boats and its building on Internet. You have to put Brent Swain on Google and look for images. How difficult is that?

You can see some drawings here:

http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/met...ngs-24418.html

Regards

Paulo
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Old 08-30-2013
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

" I suggest that you force Mr. Perry to give you the straight scoop for once, as the source of your ignorance rests squarely on his shoulders."

Brilliant piece of vague. non substantive BS.

Of course the choice of hull matterial of a heavy displacement boat has nothing to do with the boat's performance. Nobody here said that. But your statement is not totally true. If you would like to get technical and accurate, a lightweight hull material on a heavy displ boat would result in more ballast and a lower VCG and many full keel boats coud benefit by more stability. This would result in better all round performance. That's the "straight scoop".

I appreciate the fact that you give me so much power here, I'm flatterred. But I think most of the posters can think for themselves just fine. They are adults. I can't see how anyone here could or would want to "force" me to do anything. That's kind of an angry point of view. Silly too. I think you have some "issues" with me personally. That's your personal problem, not mine. I've never met you and you do not know me. But carry on with your rant. It's fun to keep things stirred up. Your opinions are just that, i.e. your opinions and we all have our opinions.
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Last edited by bobperry; 08-30-2013 at 09:51 AM.
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Re: Pros and cons of steel sailboats

Paulo:
Many thanks for posting the link to BS's drawings. They are what I expected.
They show little ctaftmanship in design.
My sail plans are abit more detailed. You can judge the difference for yourself.
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