SailNet Community banner
  • SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!

Last Boat- Time to look at the end game Cruising Boat

13K views 61 replies 30 participants last post by  bjung 
#1 · (Edited)
OK its the bottom of the ninth. Kids are grown...end of the careers is in site. You are approaching 60. You are looking for your very last sailboat. You have $250,000 to spend for the total ( outfitting included).

The cruising will be just you and your wife and the furthest you may go is 4-5 months at a time and to the Galapagos Islands from Annapolis Maryland. So north to Canada and South to Panama is the range. returning home to the Chesapeake most springs.

You have sailed for 30 years in proressively larger keel boats and have a older 35ft racer/ cruiser. You like performace sailing, but are willing to sacrifice some of the racing speed for comfort, but do not want to fall less than the 50% mark in terms of speed. You have done plenty of blue water sailing , but predominatly are a coastal cruiser now.

What would you buy and why?
 
#5 ·
According to the criteria Chef gave, I already bought my last boat a decade ago! My 'last boat criteria' is: approaching mid-seventies, balance, vision and hearing not what they used to be. Kids don't give a damn about the boat. Want to sell the house and downsize to a condo or apartment. Pilothouse motor sailor? Cruising catamaran? Or swallow hard and get a trawler yacht? Decisions, decisions...
 
#7 ·
Hey Chef,

If I pick out your personal experience/qualifications, which don't limit you, I'm left with $250k, predominantly coastal cruising, and not a full on racer, but fast enough.

Can you give us any more? That seems to qualify every boat under $250k that doesn't sail like it was dragging an anchor. It might even help if you describe what you mean by comfort. Do you want max room down below or in the cockpit, or are you looking for some creature comforts, like A/C and a requisite genset locker.
 
#10 ·
Hey Chef,

If I pick out your personal experience/qualifications, which don't limit you, I'm left with $250k, predominantly coastal cruising, and not a full on racer, but fast enough.

Can you give us any more? That seems to qualify every boat under $250k that doesn't sail like it was dragging an anchor. It might even help if you describe what you mean by comfort. Do you want max room down below or in the cockpit, or are you looking for some creature comforts, like A/C and a requisite genset locker.
Protected Rudder
No full keel
No volvo engine
Sailplan including either two head furlers or detachable forestay
V berth and at least a double aft berth
Safe U shaped galley
24000 lbs or more
Lead Keel
AC and genset ( or room for one)
Espar heater
Comfortable salon plan for 2- no curved settes
Foreward facing Nav station
Top and front facing refeer and freezer
2 propane lockers
Davits or avaialability to install them
55 or greater HP engine no more than 2500 hrs
Dual racor filtering
Good windlass
Solar Panels
720 ah elctrical dc
Good inverter and battery monitor- can be added
Good charplotter- can be added
hearty autopilot- can be added
Good engine acccess on all sides
40 gallon holding tank with Y valve and mascerator
At least 8 opening ports
At least 4 opening hatches
Wood not lalminate interior
Little wood trim topside
Sailing abiliity phrf abive 50% of similar boats to windward
Draft 6 ft
Mast height less than 63 feet

Thats a lot of specs....hahha I am picky thats what has taken me so long.

It will only be my wife and I so only one head is fine. Salon must be comfortable for hanginkg out and reading in. Could be barrel chairs like older Bristols

The boats that have interested us have been Mason 44, Hans Chrisian Christina 43, bistol 41.1 and 45.5. Saga 43. But maybe there are others out there thats why I am asking. I am not afraid of older boats if in good condition as good boats last 60 years at least.
 
#11 ·
Nordic 44 is an interesting boat. I like more wood and it doesnt look as comfortable in the cabin, but I know they are well made. How do they sail?
 
#14 · (Edited)
As new a Sabre 362 as you can afford to buy and keep 20-30% for refiit/modernization.

Fast, lots of teak down below (even has cedar lined hanging lockers, comfortable for cruising, even has a COMPLETE ICW friendly mast height below 55' - so it can do the Julia Tuttle and other bridges on the ICW.
 
#15 ·
Dave,
Quit describing my boat and just go out and buy one (or rather 2.5 with that budget).

Seriously, the Irwin 43 CC fits everything you have on that list - and my 38 CC does
except for the 55 HP engine (it's a 44), the wood trim topsides, and my 38 is 4k lighter.

And yes, I see the "no full keel" - define "full keel", mines a shoal draft long keel :)

BTW - the Mason 44 has a longer keel than the Irwin, and the rudder mounted to it, so just toss that out a 'no full keel'. It's also got more wood topsides.

My Irwin 38 CC with a PHRF of 126 (New England - PHRF New England - Handicapping - Base Handicaps) is well within the top 50% of similar boats.

and compares well with your PHRF of 123 - in the same region.
Keep in mind PHRF is a factor of all points of sail :)

Besides, you know once your wife sees my aft cabin you are sunk, screwed and tattoo'd; you'll be getting a center cockpit :)
 
#19 ·
Ha...you are funny. I like the boat you are getting and would consider it in the next size up.

I guess this summer we will have to see if you new boat will keep up with our 35 old girl loaded with attachments. I am suspect to the Irwin speed and pointing ability, although I know they are not slow boats. No doubt the 38 Irwin has a great amount of room for its size below and some great advantages.

I like the Mason 44 living accomadations and the fact the engine is under the floor. It also is a rear cockpit which I kind of prefer, but am not married to it.

Its all a trade off.
 
#16 ·
I vote for a C&C 35 :D

* seriously, when I was in the business, it was routine for an older couple with a boat they knew like the back of their hands that had been perfected over decades of ownerhsip to sell it and get a big boat with every comfort known to man and then wonder why it was 20 times harder to get into a slip and 100 times harder to keep running.
 
#20 ·
Understand Joje....but we have the 35 C&C MKIII and I have loved it for over 15 years now and I want something a little heavier for the trades as well as a protected rudder.

Dave
 
#24 ·
I'm thinking about the perfect answer. :)

However, why sweat the protected rudder for predominantly coastal cruising? Not sure if half skeg, full skeg, etc qualifies. You could add a monitor wind vane with emergency rudder to your re-fit and reopen the faster spade rudder market. Just a thought.
 
#25 ·
Yes Ive thought about that. Just the spade rudders are so exposed and all it would take is one coral head andit gets broken. I have one now and love the performace you get out of it, but it only sits about 8 inches shortertha the keel if that.
 
#28 ·
Given your considerations I'd recommend either a Passport or a Gran Soleil. I've spent a fair amount of time on offshore trips on variations of both. The Passport will get you around the world with a bit less "performance" than your C&C and the Gran Soleil will give you a bit more performance than the Passport. Good boats both.
 
#29 · (Edited)
They are a little hard to find this side of the pond ... but have you looked at all at the Moody line? They sail pretty well, are built stout, and have eye-popping interior room. Hands down the best heads in the game, & true galley kitchens you can cook in at sea. Here's the layout of the Moody 36:



And here is the 38CC. You can find them in good shape for $150k. Average to above average sailers.

ETA: Looks like they came standard with Volvos, tho. Have to look for one that has been repowered, or budget for a nice Yanmar. :)
 
#31 ·
I think the Passport 40 (V berth layout) fits your bill with the only serious exception is the forward facing nav table.

There are a variety of layouts, however, we've spent some time on the V berth layout version with the full U shaped dinette, my wife and I used the aft cabin, it was fine. Even has an under-seat 'ensuite' head... Galley is pretty impressive, rock solid under way, skeg, long fin, goes nicely to weather too - surprisingly so I thought.

Either way the one thing you're going to give up/miss when losing the C&C, esp if you don't modify the rudder requirement, is the ability to back into slips and fairways.... IMO that's not a minor issue, esp if stopping at a lot of unfamiliar marinas along the way.
 
  • Like
Reactions: chef2sail
#34 ·
My dock neighbor is selling his passport 40 that seems to meet many of your criteria and is comfortably in your price point: 1989 Passport 40 AC Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com He's generally cared for the boat well, selling due to health issues.

if you look closely at one of the pix of the boat in its slip, you'll see us next door under the shrink wrap :)
 
#35 ·
Interesting, that listing is the same layout as the one we've been on, except the engine sits higher in the boat.. hence the large engine box/table that makes the dinette an "L" rather than a "U". The Perkins on our friends' sits low enough to be under the dinette seat - I'm guessing engine access is better here.

This listing is also missing the 'eyebrow trim' on the cabin top - that's a plus (difficult to keep looking nice) The only other thing I generally don't like is the tiled countertops, but the rest looks pretty nice. You could do a lot worse, Dave...;)
 
#46 ·
OK its the bottom of the ninth. Kids are grown...end of the careers is in site. You are approaching 60. You are looking for your very last sailboat. You have $250,000 to spend for the total ( outfitting included).

The cruising will be just you and your wife and the furthest you may go is 4-5 months at a time and to the Galapagos Islands from Annapolis Maryland. So north to Canada and South to Panama is the range. returning home to the Chesapeake most springs.

You have sailed for 30 years in proressively larger keel boats and have a older 35ft racer/ cruiser. You like performace sailing, but are willing to sacrifice some of the racing speed for comfort, but do not want to fall less than the 50% mark in terms of speed. You have done plenty of blue water sailing , but predominatly are a coastal cruiser
What would you buy and why?
Bermuda 40 :)

 
#47 ·
Chef, I have somewhere in the neighborhood of 5,000nm on a Nordic 44. I've been told that they are the "Sabre" of the west coast and each boat contains a large amount of customization in the interior. I have mixed opinions on the usefulness of a skeg hung rudder. The skeg is mounted in the same fashion as a fin keel (un-encapsulated). The bolt pattern is only about two inches between lateral bolts which is insufficient strength to hold the assembly stiff while beam reaching in quartering seas or running in a major cross-wave. We had rudder issues on the Pac Cup race. Feel free to ask any detailed questions you like as I have lots of experience on the boat.

Surfing on the way to Hawaii (3/4 oz runner kite is flying)


The Nordic 44 is good enough to win second place to Hawaii!


Unfortunately, everything on the Nordic is considerably bigger.
 
#51 ·
You might take a look at the Niagara 42. Ticks most of the boxes on your list. Very well built, faster than you'd suspect, roomy, undeniably pretty, and a great motion underway. Buy a great one for 140k, a few upgrades, and cruise for 2 years on the balance of your 250k budget.
yachtworld.com/boats/1986/Niagara-42-Sloop-2484204/Picton/Canada
Or buy a new one from Bruckman Yachts for 600k
 
#53 ·
I haven't read the whole thread to see if it has been mentioned, but I would like to suggest a J40 or J42. It has many of the features you want except it has 2 heads (I use the aft head as FWG and harness locker when underway) and laminate below, which I personally much prefer to the standard teak cave, but that's personal choice. The Js are fast and very seaworthy and have a great galley. Take a look at one.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top