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  #11  
Old 02-27-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

C42 has an almost perfect layout for a couple cruising, pretty good tankage, and an attractive price. I would gladly cruise one in the Caribbean. I do not think it is in any way the wrong boat.
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  #12  
Old 02-27-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Davidpm,
I bought my boat (Beneteau 400, 2 cabin, 2 head) with the same premise that you have 3 years ago. It was a fire sale. The owner had to sell. I got a good deal with some good tankage. It's a nice coastal cruiser and should easily handle light blue water. Plenty cross the big blue all the time. Regardless what people say about Beneteau's; i have found this boat to be a very well built and solid. The factory wiring still looks new after 20 years.
I'm slowly replacing everything that i need to. 5 more years and i'll be retired and gone. I'll have 30 yrs of service and be 51.

Keep looking and start now. Your not getting any younger.
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  #13  
Old 02-27-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
My problem is that unless someone has replaced everything big: Engine, wiring, tanks, plumbing, thru-hulls, bottom barrier coat, canvas, sails, Air etc. standing rigging, chain-plates etc. I see an older boat as a musical chair event.

What I mean is that you have components that are 5 to 30 years old. At the moment you buy the boat the survey says it is all working. If you can sail the boat for a couple years, not put too much money into it you can sell for about what you paid for.

But the odds being what they are something will have to go.

That is fine if it a weekend boat.
  • I wouldn't be using it that much so maybe nothing will break.
  • I'm in my home waters where I know where the rocks are and know the people that can fix what I break.
  • I have the money to pay them and I have a garage full of tools and parts.
  • I might plan on keeping the boat for 10 years or more so any repairs or upgrades are amortized over a long period of time.

If however I'm retired and cruising for a few years I'm not sure I want to be the guy left standing when the music stops in some strange town or country.
Which is exactly why a well maintained GOB in the $50-$80 K range makes a whole lot of sense. It leaves you a much, much, much, bigger cruising kitty then a $200K boat, so repairs in foreign lands don't hurt nearly as much.

If you really think a 5 year old production boat will not need rigging work, sail work, systems work, during your cruising life, you're dreaming. Every boat needs maintenance, and if you figure the life expectancy of systems is 10 years, then a five year old boat will need every system renewed in the next five years. You are already $200K deep in purchasing the boat, so your kitty is that much shallower.
OTOH, a well maintained 30 year old boat which has had systems updated five years ago will need the same work in five years as well.....
but you are $120,000 to $150,000 ahead of the game already. that buys a lot of maintenance, a lot of marina time, hell, if worse comes to worse it buys another couple of golden oldy boats before you equal the investment you have made in the newer old boat.
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  #14  
Old 02-27-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

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Originally Posted by Bene505 View Post
Why not that option? Retired means more time than money, right? And you can set it up the way you like it.

Plus it's fun to work on the boat and make upgrades and plans. And there are more boats in that category for a good price.

Regards,
Brad
I happen to know how old you are. I was at your birthday party last year. So I know that you are over 10 years younger than me.
One of the other disadvantages of old age is that because of doing projects over the years you have a much more accurate idea of how long it will take to do stuff and how much it will cost.
Now if I could convince myself that if put in a couple years of hard work I would have actually saved even 50k I would be sorely tempted. But the reality is that most people are lucky to get back 10% of the material cost if they do all the work themselves, and 0% of the value of their labor.

Now if you don't have the money it is a great strategy to invest the money and time into it for 2 to 5 years for a full refit. It is a savings plan and the money goes directly into the boat and you now know all about the boat.

It is all about managing risk. If you just work extra hours for several years and collect a cruising kitty the risk is that you will use the money for something else.

If you can come up with the money but choose to spend years working on a boat the risk is that you will run out of life before the boat is done.

Once you hit 60 that running out of life thing becomes more real.
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Old 02-27-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones View Post
Which is exactly why a well maintained GOB in the $50-$80 K range makes a whole lot of sense. It leaves you a much, much, much, bigger cruising kitty then a $200K boat, so repairs in foreign lands don't hurt nearly as much.

If you really think a 5 year old production boat will not need rigging work, sail work, systems work, during your cruising life, you're dreaming. Every boat needs maintenance, and if you figure the life expectancy of systems is 10 years, then a five year old boat will need every system renewed in the next five years. You are already $200K deep in purchasing the boat, so your kitty is that much shallower.
OTOH, a well maintained 30 year old boat which has had systems updated five years ago will need the same work in five years as well.....
but you are $120,000 to $150,000 ahead of the game already. that buys a lot of maintenance, a lot of marina time, hell, if worse comes to worse it buys another couple of golden oldy boats before you equal the investment you have made in the newer old boat.
I totally agree with you in theory.
If I can find such a boat I will be sorely tempted but in my experience every boat I have seen that has had a refit has covered only some of the needed items.
There were always original items or items that were refitted poorly. For example in the book "The boy behind the gate" the boat had a brand new engine that had to be rebuilt after only one year because the exhaust hose was too small and it took about 6 mechanics to find the problem.

But you are right I could easily out fox myself and get a boat that the original owner did nothing to and I buy it just before everything needs refreshing.
I guess one solution is to buy it 3.5 years before that happens and and sell it in 3 years.
It really feels like musical chairs to me. The boat surveys well with a 30 year old engine that seems to be OK. You through a rod and now it is in 5 seconds worth 20k less. Oops the music stopped.
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  #16  
Old 02-28-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Somebody was recently selling a well done up Kelly Peterson 44 on another thread for 105K. Suggest you look a little harder, stop worrying about what you might get out of it at the end. You still got a lot of life left, get out and enjoy it while you can....Plus you'll get so bored out here you'll be looking for projects to do!
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  #17  
Old 02-28-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

For what you want to do, a C400 or 420 is fine. If you are concerned about tankage, add a watermaker, and some diesel jerry cans and you are good. You can go anywhere in the Bahamas and the Caribbean without having to make a run of more than 150 miles. That's basically 1 overnight passage. Island hopping is the best part if you have the time. You could manage that in any boat as long as you watch the weather carefully. Also, Fuel and water are available everywhere, carrying more is convenient, but not a necessity.
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Old 02-28-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Ive been on new boats and things break or dont work, wire connectors that have problems and need to be traced down and fixed, exhaust fitting cracks. If you think you can buy any boat and not have to continually work on it you are mistaken. All boats even new boats are a continual work in progress.
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  #19  
Old 02-28-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Obviously, you know what will work best for you. But I'm with the crowd that advocates buying an older boat and save the money. There are a ton of boats available right now--I just got a good deal on a boat that I wouldn't hesitate to take to the Caribbean after a couple of additions.

I am surprised you're that worried about breaking down. A new boat is still going to have problems; boats break. That's what keeps many of my friends in bread and rum. After all, the definition of cruising is fixing your boat in a series of exotic ports.

One good reason I can think of to not worry about the boat breaking down (bearing in mind that you have a bunch extra in the bank to cover hiring someone) is that you get to meet the locals and through them get an "in" into the local culture and really get to make friends with them. It's a pretty cool thing. And it's another thing that separates we travelers from tourists.

Of course it's all a matter of how you want to approach problems, too. You're cruising; what's your hurry? Or as they say in the islands, "Soon come, mon."

My budget is a fraction of yours, but even it wasn't, I suspect I'd have settled on about the same boat. Personally, I'd go nuts just sitting around munching on lotuses all day!

All the above being said, you're you and I'm me, and you know what's best for you.
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Old 02-28-2013
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Re: Make do with wrong boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Burton View Post
Obviously, you know what will work best for you. But I'm with the crowd that advocates buying an older boat and save the money. There are a ton of boats available right now--I just got a good deal on a boat that I wouldn't hesitate to take to the Caribbean after a couple of additions.
I like your style. And it's not like I really have enough money to do what I was talking about without liquidating retirement funds, not smart either.

So what did you buy and what condition is it in and if you don't mind what did you pay?
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