Insurance and Survey Recommendations

[otaga05]

I recently had a boat surveyed and while the surveyor was very pleased with the overall condition of the boat he made a list of recommendations. All of them are relatively minor issues, that I intend to address in the fullness of time, the majority of them right away. Updating the flare kit is not a problem installing placards is not a problem, servicing fire extinguishers is not a problem, etc. When applying for insurance I have had two insurance companies insist that all recommendations be addressed before they will write the policy. There are several difficulties with this. The boat has yet to pass her sea trials which are a condition for acceptance of the vessel. According to the terms of my P&S no modifications can be made to the boat prior to acceptance.

In a nutshell, since I don't own the boat I can't fix anything substantial until after I purchase her.

The other problem is that some of the recommendations really have no bearing on the insurability of the boat. For example, the boat does not have a tachometer. The surveyor recommended installing one. A good idea, I'll do it eventually, but not a good reason not to insure the boat. The engine does not have an hour meter - ditto. The surveyor found some minor elevation in water levels in the decks in a few places although the decks are otherwise solid and exhibit no delamination. He recommended removing nearby hardware, drying out the deck and rebedding. He recommended verbally that I do this over the winter as is normal practice for this sort of issue. Drying out the moisture is not something that can be really be done effectively in the next two weeks prior to the sea trials! He recommended that I repair some cracks in the gelcoat and install a liquid level indicator in the holding tank. Again, good ideas, I will take care of them promptly after purchase but really of no significance to an insurance company.

I ranted a bit at the broker and asked her to point out to the insurance company the absurdity of what they were requiring and to see if they were willing to be a bit more reasonable. But I have not heard back yet.

Any advice on how to handle this situation or avoid running into the same problems again with other insurance companies would be greatly appreciated.

[sailingdog]

You really need a different insurance company. None of the issues that you've mentioned is really a danger to the well-being of safety of the boat.

The Fire Extinguishers and Flares are basically normal maintenance items IMHO. The placards are needed for USCG compliance.

The hour meter and tachometer aren't going to affect how the engine works or how safe it is to any significant degree. It might affect your ability to keep a proper maintenance schedule and make it a bit more difficult to judge how hard you're pushing the engine, but that's about it.

The slight wetness in the deck needs to be addressed and repaired properly, but isn't an immediate threat to the boat or its well-being IMHO. Same with the gelcoat and the holding tank.

Contact Christine Hartge over at Hartge Insurance.

Hartge Insurance Associates
P.O. Box 250
Galesville, MD 20765
Phone: 1 (800) 999-5251/410 867-6666
Fax: 410 867-6664

[chrisn586]

I recently had the same situation with the insurers of our new boat. In the end I just gave in and signed off that all recomendations regardless of how insignificant had been completed. They did not request reciepts. So now the pressure is on to get after those little problems quickly and hope that there are no related claims in my future. I've never had a claim, but I'm sure that they'll be keeping my survey and sign off in hopes of not paying if I ever do have a problem.
Chris

[DLM]

I had the same situation. The issues that were involved in the survey had nothing to do with how seaworthy the boat was....yet I couldn't get it insured. Still haven't.... I really didn't care about the boat all I was concerned about was the liability....

[sailingdog]

Originally Posted by chrisn586

I recently had the same situation with the insurers of our new boat. In the end I just gave in and signed off that all recomendations regardless of how insignificant had been completed. They did not request reciepts. So now the pressure is on to get after those little problems quickly and hope that there are no related claims in my future. I've never had a claim, but I'm sure that they'll be keeping my survey and sign off in hopes of not paying if I ever do have a problem.
Chris

I would recommend not doing this, as you're basically lying to the insurance company. If you're ever caught doing so, you're gonna get screwed royally for it.

[canadianseamonkey]

Tell those insurance companies to take a hike. There are thousands of insurance companies that will welcome your business. A tach has nothing to do with the safety of your vessel. Can you imagine if you ever had to make a claim with either of those companies? I have great service from a company called Lloyds of London here in Canada. Not sure where you are, but make some calls. Good luck.

[chrisn586]

I don't recomend doing what I did; I'm only relating a similar situation and my temporary solution. As soon as possible all of the surveyors recomendations will be addressed. Most of those recomendations could not result in a loss any way.

[blt2ski]

You have a problem, I had a few things like that, and just said when my time line to fix the problems were. IE the fire extinguisher, flares etc were done soon after buying, new bottom paint, again when it was pulled, I had new paint after survey was done.

THere were a few otherthings, as in the headliner was falling down, ok, so it took 18 months or so to finish....they sent me notes every 3-4 months or so, I then said what was done etc. The only thing left, is teh cutlass bearing was slighty loose, and even the surveyer said he had to list it, but if it was his boat, he would worry about it the next haul out, being as the motor is only goin 2000-2500 rpms or so. If it would have been a 10K rpm deep vee ocean racer, another story.

SOmething is not right here, they are being a bit to strict!

marty

[Faster]

We had a similar situation on the last purchase we made - the insurer (whom we'd used for the previous decade or more) insisted on all recommendations being completed within 30 days - ordinarily not bad but this was in November and some of the jobs (resealing windows, for instance) I considered warm weather chores.

They did not budge and in the end we went to another carrier, but ended up at a higher rate.

[yotphix]

When I faced the same sort of situation on a large motor yacht which had employed me as engineer I opened a dialogue directly with the insurer and kept them decided with them which items were critical and dealt with those immediately. The balance of the recommendations wer dealt with over the following several months as we cruised the Bahamas. As long as I was upfront with them and kept them informed they seemed to feel sure that their concerns were being taken seriously and they were only too happy to take the money!