a boat as an investment

[webd71]

Ok, the title of this tread is a bit of an oxymoron but wouldn’t be nice if one could justify the purchase of new capable sailing vessel in the 38 to 42 vicinity as one could that of a new home?

Sorry for the looonng sentence.

It seems to me that few folks would face ridicule if they took some $200K burning a hole in their checkbook and used it to buy a single family home even if they already had one of those whatchumacallits.

Now tell someone you know (those of us landlubbers) that you are considering to purchase and move to a new 38 or 42footer for the same $ amount and some are apt to call the loony wagon on ya.
My ex told me I was a very dangerous man, because I am intelligent and crazier than a coon dog for even considering the heathen thought.

Yes I know the cruising lifestyle has less to do with logic than it does with passion, but it sure would be nice to have some good old fashion "gee it makes sense" in our camp.

So, to the question part. Are there any purely economical benefits in living on the water, other of course than saving on property taxes?

If one were to decide to sell after, say 10 years, could one at least break even assuming proper care and maintenance were lavished on the vessel?

Boats considered: New **hanse** 37-41, Dehler same length, used Nauticat 35-38.
Purchase type: Cash on hand, secure loan if it made more sense.

Any thoughts out there?

Mike

[paulk]

Buying a boat might be better to compare to trip to Las Vegas than buying a second house. People need a house (or someplace) to live in. And you can always live in it yourself if you have to. Living on a boat can be a hassle. (Think shoveling snow off the deck so you can go to the laundromat. ) People don''t NEED pleasure boats, so the re-sale is always iffy. Some boats are less iffy on re-sale than others - as is some real estate. But added to the risks of real estate ownership: theft, flood, vandalism, fire -- on a boat you have all the risks of a vehicle - running into things or having them run into you - AND sinking at any time because a $0.45 hose clamp lets go, or a dried-out hose splits. A 10-year old boat will have a lot of chances to not re-sell anywhere near its purchase price. But think of the fun you can have finding out if you are one of the lucky ones!

[jbarros]

The trip to Las Vegas is an apt analagy.

You may recover over 50% of your original purchase price on the boat itself, but just right off all the dockage, maintenance, extras, insurance, gas, etc.

also, seeing as your a land lubber, you may want to try kicking around in a little 20 foot day sailer first, as many sailors have found, the more systems and the more size a boat has, the more the worry, and the less the time on the water. and if you blow $2,000 on a well found 20 foot sloop, you will most likley get most of it back when you resell it.

-- James

[johngov.]

I once bought a Bristol 22'' in 1976 for $5,000 and was offered $8,000 in 1984. I think those days are gone.
Quality though always retains its value. You may have to reach the right buyer but if you don''t over-pay and you buy quality it will retain its value.
Just my thoughts. John Gov.

[Fishboat]

webd,

I think one of the larger things working the wrong way in your theory/desire is your repeated use of the word "new". Buying new automatically locks you into a big $$ hit when resale time comes. Now if you consider a well found, in demand, popular, "previously sailed" boat, then you''ll be a little closer to what you''re looking for..if it''s out there.

Does anyone have access or knowledge of where to get accurate asking or selling prices of particular boats over time (last 5-10 years)? I''m guessing brokers may have access to ABOS books...are there any other sources? (webd...if you had this info it would be a good start)

[Jeff_H]

I would never say that buying a boat, especially a new boat, is a worthwhile investment if it is solely analyzed based on the relative merits of buying a primary residence which is a house vs buying a boat of equal price.

That said if you buy a boat carefully, maintain it well, and use it a lot, the numbers may be closer than you think. If I think that I spend roughly 200 to 400 hours a year out sailing and cruising and I compare that to the cost of almost any other form of amusement then the $2000 to $3000 that I spend a year on my boat becomes pretty much of a bargain.

I generally try to buy used boats that are in solid condition and which are essentially good boats but which for one reason or another is priced slightly below the marketplace. I have bought some boats quite cheaply in my day but few have been a ''steal''. I have sold most of the boats that I have owned pretty much for what I had in them and a few for a small profit if you did not factor in sweat equity.

As a general rule, new boats are a really bad deal from an economics standpoint, because there are a lot of hidden costs to commissioning a boat that can easily equal 10-15% of the purchase price of a boat and which no one is willing to pay for at resale time. What appears to be a modest depreciation in the asking price is often just the tip of the iceberg.

Of the boats that you mention, I am a fan of the Dehlers. I also suggest that you look at Beneteau First series (which have held their values quite well)and if you have your heart set on a new boat then the Elans.

Respectfully,
Jeff

[webd71]

Any thoughts on the Hanse Jeff?
It seems to be rigged right pretty much out of the box, fast hull, sweeeet interior.

Price also seems to be not out in left field.
Wonder why we don''t hear more about this capable struddel.

Danka
Mike

[Jeff_H]

I basically like the Hanse 37. I have had a little time around them. I was up close and personal with the sail lockers installing some cleats for an upcoming hurricane. The glass work looks well done and they seem like they would be decent sailing boats. It was very light winds when I was aboard and we did not try to sail other than to send up an assymetrical for giggles. There were a lot of details that I liked and a few that were not my cup of tea but isn''t that always the way. I would not expect a brand new Hanse to be a great investment, But it would be a nice boat.

Regards
Jeff

[richard_reinhart]

No, you won''t make money selling a boat 5 or 10 years from now if you buy it new today. Back in the 1970s and 1980s maybe you could buy a new or used boat and THINK you were selling it for more than you paid for it because of rampant price inflation but those days are gone.

Boats aren''t really investments; they''re depreciating assets that take a fair sum of time or money to keep up. I don''t want to sound too glum about this, but go into ownership with your eyes open. I love my little boat, but I keep fastidious records of what it costs to own and I''m frankly shocked when I add it up from time to time.

Jeff is right that you need to make a careful purchase. Boats that need sails or other major purchases quickly become a serious financial drain.

[cassycc36]

I made money on a sailboat once, but I got a really good deal with it to begin with, (Hunter 212), it was in really nice shape, the orig. owners never used it and I only sailed it for a year.