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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest Forums > Destinations > Caribbean
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Caribbean East and West and including the big islands and the east coast of Central America and Northern littoral of S. America


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  #21  
Old 06-03-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
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No system is perfect, but ours allows us to vote for representation that will change what we don't like. It may be slower than some like, but there is little doubt in my mind that the embargo will eventually be lifted. Until then, you follow the law.

As food for thought, the more people that travel to Cuba correctly, in the light of day, the more obvious it will become to politicians that this may be important. Those that sneak, do so in the dark and are never heard.

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  #22  
Old 06-04-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

"Until then, you follow the law."
A good citizen, someone who has earned their right to vote, and arguably the everyday patriot, does not necessarily follow the law at any or all times.
One learns the law, appraises it, and then makes decisions about it. Even speed limits are actually set according to the speed where xx% of the motorist will violate them.
Thoreau's "On Civil Disobedience" might be required reading along with the more recent history of mass civil disobedience in the US in the 60's/70's.

One boater sneaking into Cuba? Might be called a fool. A flotilla of two or three thousand, would cause all the exiles in Little Habana to die of apoplexy and just might bring the debate back into Congress.

Doesn't seem like there's all that many folks looking to force the issue though.
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  #23  
Old 06-04-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

If your standard for Civil Disobedience is to facilitate vacation travel, then ours are very different. Sailing to Cuba is not on the same level as Rosa Parks.

The embargo itself will not be influenced by a bunch of rich boaters heading off for a lovely vacation.
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  #24  
Old 06-04-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

That depends, Minne. In the 70's a lot of anti-Vietnam demonstrations had the simple goal of shutting down state and federal government activities. When 200 protestors show up at a Federal Building in a county seat and are told they cannot go inside, they sit down on the steps. Oops, no one is allowed in or out, the government is effectively shut down for the day. Gets the FBI really PO'd, too. And it takes time to load 200 "dead weight" protestors peaceably into paddy wagons.

Now let's suppose 500 documented vessels, which by law are empowered to carry mail, come back from Havana. Each carrying one piece of mail and, according to the law, they all sail back to Miami to bring it to a Post Office before making any other stops, inclduing stops for the USCG or Customs. As the USC expressly provides.

Where's the line going to start, and what else will overload and break down in the process?

Can't get 500? OK, how about 200? Got a Customs' dock big enough to raft up 200 boats? Got enough ICS men to walk it? Wanna see Al Sharpton (pick a name) show up saying it is illegal to detain those boaters just because you don't have enough inspectors?

Point being, civil disobedience can still work when the voting booths don't. But it requires large numbers of participants, not just a couple of boats wanting a new view every month.

One definition of a democracy is that it is a place where the minority get screwed. (Used to be the guy who came in second for Presidency became the Vice, but that didn't work out.) Well, it is a tiny minority that want to visit Cuba, but if they use a little imagination and read the rules--there are legal ways to do that too. Heck, you can even become a tour operator and make a buck at it.

Probably should turn this into another "make money while you are cruising" thread!
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Old 06-04-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

My point wasn't about how you would do it, it was what you are doing it for.

You would suggest a "protest flotilla" because people who are in the top quartile of wealth in this country aren't allowed to sail their boats to vacation in Cuba? Recall that half the voting population doesn't make enough money to pay income taxes, let alone own a boat. By definition, all boat owners are wealthy.

That just doesn't have the moral cache of kids dying in war or segregated buses.
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Old 07-08-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

Its not about United Fruit anymore....Everyone knows the USA created Castro.

Its about South Florida Republcian Votes.
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Old 07-08-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

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Sailing to Cuba is not on the same level as Rosa Parks. The embargo itself will not be influenced by a bunch of rich boaters heading off for a lovely vacation.
Actually, I think the mail idea is both clever, and could well work to bring the debate back into play.
And no, this isn't a Rosa Parks issue, not unless you consider the 423 Cubans jailed as dissidents - in the month of May alone.
The embargo hasn't worked. It's only served to provide phony justification for Castro's claim that Cubans are poor because of the US.
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Old 07-08-2012
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

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What on earth is the administration afraid of here?
looking foolish.
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Re: Sponsored travel to Cuba

I meant to add to my last post - Minne's remark about "rich" boaters. I don't think many of us consider ourselves 'rich', at least not in monetary terms. Maybe in our life experience, but that's another thread, isn't it?
The majority of boaters I met in Cuba were everyday folk, average boats, retirement incomes, people taking time away from careers even. Yes, there were several megayachts while I was in Havana, but you find those everywhere. I certainly didn't see any Super Maramu on any of my visits...
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