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Cruising with CPAP

14K views 51 replies 21 participants last post by  TakeFive 
#1 ·
I seem to remember that a while ago there was some discussion around using a CPAP machine afloat. My wife and I are going to charter a sailing vessel this summer, and she says "CPAP or fish food - you decide".

So, im looking for advice and recommendations from anyone presently sailing with apnea? What kind of device are you using? Can a typical boats battery bank support a CPAP machine? Ive seen some smaller battery powered machines advertised - anyone had any experience with them?
 
#3 ·
"Can a typical boats battery bank support a CPAP machine? "
As Scotty said. You'll need to do your homework, and find out how much power *your* machine draws. And then confirm with the charter company that the specific boat you are looking at, has the capacity to run that, with an adequate safety margin/reserve in case the batteries aren't in perfect condition. The bigger the boat, the more likely it will have a bigger battery bank and more reserve capacity.
You might consider something like a very portable lithium battery pack:
TracerPower.com Tracer 12V 24Ah LiFePO4 Battery Pack
Not at all cheap, and if there is air travel involved, it may need to be in your carry-on, but something like that should be able to ensure you don't have power worries.
 
#7 ·
My house batteries consist of 4 T-105s for a total of 500 ampere hours, plus I also have a big start battery that I can add to the power supply. So, in my case, no worries. I guess if you have a small boat and running on a single battery, well, that could be a problem.

Gary :cool:
 
#8 ·
My CPAP device is capable of running on an optional Lithium-ion battery pack that will run up to 13 hours on a four-hour charge. One would probably rather die in their sleep than pay the $500 they're asking for it though, unless the insurance company can be convinced it's necessary and will pick up the tab.
 
#9 · (Edited)
Without the humidifier, my Philips uses about 7 Ah per night. You don't need an inverter, the device runs directly off 12V. I have a cord that plugs into a cigarette lighter-type outlet.

I do also have a 20 Ah battery for camping, but there is no need for it on the boat.

Power usage mainly relates to pressure. Mine is set to 13. Not sure of the units - is it mm of mercury?

Humidifiers use a lot of power, so you'll have to forego that if you normally use one.
 
#11 ·
My wife and I both use Resmed machines. They sell a DC converter (about 90$) which means you don't have to use an inverter. They simply plug into a 12v receptacle. Without the humidifier they use about 5-6 amps per evening apiece. Most battery banks will easily accomodate that load. If you use an inverter you will use up to ten times that many amps.
 
#13 ·
"My battery pack is a 20 Ah sealed lead acid type that cost $300. "
Medical grade acid approved by Ken Kesey, to be sure. The 20Ah AGM battery is worth $20. $60 at the local overpriced battery franchise store.
So they put it in a $250 bespoke case with Swarovski crystals on the logo?
Right, medical grade.
 
#17 · (Edited)
We're heading to the Grenadines in early March for advanced sailing school. My CPAP only draws about 7 watts dry (70 watts with humidifier), and runs off a 12v power brick, so it should be easy to power (under 5Ah per night). Note that others could have very different power draw due to different models of CPAP and different pressure settings.

However, I've developed a lot of experience powering CPAP off of 12v batteries, and things are sometimes a little more complicated than expected. I have had problems powering off a 12v adapter on 3 different boats (my old 25' boat with group 24 battery, my friend's boat with large, brand new 4D banks, and a charter boat) using two different model of CPAP device. In each case, it appeared that the voltage dropped too much during the initial surge of startup current to get the blower running. Once started up, it was fine, but it sometimes needed a boost by starting up the motor alternator or other unusual means to get it going. It seems that the problem does not have anything to do with the battery capacity, but instead with the long wire run from battery to outlet causing the voltage drop.

I've written elsewhere about using a jump starter on my own boat, which results in a much shorter wire run that leads to flawless operation. But that device will be very inconvenient for air travel due to large bulk and unnecessary air compressor that's built into it. So I started hunting around for an economical solution. Face it, portable batteries are not "rocket science" and so-called "medical grade" batteries are basically a scam. And the jump starter that I have been using is basically just a SLA battery with nice case (and worthless compressor) around it.

I found a workable solution inside one of my UPSs in my house. It has a 12v-12Ah SLA battery inside, which I happened to replace about a year ago (so I know it's still in good shape). It has F2 connectors on it, so I took a Battery Tender harness that I have lying around, clipped off the ring terminals, and spliced on the appropriate connectors. In testing it, it drops down to about 70% charge after one night of use, and was successfully recharged by my car's alternator by attaching a double-headed 12v pigtail for a couple hours. This simulates how I would charge from the sailboat's battery bank, although without the motor running it may take longer to charge.

So here are the components of my system - I had all of them lying around the house or on the boat:


I'll continue to test out these items this winter. But I wanted to show that you can put together something that is perfectly workable for under $50. I've attached a picture that shows the setup.

I could search for a Lithium battery of similar capacity which would be lighter weight, but they're getting a bad reputation for air travel and according to FAA would need special permission of the airline for the needed 101-160 watt hour capacity. Plus, all it takes is one airline incident between now and my departure to change everything immediately.
 

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#18 ·
Wife and I both have resperonics dream machines. On our boat no issue as we carry 720 ah and each machine uses an average of 10-12 ah per 8 hours. Start up is 5 amps. We've never had an issue with the cigarette plug.

I do a fair amount of traveling for work and have never had an issue really or need to jury rig anything. Resperonics has good adapters for less than $50.

We have the 12 volt adaptors for our upcoming 10 day trio to the Windwards . We also have very liteweight rechargeable 40 amp small battery packs with alligator clips to recharge if necessary. These give us 2-3 days on a charge.

We asked the charter company to provide us with an extra sealed battery to take on our charter to put in our stateroom. This way we don't have to lug a battery through customs or through the airport. Evidently it's a common request
 
#19 ·
We just run it off the inverter. The humidifier is not needed sailing since the air is usually humid enough.

Yes, there is a draw. Economize somewhere else if you need to. Turn lights off if your are not in a room. Go to bed at night and get up at dawn; I never understood sleeping in anyway. A waste of a nice morning. Priorities.
 
#20 · (Edited)
We just run it off the inverter. The humidifier is not needed sailing since the air is usually humid enough...
I was told that the charter boat for our cruise and learn is unlikely to have an inverter. And we don't know whether our cabin will even have a 12v outlet. Hence, I need to come prepared.

None of this is jury rigged. The battery and all cables are being used for exactly what they were designed to do, and everything is properly fused. If crimping a couple of terminals is jury rigging, then the whole boat is jury rigged.

I've had my CPAP fail to start over weekend cruises, and I suffered through it. A whole week without a working CPAP would keep my wife and others awake, and my impaired mental state would be a safety hazard for all aboard. So I want a solution that I can pre-test at home and bring with me 100% certain that it will work. If there's a 12v outlet or inverter, that's great. I'll have my battery as a backup in case the supplied power source has problems starting up my device.

The whole thing weighs in at 9.5 lb, and costs under $50. My cost is $0 because it happened to use components that I already had lying around. I'm describing it here for others to copy if they choose. I think it is particularly useful for chartering or camping, where the type and quality of power sources is questionable. If you have something you like better, that's great! If you can suggest something that is guaranteed to work better in my situation, I'm open to hearing about it. I have 2+ months to test it out.
 
#22 ·
Long-time CPAP, VPAP, and APAP user here. You may want to check with the CPAP manufacturer. I have found various machines were easier/harder to deal with in this regard. It seems that sometimes their electricity requirements are strangely specific, bringing sine waves and other aspects into the equation that I'd never heard of. I have found the manufacturers to be pretty helpful with deciphering their machine's specific requirements.
 
#23 ·
Hi Rick,

I've had a number of crew with CPAP machines. The biggest issue is 12, 19, or 24 VDC underlying power. It sounds like you have that part sorted.

It seems silly to me to convert 12 VDC to 117 VAC just to convert it back to 12 VDC. My solution has been to carry about 25' of 10 AWG duplex wire with big ring terminals to hook to the batteries (wherever they are) and whatever connection is needed at the CPAP end. Works a treat.

Doesn't hurt to get a gander at the batteries and make sure the water is topped up on a charter boat anyway.
 
#24 ·
Hi Rick,

I've had a number of crew with CPAP machines. The biggest issue is 12, 19, or 24 VDC underlying power. It sounds like you have that part sorted.

It seems silly to me to convert 12 VDC to 117 VAC just to convert it back to 12 VDC. My solution has been to carry about 25' of 10 AWG duplex wire with big ring terminals to hook to the batteries (wherever they are) and whatever connection is needed at the CPAP end. Works a treat.

Doesn't hurt to get a gander at the batteries and make sure the water is topped up on a charter boat anyway.
Dave, thanks for sharing your experience with this. I've finally gotten back to working on it.

I happen to have a 25 ft. Battery Tender extension cord that's designed to work with the other components that I linked previously. It's not 10 gauge, but I think it should be sufficient for my 7 watt CPAP blower.

The Battery Tender battery harness that I linked comes with ring terminals out of the box, but they are ever so slightly smaller than 3/8", so they won't fit onto a typical 4D battery's posts. I happened to have a few 3/8" crimp-on ring terminals in my parts bin, so I made a couple ring terminal pigtails to convert from the F2 terminals that I had already spliced on. So I can use the same wiring harness to connect directly to the boat's batteries as you suggested.

Since I am ultra-cautious about having a working CPAP, I might still bring the UPS battery that I showed previousl,y as a backup. (It may depend on how much other gear I want to bring.) To use the UPS battery, I'll just remove the pigtails and attach the F2 connectors onto the UPS battery tabs.

I have some nice Ancor terminators that end in both rings and F2 tabs (typically used for connecting two wires to a single breaker inside a 12v panel), but in this application it would have involved having energized ring tabs exposed while using the F2 tabs. I decided that was a no-go.
 
#26 ·
I will look into those connectors.

The battery is SLA, not lithium chemistry. I could not find anything on FAA website prohibiting that type of battery, but I understand the concern. That's part of the reason I wanted a $13 battery, in case I need to leave it behind somewhere. But, of course, then comes the question of how to dispose of it so I'm not fully stopped from making the trip. I'll need to check further. I suspect I'm not the first person who has tried to do this.
 
#27 ·
I once had a guest along, who used a CPAP. He had a rechargeable battery that he used each evening and we recharged it during the day. No wires through the cabin, no standing on your head and rubbing your belly. No brainer.

The spare from the charter company sounds like a great idea, as long as it can be conveniently charged aboard. My guest's must have had a built in charger. It's been a few years and I can't recall if we charged off 110v or 12v.

I not only prefer to travel light, I've grown to insist upon it. Hauling a lead battery would be a serious buzz kill for me. All the best sorting this one out.
 
#28 ·
The best batteries (high energy content in small, light package) are various forms of lithium chemistry. Unfortunately they are getting a bad reputation for catching fire (especially on airplanes), and thus difficult or impossible to get one of the needed capacity on an airplane. And they would be very expensive for this one-time trip.

The UPS battery that I am considering taking weighs under 10 lb. There are no formal restrictions on SLA batteries on planes, though I will check into it further. I'd like to avoid it completely, but after having a few failures when using other people's batteries, I may prefer to take one that I have tested at home and have confidence in.
 
#30 · (Edited)
We're not chartering under our own names. We're enrolled in a sailing course. The sailing school does the chartering, and they're out teaching for 7-10 days at a time, so there may be nobody to receive shipment. In other words, too many middlemen involved, so pre-shipping anything is far riskier than checking baggage. Fortunately we have a nonstop flight on a major carrier, so checking bags is a little less problematic than transferring to a puddle jumper. But if I take the battery it (and all my CPAP gear) will probably go in my backpack for carry-on. I don't like to check stuff that can't be bought over the counter at my destination (under my travel insurance coverage).

We'll never fly an island puddle jumper again - we learned that lesson the hard way. It's been a long time, but last time we flew Virgin Islands Airways (trying to get home from our honeymoon on St. John) the planes would fill up before getting to Charlotte Amalie and just fly over without even radioing the airport to let them know. We showed up at 8 am for our scheduled flight, but sat in the airport lounge for 10 hours waiting for a plane to land and pick up passengers. We missed our connection in Miami by many hours. The locals seemed to be in on the routine, since they didn't even start trickling into the airport until about 4 pm.
 
#31 · (Edited)
#32 ·
A cybernetic implant that involuntarily controls muscle movement. What could possibly go wrong?

"We are the Borg. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated."

All kidding aside though, thanks for the link. I'm going to look into it too as I have a CPAP in a closet collecting dust. Tried for weeks using different masks, could never get used to it. It made me feel like I was drowning and I would pull it off in my sleep.
 
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