Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect. - Page 5 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Cruising & Liveaboard Forum
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree8Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 01-06-2014
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,160
Thanks: 21
Thanked 95 Times in 79 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by grafare View Post
Paulo,
Quick question: I found some references about weight. Apparently, a steel boat with the same size and design would weight 2-3 times more than an AL one. Is this accurate? What about a foam-fiberglass boat?
Best,
No, the difference is not so big. If it is the same type of boat would be less than 2 times and that is huge. All that difference in weight can be utilized in ballast creating a stiffer boat and to carry load.

The only other material that I would consider besides steel and aluminium to build that type of boat on a shipyard would be marine plywood and epoxy or strip planking. Wood can be a surprisingly strong material and also easy to work and repairable anywhere. That is one of the type of the materials that are used on French voyage boats, namely the RM. Check out on Videos the RM 1350/1360

RM YACHTS | RM 1360

The designer of that boat, Marc Lombard has several great plans. Some of my favorite voyage boats, in Aluminium and strip planking:

Run 45

Randonneur 1200

Alezan 495

Run 45 DS

Regards

Paulo
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #42  
Old 01-06-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: new england
Posts: 1,614
Thanks: 31
Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 2
outbound is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

May also want to keep your eyes open for a used Ovni. That way get to escape the building process and get a well known excellent vessel that would serve your intentions.
__________________
s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #43  
Old 01-11-2014
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: São Paulo, SP, Brazil
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
grafare is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Outbound: I am reviewing some of my initial premises and hull material is among them. Also, I have been reading a lot about aluminum, specially about galvanic corrosion, and a few issues that people tend to link only to aluminum boats, but they are present in steel as well and in some extension in fiberglass. As far as size goes, I am still thinking about what would be the “ideal” size, and I believe it is directly linked to the choice of material: the heavier boat, the harder it will be to single hand it. Therefore, if size matters to comfort, an aluminum boat would preferable. I saw some nice OVNIs built in France!
Faster: I figured that! Size also represents sailing autonomy and comfort, so it is hard to balance ongoing costs with these 2. They are very hard to consider…..
PCP: Agreed. I have reviewed a few projects designed from some of the NAs you pointed me to and they are really great and well thought out. Great comfort on the 45-50 range, and with weight reduction, it will increase autonomy considerably when compared to steel. I must confess that my initial concerns about aluminum are almost gone away, but on trip repair (especially in some forgotten but beautiful beach surrounded by “natural beauties”) might be a bitch due to equipment and environment!
Best,
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #44  
Old 01-11-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: new england
Posts: 1,614
Thanks: 31
Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 2
outbound is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

G - your last comment is one of the reasons I went with a solid glass hull. Yes it's old school.yes it's heavier then cored or Al. Everything else is divinylcell giving me a light top. My thinking was I'm never doing high latitude but I want a hull which is low maintenance and fixable just about anywhere. Also repairs I can judge if done correctly returning the vessel to original strength. Knowing myself and my bride and our need for water/fuel/spares/tools/pack ratting the hull weight didn't seem to signify. It would be different with the excessive weight of steel.
Gave a lot of thought to various wood epoxy methods and would go with this if I was doing a full one off not a semi custom. Impressed cold molded or strip plank with appropriate skins is a very viable way to go.
__________________
s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46

Last edited by outbound; 01-11-2014 at 07:23 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #45  
Old 01-11-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: new england
Posts: 1,614
Thanks: 31
Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 2
outbound is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

G- don't be intimidated by size. We are in our sixties and not buff. Both my 4'10" wife and myself stand single handed watches. Docking in a slip even with a thruster with a wind is exciting so try to call ahead for line handlers. Sailing the boat is the easy part. I think when the sails get so big you are dependent on power to handle them the boat is too big. Think that line for me was around 50'. For you if you're young and fit even that may not by an obstacle. Remember even before our geared multi speed winches " a man and a boy" handled large schooners. If this is an issue go with a split rig.
__________________
s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #46  
Old 01-11-2014
sunfish?junior?
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Richmond ky
Posts: 743
Thanks: 47
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Lou452 is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Off topic It was in this thread, Paulo How much does it take to be top notch ? Do you have to finish in the money for a round the world race to be top notch ? This DR. Stanley has been around the world already. He seems to be an athletic person. Long distance events and publicity attract him. He has a real beyond nice boat ! looks top notch to me, He might not be in the top ten but a top man he is. Would Lin and Larry or Fatty Goodlander, Hal Roth, Sir Shackleton make the grade ? How high is this bar.
I have to ask you my friend because it is rare for me to find you off the mark but we are human. We are all top notch we only need others to see it.
Good day, Lou
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #47  
Old 01-11-2014
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,160
Thanks: 21
Thanked 95 Times in 79 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou452 View Post
Off topic It was in this thread, Paulo How much does it take to be top notch ? Do you have to finish in the money for a round the world race to be top notch ? This DR. Stanley has been around the world already. He seems to be an athletic person. Long distance events and publicity attract him. He has a real beyond nice boat ! looks top notch to me, He might not be in the top ten but a top man he is. Would Lin and Larry or Fatty Goodlander, Hal Roth, Sir Shackleton make the grade ? How high is this bar.
I have to ask you my friend because it is rare for me to find you off the mark but we are human. We are all top notch we only need others to see it.
Good day, Lou
Lou, I don't understand your question. Regarding Dr Stanley he was not only cruising or making a non stop circumnavigation but trying to beat a record. That does not make much sense to me at the age of 76 but it was what he was doing and the boat he choose had to do with that.

For what I understand Grafare is not looking for a top boat (and a top boat varies with what we want to accomplish with it) but just a good cruising bluewater boat, a solid one that can take a considerable load (since it will be his home) and one that sails well. The option to build the boat has to do with huge taxes that are applied in Brazil regarding pleasure boats, used (if imported) or new. Building a boat he will not have to pay those taxes that in some cases can reach 100%.

Regards

paulo
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #48  
Old 01-11-2014
sunfish?junior?
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Richmond ky
Posts: 743
Thanks: 47
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Lou452 is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

I think it is a typo ? I make them all the time. Your post # 29 would seem to indicate Dr. Stanly is average or just a sailor that happens to be on a boat ? the use of the word not. " Not a top sailor " I read most of what you post because it is so good.
Good day, Lou
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #49  
Old 01-11-2014
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: São Paulo, SP, Brazil
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
grafare is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Outbound: I have changed my mind a bit, now 45-55 seems to be the way to go, but, for sure, it will depend upon the project. Also, I want to have the equipment and gadgets to facilitate my job, but with the necessary contingencies. So, for example, a winch must be able to operate on electric power and man power! As for where to go and use, my son wants to be a biologist, so it would be nice to take him to extreme latitudes for short periods.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #50  
Old 01-11-2014
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: São Paulo, SP, Brazil
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
grafare is on a distinguished road
Re: Help choosing the project and the designer/naval architect.

Paulo: I am currently exploring a possible way to build the boat offshore and bring it to Brazil without paying all the taxes. No conclusions yet, but it seems doable and not too risky. If this solution turns out to be a possibility, building it in Europe might be the way to go.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Seeking information on a naval architect Delong!!!! AKDragonfly General Discussion (sailing related) 1 01-01-2014 11:58 PM
SEEKING: Naval Architect Services 1833usmc General Discussion (sailing related) 15 01-09-2012 01:42 PM
naval architect PeterSailer Boat Review and Purchase Forum 23 04-12-2011 09:25 PM
'Out-of-the-box' naval architect - San Diego Union Tribune NewsReader News Feeds 0 02-13-2007 06:15 AM
Naval Architect Search NealePayne General Discussion (sailing related) 0 01-28-2001 03:20 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:42 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.