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  #11  
Old 03-22-2007
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camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough
Dawg...yep it is amazing how many people go to their boats on a weekend and never leave the dock cause they see some whitecaps.
It is really hard to judge wave height in a video and it usually looks a lot less than it is..and a swell can come from far away and be big even on a windlass day. The surface of the water though is a pretty good indicator which is why I gave the estimate that I did. Here's a link to a pretty good description of what you see at various wind speeds. And of course...heading into a 10 knot wind at 10 knots makes it FEEL like 20 knots.
http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/pqr/info/pdf/beaufort.pdf
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  #12  
Old 03-22-2007
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One of the problems on my boat is the dodger blocks so much of the wind, that it is often hard to figure out how bad it really is... first time I took her out single handed, I froze my butt off... since it seemed okay on the way out... but on the way back, which was downwind... the wind came straight over the stern and I wasn't dressed warmly enough... Didn't have the autopilot setup yet, so getting the polar fleece out from the cabin wasn't really possible... LOL...learned my lesson that day.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #13  
Old 03-23-2007
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I usually use the same wave measuring device for sailing that I use surfing, my body. I am 6'. When I surf, I look back at the wave as I make a bottom turn in the trough. If the crest of the wave is at my head, its about six feet. Thats a very general rule, there are lots of variables. In the cockpit of my boat, I am about two feet (rough estimate) above the water. When you are in the trough of a wave, standing up can give you a rough idea of wave height compared with your height. If the crest of the wave is not at my chest height, (assuming I am flat and not on an incline) the waves are not six feet. Anyway just a rough estimate.
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  #14  
Old 03-23-2007
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Bestfriend-

The problem with that is the wave period was short enough that we really weren't in the troughs all that much... and multihulls tend to float pretty high since they have very little mass compared to a monohull of the same size and tend to stay atop the crests, having no ballast to hold them down. So you end up looking down at the troughs more than anything else...
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #15  
Old 03-23-2007
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good point. Nice video, by the way. who lost the hat? gotta add that to the "things the sea has taken" thread. are you behind the camera? no wait, that must be you in the red hat. Looks like you got some good speed going.
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Last edited by bestfriend; 03-23-2007 at 12:39 AM.
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  #16  
Old 03-23-2007
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thanks

Camaraderie,

Thanks for the leeway...I really didn't know any better. BTW, TNT is a combination of my and my wifes' last names. I think I've learned more in the last 3-4 hours of reading posts on here than I have in a couple of months of research elsewhere. I appreciate the effort that it must take to make it happen.

Sailingdog,

My wife is very excited to find that multihulls are back within our price range. I was mislead into thinking that we needed to find a boat that was at minimum 40'. I'll check out the books that you recommended.

Thanks!
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  #17  
Old 03-23-2007
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Glad to help... if you have any other questions, let me know.
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Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #18  
Old 03-23-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog
Actually, the camera, both still and video, tend to flatten the seas a bit.

At the beginning of the video it is about 5–7' seas with 20 knots of wind and gusts up to about 28 knots. Near the end of the video it was probably 6-8' seas with 25 knots of wind and gusts up to about 35 knots... by the end of the afternoon, there were the occasional 9-12' seas with 28 knots and gusts past 35 knots. When the hat was lost, the boat was doing about 12 knots.
Thanks. I could tell from the mic sound that the wind was blowing, but sound on a boat can be deceiving. All in all, I am glad I underestimated the conditions by 10-20%, because people tend to overestimate, don't they? You're right about the foreshortening effect of the lens, however. Those are near-perfect conditions for my taste...at least the 25 knots and 7 feet of seas...really gets the boat going without things getting too dangerous on a well-found boat. You can get into a groove of the occasional wake-up splash and in some conditions at that speed I've briefly surfed...which my older boat won't do normally.

Strangely, I frequently find myself with little company in those conditions on my 33 footer. Cruisers of the weekender variety find those waves upset the cracker tray, and racers will go out in far worse, but not if it's not race night!
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  #19  
Old 03-23-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valiente
Thanks. I could tell from the mic sound that the wind was blowing, but sound on a boat can be deceiving. All in all, I am glad I underestimated the conditions by 10-20%, because people tend to overestimate, don't they? You're right about the foreshortening effect of the lens, however. Those are near-perfect conditions for my taste...at least the 25 knots and 7 feet of seas...really gets the boat going without things getting too dangerous on a well-found boat. You can get into a groove of the occasional wake-up splash and in some conditions at that speed I've briefly surfed...which my older boat won't do normally.

Strangely, I frequently find myself with little company in those conditions on my 33 footer. Cruisers of the weekender variety find those waves upset the cracker tray, and racers will go out in far worse, but not if it's not race night!
I agree that those were near perfect conditions in my tastes for sailing too. As you can see, we were pretty comfy in those conditions... no one felt the need to wear either a PFD or safety harness... it wasn't until we started the upwind beat that we all got in to our foulies... the upwind beat was brutally wet... Mind you, if I were singlehanding in those same conditions or sailing with a less experienced crew, I would have had everyone in PFDs and with safety harnesses... as I wouldn't like to try a MOB in those conditions, with a boat moving at 12 knots.

One reason I like those conditions so much is that it does tend to keep the power boaters in the marinas... and leaves the bay to the few sailboats willing to brave those conditions. I think we saw a total of four other sailboats that day... The cracker tray was only upset by the up-and-down motion of the boat... the boat was sailing about 5˚ of heel most of the time. Very pleasant...
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Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #20  
Old 03-23-2007
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TNT,

Well, here comes the dissenting opinion.

If you are thinking about heading south to Florida and doing it in a multihull, you better start checking where you are going to park that battleship. SD may know better about up north, but finding a nice slip for a monohull (even more so for a multihull) is very difficult down south. If you come around the the SW side, it really gets interesting. Most slips are made for monos, not multis. You will find yourself with no way to park that thing most of the time and you will be limited to mooring fields (at best) or anchoring out (most likely). Now this may not seem like too bad of a thing (as I much prefer anchoring to crappy marinas) but there will be MANY times you wat to tie up and go to shore for a while (or days) to see the sights and get free of the boat. When you find out the limited slips where you can do that and even more so the extraordinary prices they are going to charge you (maybe twice a mono... they are crooks), you will not be happy.

I personally would also forget about crossing the Atlantic. That is not something a newby should take on, especially with kids. I would focus on the islands and Fl and the surrounding. That will be more than you can see in 5-10 years, much less one.

My opinion is similair to Cam's, a production, coastal cruiser. It is much more volumous than a passagemaking boat, will be newer, and makes a nice home for liveaboard. The comment about the 40 is probably not far off for a monohull. I like many of the benes and Jeauneaus. I love Catalinas (duh). We lived on a 380 with Chase and 2 dogs and are soon to ship back off with Glen too on a Catalina 400. You can find ways to get around the 3 stateroom problem in my opinion, even at that age. We seperate out the V on our 400 so each has their space (which is important). I can offer many more thoughts on cruising with kids too, if you are interested.

The dog will be an issue. I will be honest. Without regurgitating a bunch of old threads, you will be a bit limited to the Bahamas & US (though you can cruise further south, it will be irritating). However, you better start getting used to cleaning up 5 pound piles of crap of the deck (hopefully the deck). It can be done, and we do it, but you will get frustrated many times having to haul that dog to the shore (hopefully, where available) in a blinding rainstorm so he doesn't befoul the boat and stink it up.

I personally am not against cats. We seriously looked at a Lagoon 440. I think Privelege makes a fine cat too. I would be wary of any charter boat. I can tell you that the Catalina 380s are a well built boat and will go about anywhere you want to take them. I have never owned a Bene or Jeauneau, but I like many of their designs (and not some of the others). If you are going to pay cash for the boat, fine. If you are going to finance, which may make more sense (depending on your liquidity), you may find it easier to get the boat with a house versus not with it.

If your wife is moved for the peace corps, you can still get a "coastal" boat (which is not coastal, just more limited to maybe 5 day offshore passages or so - depends on the boat, could be more). You will just need to ship it via Dockwise from Ft. Lauderdale to the Med. From there it is an easy hop over to where you need to go. Given your experience, I would highly reccomend that anyways.

We cruise (or soon will again) with kids. Stay in touch with us. There are very few of us. Shoot away questions and I will try and answer them to the best of my ability. You have a lot to learn quickly.

Take care. Fair winds.

- CD
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