Proper ground tackle for long island sound and new england

[TrueBlue]

Jason,
We have been cruising for the past 15 years in Narragansett Bay, RI Sound, Block Island and Long Island Sounds, extensively throughout the Elizabethan Islands, all Martha's Vineyard ports and Nantucket. The bottom types for these areas described by sailingdog are fairly accurate, but I feel the sentiments towards Rocna anchors to be strongly biased.

Our current 33 ft boat is 36 ft LOA, displaces 18,000 lbs (similarly to your Morgan), but only carries a 35 lb CQR as a primary anchor. However, we do use 150 feet of 5/16" G4 chain and 200 ft of 9/16" rope. A Simpson Lawrence Sprint 1500 windlass does the grunt work. We also have the original Nauticat equipped Danforth mounted at the stern - which we've never used.

Aside from gunkholing and overnighting, quite often our purpose for anchoring is to scubadive - usually dropping anchor and then motoring to the dive spot in the tender. Typically, I descend the anchor chain first to check the set. The CQR has always dug in and held; we of course though, do not dive in rough conditions.

If we were full time cruisers, I would upgrade to a heavier storm anchor to mount alongside a secondary - such as a Bruce. I would also second the sentiments expressed regarding chain. But as was mentioned above - it's all about technique. Keep the 45 lb CQR, add a Bruce and much more chain, powerset the ground tackle and get a good night's sleep.

[sailingdog]

TB-

I have no financial interest in Rocna Anchors, and do own one... and am basing my opinions on the Rocna on my experiences with it. The only real complaint I have with the Rocna is that it generally brings up about its own weight in bottom and cleaning it off is a royal pain.

I do not believe my statements about the Rocna are biased in any way.

Also, having 150' of G4 chain and the 35 lb. CQR is a far different story from having a 45' CQR with almost no chain. Twelve feet of chain might be suitable for a lunch hook, but is far too little for a primary anchor IMHO. I would like to go up to 60' of chain, but don't know how well my fairly light boat would handle the additional weight forward.

[TrueBlue]

SD,
The chain does make all the difference with ground tackle. I should have added, the biased comment was not directed toward you, but Craig - who is relentless in his pursuit to market his Rocna anchors on sailing BBs. You must admit that his hype does get a bit tiring.

[gc1111]

Anchoring discussions are always interesting. Everyone has strong (and different) opinions. Rather than saying what is best for you, I will simply recite my experience.

I have been cruising these waters for about 40 years. First in a 24 ft. boat, then a 28 ft., and now in a 39 ft. ketch. My experience covers LI South shore, LI Sound, and the coast from LI to Maine. I have also been south.
The anchorages and summer weather in this area are pretty much ideal. The anchorages are well described in cruising guides and you can always find one in moderate depths with good holding (usually moderately firm mud/clay). The summer weather is almost always moderate, thunderstorms being the worst but they usually blow over quickly.

I have used Danforth-type anchors with rope/chain rode as well as plows with all chain. They have all worked well if I was sufficiently careful in setting them. Here technique is probably more important than equipment.

One problem you might have is that some anchorages are crowded. Here the kellet can be useful since it allows you to shorten your scope for moderate weather. Just remember that once the rode straightens out you are back to the basic scope and the kellet does no good. However the weather forcasts for this area are excellent and you know when it might blow hard.

[christyleigh]

Ahhh..... it's a good day to argue Religion/Anchors I'm a Bruce fan because on my 13,000 lb c320 the 33 with only the minimum 30' of chain held me for days of 360 degree shifting winds, underscoped at crowded Block Island RI, in the 'hard pan' of Martha's Vinyard - Vinyard Haven's outer harbor, etc..... and most other places in the area for 6 years with 100% first time set and hold. That same 33 Bruce now has held my 18,000 lb. NC 331 with the same chain/rope setup for 1 year in 20kt wind etc.... with 100% satisfaction.
As for the Rocna testing ******** - Yes... you can lie with pictures They couldn't make the Bruce hold at all - Gee.... I've tried to make it fail for 7 years underscoped, shifting winds, now undersized and all... and haven't succeded yet.
As for CQR's with all chain... they need it. That is my secondary anchor. Plows... plow that's what they were designed to do hundreds of years ago and they still make a great furrow for planting .

[camaraderie]

Jason..I have cruised extensively in all of those areas and here are my thoughts.
1. The Fortress is a good secondary anchor in softer bottoms but will not do you much good on the hard bottoms and kelp beds of New England.
2. The 45 CQR is adequate for the boat as a primary but I would add 50' of chain. Get rid of the kellet. Useless.
3. I don't like CQR's as mine have frequently required multiple sets to hold properly. Without a windless...they would be a real pain. They work best with a combination nylon/chain rode so you are ok on that score.
4. I would not consider the 45lb. CQR as a storm anchor so if you are looking for a single bulletproof solution...I would move to a Delta,Rocna,Spade or Manson Supreme in the 50-60lb range and consider adding a windlass as you're gonna get awfully tired hauling chain, anchor and garbage off the bottom.

[btrayfors]

I certainly agree with Jon, TrueBlue, qc111, and Cam. With the addition of more chain, what you already have is more than enough.

I have a 27,500lb sloop. The 45lb CQR has been my primary anchor for the past 18 years of sailing from Maine to Grenada (except for the Chesapeake Bay area where I prefer Danforths and Fortresses). It has held through every kind of weather, including a very nasty 50-55kt night anchored in the lee of Saba in the Caribbean.

The CQR has been the standard anchor of long-distance cruising boats for many, many years. Used intelligently, it will do what you ask of it. It is good in most bottoms EXCEPT soft mud and silt where it has very little holding power. But in thick mud, sand, coral, clay, rock, and many grassy bottoms it does just fine.

As others have said, the important thing is technique. Drop your anchor slowly while stopped or moving back slowly, pay out plenty of chain, take a slight strain on the rode until you feel it grab, pay out more chain/rope, take an increasing strain, then let it sit for awhile before taking a real strain on it. Don't try to set it initially with a strong pull using your engine. Be a bit patient. It will grab and it will hold.

Bill

[Brezzin]

I have used plows (delta’s) and have used Danforths in LI Sound with good success. However with my new boat (it came with an Delta 44) I felt that the Delta 44 was simply too small. After following anchor posts on several different forums, I decided on a new generation anchor. I have on order a Rocna 40 (88lbs). I believe that the difference between the new Gen anchors is probably pretty small but the difference is much greater when compared to the older anchors. Would I replace a CRQ or Delta with a new gen anchor, No way, but since I’m going to spend the money anyway, why buy old technology.

The truth is that when Graig posts on any forum, even when he does not even mention the Rocna, and he gets the snot beat out him (every time) made me want to buy a Rocna. He either really believes in his product or ………

[sailingdog]

Originally Posted by TrueBlue

SD,
The chain does make all the difference with ground tackle. I should have added, the biased comment was not directed toward you, but Craig - who is relentless in his pursuit to market his Rocna anchors on sailing BBs. You must admit that his hype does get a bit tiring.

True, it does... Alain is just as bad...

[Craig Smith]

Originally Posted by jasonr575

Ok this is some good information. The weight is good but my anchor style is bad for the area, is what i am getting from this. Well may be the best course of action is to discuss bottem types in these areas. Anybody familiar with the areas i have mentioned before and their bottems? Then we can pick the best anchor for the combination of areas.

Jason, it should be clear from my affiliation with Rocna what my recommendation would be, so I will avoid making it.

If you do a little more research you will find that newer designs will deal with a combination of bottoms very well. It is not true, as some will suggest, that you need specialist anchors for specific bottoms (although it used to be).

To start you off, you can find the two most comprehensive tests of recent years on our website under "independent reviews" (SAIL and Yachting Monthly) which are up-to-date but focus on hardish sand, so raising the bar a little high in terms of setting ability (you will not likely find the CQR quite as bad as they report, for example ).
Overall comments here.

This is an extensive review of the Delta which is tested in grounds a little farther south than New England, but the bottoms are probably fairly similar: The Delta Anchor- A cruising test report on the Delta anchor
Not a direct comparison with any other types, but since it talks about the CQR you should find it interesting.