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  #11  
Old 01-09-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N0NJY View Post
... detail on the type acceptance. That's a US and Canadian thing. I'm not sure honestly how other countries do things.
The EU has a similar set of standards. Australia does as well. Many small countries simply point to ITU standards and will simply bung you into jail and fine you without too much concern for that fact that their taxi-cabs, restaurants, and other businesses are using marine VHF as a party line; don't tick off the authorities and make them look too hard.

Like Rick, I have a number of radios that can operate out of band although I don't use them that way. For example, I have a radio that I can use on marine VHF, aircraft, Mutual Aid, and some other tactical frequencies. I DON'T, but I could. If Katrina had come up the Chesapeake I might well have been able to help (with full fuel tanks and another comms operator, I can operate for nearly a week on multiple bands until government and other civil defense folk can get in place -- local authorities know what I have and what they can count on me for). I'm a rule-bound fellow so I have documented procedures for the boat (check-list for guest operators, who may be a DNR comms guy). Frankly no one has ever asked for any of this stuff, but I have it. Many hams are part of emergency response teams and have similar equipment and procedures of varying degrees of formality.

Sorry about drifting off the OP topic. Many marine radios can be modified to legally operate on ham frequencies without impacting their use on marine frequencies. There are no ham radios that can be modified to legally operate on marine frequencies. There are good reasons for the requirements. Are you willing to risk the lives of fellow mariners? Choose carefully.
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  #12  
Old 01-19-2009
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Could you explain?

Hi;

I would like to know more about the statement below. I just passed my technicians test, and will hopefully take the general test in a month or so. I don't plan on transmitting only listening with my radio, a ts-480, on the marine bands, but out of country it may be something that is considered. What about the HAM radio makes it emit spurious emissions? Since most mobile ham radios are 100 watt max, I assume you mean that ham rigs that are using amplifiers may transmit further.

One other question - how do weather routers such as Herb broadcast from land legally, as I understand that it is not legal to transmit on marine frequencies from shore? Is there a special license for this?

Chris


Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post

As xort mentions, it is rare for anyone to get busted for offshore use of anything--as long as there are no complaints. INshore...that's something else, since marine radios are much 'cleaner' than ham radios with regard to spurious emissions, and have a more limited audio range--so a good ear can quite literally tell what you are using by the sound of it, and the frequncy spatter.
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Last edited by witzgall; 01-19-2009 at 03:01 PM.
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  #13  
Old 01-19-2009
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Remember the Marine radios that is being refered to are the SSB radios and not the VHF radios.
The SSB can be set up with Ham & Marine bands the VHF cannot.
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  #14  
Old 01-19-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by witzgall View Post
Hi;

I would like to know more about the statement below. I just passed my technicians test, and will hopefully take the general test in a month or so. I don't plan on transmitting only listening with my radio, a ts-480, on the marine bands, but out of country it may be something that is considered. What about the HAM radio makes it emit spurious emissions? Since most mobile ham radios are 100 watt max, I assume you mean that ham rigs that are using amplifiers may transmit further.

One other question - how do weather routers such as Herb broadcast from land legally, as I understand that it is not legal to transmit on marine frequencies from shore? Is there a special license for this?

Chris
Herb does have a Canadian license to operate from a shore station.
There is nothing unique to a ham radio which makes it emit spurious signals - all transmitters do to some degree. When operated within it's designed freq ranges, it's emissions are relatively pure and within the standards accepted for their use. So-called "type accepted" marine SSB radios are designed to different somewhat stricter standards. It has nothing to do with linear amplifiers and I find it hard to imagine anyone being able to hear the difference between marine and a ham transmitted signal. Seems like a huge exaggeration.
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  #15  
Old 01-19-2009
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Witzgall-
What k1vsk said, mainly. Lots of folks have tin ears and think Am radio is just as good as fm radio is just as good as tapes or cds. Some of us can tell the difference--in the right setting. Add some background noise, like car road noise, and most people can't tell them apart any more.
Same thing with ham /vs/ marine HF radios, there are different specs for the audio and a good ear can tell them apart. And a ham radio may offer options for audio compression or bandwidth that a marine radio wouldn't.
Ham radios are generally "built to a price" because they are sold to hobbyists who don't need to buy them, who will make decisions based on price just like any mass market. Marine radios are required on commercial vessels--so they may also be built to a price, but the buyers are more concerned with performance, and a couple of hundred bucks is a flyspec on the build sheet for a commercial SHIP.

You can use marine radios legally from the shore, there are different licenses available besides the usual "ships station license". There is a variation for portable use (i.e. I have a license that is attached to *me* and not a vessel, so I can take it with me if I'm crewing or using someone else' boat) and another variation for yacht clubs and marinas, who operate a fixed shore station and sometimes a fleet license to cover their dinks, etc. as well.

To find out what is currently available (regs change) you can always explore the FCC's web site, which sometimes is hard to search, or call their licensing division and speak to a human being. And then of course, outside the US all the regs change again.
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Old 01-19-2009
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Be aware that to use a Marine SSB radio you need a Ship's Station License and a Restricted Radio Operator's License from the FCC. To use the Marine SSB on ham frequencies, you also need a Ham license.
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  #17  
Old 01-20-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xort View Post
I have heard, no direct knowledge, that you can hear the difference in a ham radio TXing on a marine band...so detection can be fairly easy, altho I've never heard of anybody getting busted.
People get "busted" all the time transmitting illegally on Amateur Radio Bands.

For the record, the FCC won't track you down unless you're causing harmful interference, but the Amateur Bands are the MOST policed bands of ALL.

Why? Because amateur jealously guard their frequencies against intruders (and rightly so) since over the years the bands have shrank over time, having many of them pulled out from under the hams.

In fact, I've participated in several "hunt down the offender" issues over the years and we can, within minutes usually locate someone transmitting on uhf/vhf bands. Takes a bit longer on HF, but it can be done.

I know a guy in town here that has a doppler ranging system and can find you in less than five minutes and pin point your EXACT latitude and longitude in that time.

As for the "getting you under the telecommunications act" - for the 10K that's probably accurate. However, the FCC will still fine you based on your actions if you cause HARMFUL interference (unless you're in an emergency).

About "hearing the difference", I'm not sure about that. I listen to both amateur and marine broadcasts all the time and I can't tell you what kind of rig someone is using without them mentioning it. Certain microphones can change voice and bandwidth characteristics, as can other types of equipment added to the radio.
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  #18  
Old 09-08-2009
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Not meaning to revive the dead, but is there an Amateur Radio that transmits on all bands and receives every frequency?

Thanks

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  #19  
Old 09-08-2009
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Jeff, anything that is commercially made and sold "as" a ham radio, is retricted to transmission on the amateur bands. A licensed ham is allowed to build or modify anything they please, which brings with it the responsibility to "control" your station and keep it within legal operation as the situation may be.

You'll find many of the ham transceivers can be "opened" to out-of-band use, but due to design considerations "dc to daylight" usually means a radio that is at best only a fair performer somewhere along the way. And then too, there's the matter of budget. Wider range with better performance usually means a bigger more expensive radio, too.
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  #20  
Old 09-10-2009
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...another HAM Extra here. The only question I feel need be asked/answered, aside from all the legal and license stuff, is - are all your crew able to yank that mic off a complicated HAM radio and begin transmitting on CH 16, or will they need to find the manual to find out how to turn it on, how to receive, how to transmit, what power settings, antenna switch, tuner settings, etc.

Do yourself a favor - get a nice (small) HAM rig with a built-in tuner to light up your backstay, and get a nice VHF that stays tuned to big illuminated letters that show CH 16 and WX ALERT. All scenarios considered - this is no doubt your best bet.
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