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  #411  
Old 05-02-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Actually think in some regards weather is more of an issue coastal as there are more local events (line squalls, thunderstorms etc.) that can riun your day.
That's a very good point. Plus the waves can be a lot nastier due to shallowness, and there's lots more hard bits to run into. That's why I loved this thread about the actual statistics of sailing:

How "afraid" should we be of sailing?

I've always believed that most of us on the forums have so little true ocean time, that we harbor the "there be dragons" mentality toward off-shore sailing, when it's actually (statistically speaking) more deadly sailing around in a lake or bay.

(PS - The Outbound 46 is an insanely sweet boat dude. You're livin' it! Of course you do realize that it can't be a bluewater boat if it has a centerline bed? Heh-heh.)
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Last edited by smackdaddy; 05-02-2013 at 10:58 AM.
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  #412  
Old 05-02-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Amazing numbers and a very good thread to read. Gonna show it to the admiral. Prooves the point. It's the hard edges that's the problem. Out in the wild blue yonder get the rags down. Through something off your stern. Button up and go down below. You may have some reverse peristalsis but you'll be fine. Tx. Smack.
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  #413  
Old 05-02-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
I've always believed that most of us on the forums have so little true ocean time, that we harbor the "there be dragons" mentality toward off-shore sailing,
Yes, I couldn't agree with you more.

I can't believe the number of people who buy boats based on Internet forum fear campaigns instead of buying one thats obviously more comfortable, better fit out with modern convieniences, and more suitable for an appartment/condominium type life than a camping type life.

There ain't no dragons out there so buy a boat that's comfortable not one that is built to fight North Atlantic storms in winter.


And GO!


Mark
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  #414  
Old 05-02-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by MarkofSeaLife View Post
Yes, I couldn't agree with you more.

I can't believe the number of people who buy boats based on Internet forum fear campaigns instead of buying one thats obviously more comfortable, better fit out with modern convieniences, and more suitable for an appartment/condominium type life than a camping type life.

There ain't no dragons out there so buy a boat that's comfortable not one that is built to fight North Atlantic storms in winter.


And GO!


Mark
I was hoping you'd chime in Mark. Between you and Michael/Sequitur, I think we have some pretty invaluable insight on this issue.

You guys are still alive! How the hell did that happen?
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  #415  
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by OsmundL View Post
SM, I like
Perhaps it's worth mentioning that the vast majority of wreckages and carnage happen on the coast - not even along the coast but virtually on it.
That's a good point. Maybe we should be comparing how well different boats take being run up on reefs, jetties, and beaches, since that seems to be the major cause of boat failure when cruising, rather than sinking at sea.
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  #416  
Old 05-02-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by Group9 View Post
That's a good point. Maybe we should be comparing how well different boats take being run up on reefs, jetties, and beaches, since that seems to be the major cause of boat failure when cruising, rather than sinking at sea.
To quote again from my book regarding the Hunter 49:
Quote:
The prototype had been put through abusive sea trial testing by Steve Pettengill, who with his ocean racing records and Around-the-World Race experience is well qualified. He sea-trials all the new Hunter designs, repeatedly crashing the boats into stone jetties, and at full speed and under full sail in strong winds, he sails them up onto sandy beaches. He then spends weeks offshore in the nastiest conditions he can find to assess livability and to try to break things. The thinking is that if the new design can withstand Pettengill's abuse, it will likely handle a loving owner's occasional bumbling and also the odd nasty that Mother Nature can serve-up. If the boat doesn't take kindly to Pettengill's abuse, Henderson and his team go back to their drawing boards.
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  #417  
Old 05-03-2013
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

I see a Bayliner "Buccaneer" on the bad list up there. You guys do realize that every Bayliner sailboat was called a "Buccaneer", right? Some of them like the 295 were very good boats. We've got one that we've stripped out for refit. Nicely laid up, fully tabbed "marine" grade plywood bulkheads, etc.. I'd put it beside most any other production boat such as Beneteau or Catalina. Seriously, it's a very well designed, former world record holding design from Doug Peterson that Bayliner didn't screw up. I'd sail it in a gale and kick your ass on the course while doing it.
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  #418  
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

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Originally Posted by CharlieCobra View Post
I see a Bayliner "Buccaneer" on the bad list up there. You guys do realize that every Bayliner sailboat was called a "Buccaneer", right? Some of them like the 295 were very good boats. We've got one that we've stripped out for refit. Nicely laid up, fully tabbed "marine" grade plywood bulkheads, etc.. I'd put it beside most any other production boat such as Beneteau or Catalina. Seriously, it's a very well designed, former world record holding design from Doug Peterson that Bayliner didn't screw up. I'd sail it in a gale and kick your ass on the course while doing it.
Right up until you blew out your jib, pal! Heh-heh.

And could you pull together a crew with bowchicks like these?



Booyah!

(I love the 3 on 2 ratio. Good marketing there.)
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Smack, I haven't read all the posts in this thread, so this may have already been discussed. But in my experience of sailing a Bavaria 34', (I think it was a 34'), across the Atlantic to Holland. I found that it was a very uncomfortable experience. It seemed to me that the fact that the boat has a pretty much flat bottom caused the boat to pound in all but the lightest sea. I swear, you simply couldn't let go of the boat for a second without being thrown across the cockpit.
After that experience, I decided that I would never voluntarily take a boat with that kind of shape to sea again. I'll stick with a boat that cuts the water rather than pounds against it. FWIW.
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Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead;1025165...
After that experience, I decided that I would never voluntarily take a boat with that kind of shape to sea again. I'll stick with a boat that cuts the water rather than pounds against it. FWIW.
There are two ways of looking at it that has also to do with the way the boat is sailed: Pound into the water versus immersed in the water or flying over the water versus digging in the water.

Regarding pounding, not dismissing your experience, Mark circumnavigated with a Benetau Oceanis that has a hull similar to the one of that Bavaria and he did not found pounding a problem. Of course he had done that with a 40ft boat and bigger boats are more comfortable in what regards sea motion.

Personally I agree with you if we are talking into going against the wind, close to the wind in nasty weather. A more sportier boat like a Dehler 36, narrower and with finer entries would do a lot better. That was not by accident that after the Bavaria I looked for a boat with a better performance and more comfortable upwind. But anyway most voyages are made on the trade winds with downwind sailing.

Do you got a lot of upwind sailing on that Transat?

Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 05-03-2013 at 03:36 PM.
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