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  #31  
Old 02-04-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nissantwa View Post
What does a man need, really need? A few pounds of food each day, heat and shelter, six feet to lie down in, and some form of working activity that will yield a sense of accomplishment.
Nissantwa... Love the quote and couldn't agree more... However in my mind I need at least 6'6" to lie down in being 6'4". So what's your boat and budget for $300,000 and how long will you be gone?
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  #32  
Old 02-04-2010
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If I had $300,000 I would be able to cruise for a few years. If you only take home 2% annually, that is still $6000. I have a Haida 26, and $6000 goes a long way on a Haida 26. Heck, a repower is $2000 ! New mainsail $2000. Genoa from a Catalina 25 would work. These are cheap. Food for a year: $4000.

So maybe my fortune would slowly dwindle at 2%... if I didn't work at all, and kept her in top nick.
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  #33  
Old 02-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnRPollard View Post
Our family's health insurance policy costs over $1200/month.
That's 14400$us/year, assuming that is post tax at about a quarter, then that is about 18k$us net income. The mean personal income in the United States is only 25k$us, 18k$us is 72% of what the statistically mean individual over 18 years old in American makes every year. That's quite an offering to the altar of Asclepius!
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  #34  
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Cruising for $300,000

I have no statistics to support my statement but I suspect the majority of cruisers spend less than $300,000. For that kind of money I could live on a cruise ship for 10 years. (about $700 a week) I could charter a boat for 3 years. I could buy 10 Cal 29's for $120,000 and throw them away as they break. In the 60's I hitch hiked from San Diego to Mexico city and back. I left with $80 and returned a month later with $20. I cruise the same way. A good piece of classic plastic for $15,000 or less. Cal, Ericson, Columbia, C&C, Contessa, etc. 30 feet or smaller. Outfitting would be in the hundreds, not thousands of $. No refrigeration, no power water pumps, no radar, no SSB. GPS & a sextant, charts, food & fuel. One of my biggest expenses would be cruising permits and port fees. I could pay for the boat and be gone for months for under 20k. I could go the Joshua Slocum route for half that. The rest of the 300k could go to purchase rental property to provide income. I admire those who cruise their pristine projects. I've sailed on a few. Drove an 86' Sparkman Stevens ketch from San Diego to Hawaii. 3 storms, 11 no sun days, 15kts with spinnaker and 24kts surfing the 30' swells. Spent 40 thousand in Hawaii on sail and gear repairs. The boat left for Guam with broken trash compactor, generator fried by saltwater intrusion when flapper exhaust valve failed. Bilge pump in-op due to pin-hole leaks allowing air through the pipes. (we pumped every few hours) because water was getting down through the chain locker hatch, + block ice because the frige crapped out.. Washer dryer inop. etc. etc. $$$$ Guam was another $10,000 for fuel and repairs, by then the crew was using a coleman camping stove to cook with and a honda generator strapped to the deck. When this 2 year old yacht was finally delivered to Singapore, the owner spent another half million removing the aft steering wheel to install a hot tub. Hence, my classic plastic under 15k production boat leanings. Just my 2 cents concerning $300,000, nuff said.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpIvy View Post
..... This needs to include the purchase of the boat, outfitting, how many years you think you could make it last and any other budgeting you would do. To each there own on how they would spend it...

My thoughts...
Boat - First Tayana 42 CC then Cabo Rico 38 - $110,000
Outfit - $30,000
Yearly Budget - $35,000 (2 Adults, 2 Kids on the hook mostly)
Years on the Water - 4 (If I spend less yearly I would go longer)
Emergency Fund - $20,000
Location - Start in the Caribbean and make my way over to the South Pacific but depends on boat location...
You are asking a question that only you can really answer.

Look at the responses, all over the map and each thinks they are correct and for them they are. I'll give you my correct responses to some of the issues.

The boat: Try to get the boat for $110K complete. Start with a $50K to $75K boat, smaller is better. Sail it for a couple of years first to get it set up the way you would like. It will take much longer to do this part than you think so plan 2yrs, might take more depending on time you can put to it.

You might be able to gain freedom from slavery and work on the boat but then it might feel like you are a slave to the boat and not living the dream. In that case sail a bit and work a bit. Takes longer but better than packing it in early.

Annual budget: Sounds good but things like insurance seem really crazy expensive when it means you are spending the end of the trip for such purchases. Besides insurance has always been a mugs game. As for health insurance, we couldn't get any that would cover much, and even the best had very low limits, like $20K. Better to set aside money for that and end the dream early if something happens, unless you can get insurance you believe in and think is cheap.

Emergency fund is everything left, no need to set anything aside for that.

We started out living in poverty as some have suggested. Having actually been poor for me it is hell, a hell I quickly remembered. Better to live rich and die young unless of course you have always been comfortable in which case pretending to be poor can be fun. Like camping. Some like camping, I call it living on the street. Yeah I can do it by why in God would I chose to. Just be comfortable and let the cost eat into the end of the trip.

Keep in mind that getting back to making money, unless you have things like pensions or a government that will help, will cost alot of money. You can't run things down to zero, not even close. Do not plan or count on selling the boat at the end. You may not have it, and if you do it will not be worth anything near what you think it is.

I would suggest planning for at least a year of high expenses at the end to transition back to land/work.

And then of course your mileage will vary. Seems to me that much of what I've suggested would not apply to you so like most of the posts in this thread just ignore most of it and pick what you want from it.
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  #36  
Old 02-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nissantwa View Post
I could buy 10 Cal 29's for $120,000 and throw them away as they break.
this brought me the LOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by nissantwa View Post
Drove an 86' Sparkman Stevens ketch from San Diego to Hawaii. 3 storms, 11 no sun days, 15kts with spinnaker and 24kts surfing the 30' swells. Spent 40 thousand in Hawaii on sail and gear repairs. The boat left for Guam with broken trash compactor, generator fried by saltwater intrusion when flapper exhaust valve failed. Bilge pump in-op due to pin-hole leaks allowing air through the pipes. (we pumped every few hours) because water was getting down through the chain locker hatch, + block ice because the frige crapped out.. Washer dryer inop. etc. etc. $$$$ Guam was another $10,000 for fuel and repairs, by then the crew was using a coleman camping stove to cook with and a honda generator strapped to the deck. When this 2 year old yacht was finally delivered to Singapore, the owner spent another half million removing the aft steering wheel to install a hot tub. Hence, my classic plastic under 15k production boat leanings.
Mo' money Mo' problems! Seems the trick is to pretend you don't have $300,000, may be the decision to get a $50-100k boat may not be so automatic.
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  #37  
Old 02-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nissantwa View Post
I have no statistics to support my statement but I suspect the majority of cruisers spend less than $300,000. For that kind of money I could live on a cruise ship for 10 years. (about $700 a week) I could charter a boat for 3 years. I could buy 10 Cal 29's for $120,000 and throw them away as they break. In the 60's I hitch hiked from San Diego to Mexico city and back. I left with $80 and returned a month later with $20. I cruise the same way. A good piece of classic plastic for $15,000 or less. Cal, Ericson, Columbia, C&C, Contessa, etc. 30 feet or smaller. Outfitting would be in the hundreds, not thousands of $. No refrigeration, no power water pumps, no radar, no SSB. GPS & a sextant, charts, food & fuel. One of my biggest expenses would be cruising permits and port fees. I could pay for the boat and be gone for months for under 20k. I could go the Joshua Slocum route for half that. The rest of the 300k could go to purchase rental property to provide income. I admire those who cruise their pristine projects. I've sailed on a few. Drove an 86' Sparkman Stevens ketch from San Diego to Hawaii. 3 storms, 11 no sun days, 15kts with spinnaker and 24kts surfing the 30' swells. Spent 40 thousand in Hawaii on sail and gear repairs. The boat left for Guam with broken trash compactor, generator fried by saltwater intrusion when flapper exhaust valve failed. Bilge pump in-op due to pin-hole leaks allowing air through the pipes. (we pumped every few hours) because water was getting down through the chain locker hatch, + block ice because the frige crapped out.. Washer dryer inop. etc. etc. $$$$ Guam was another $10,000 for fuel and repairs, by then the crew was using a coleman camping stove to cook with and a honda generator strapped to the deck. When this 2 year old yacht was finally delivered to Singapore, the owner spent another half million removing the aft steering wheel to install a hot tub. Hence, my classic plastic under 15k production boat leanings. Just my 2 cents concerning $300,000, nuff said.
THAT is a fine post.

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  #38  
Old 02-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nissantwa View Post
A good piece of classic plastic for $15,000 or less. Cal, Ericson, Columbia, C&C, Contessa, etc. 30 feet or smaller. Outfitting would be in the hundreds, not thousands of $. No refrigeration, no power water pumps, no radar, no SSB.
A good piece of classic plastic will almost certainly need some sails for cruising. If you are lucky and the PO just bought two sails you still need more that two for cruising.
Ground tackle will likely be marginal for a cruising boat.
Standing rigging will be 20 years old and need replacing.
Tanks, at least some of them will be original, you can hope the holding take holds.
The engine will likely be 30 years old, again a major gamble.

I'm assuming you are talking about coastal cruising because the boats you mentioned are not designed for oceans.

So run the numbers for me and pick some 15k boat you have seen for sale lately and itemize the items above that you would like to upgrade before committing your life to the boat.

The other hard reality is that boat repairs are inherently difficult.
If you live on the boat and happen to be in a port even if it's only a 100 miles away from your connections, tool shed and friends, they are that much harder.
That's why when someone starts a project like this they immediately run into the "while I have it open syndrome". And even if you had no intension's of doing so you end up refitting the whole boat.

I do agree with one premise. If you go 30' instead of 40' you can save half the money.
You will just not have the room for so much stuff.
No life raft
No water maker
No generator
No air conditioner
I'm thinking radar would be hard to turn down.
Self steering is mandatory, even Pardee has that.


I think the person that spend 50 for the boat and added 80 for upgrades probably ended up with a pretty sweet boat. I'm anxious to hear how the numbers broke out. That way some of us dreamers could decide what they would be willing to live without.

I can pretty much assure you that if you buy a 15k classic you will not be cruising for long with a fixup budget of hundreds unless you get really lucky with the buy.

In fact it would be fun to calculate just the spare parts budget for a boat completely fitted out. I'll bet that alone would be in the thousands.

Last edited by davidpm; 02-05-2010 at 09:19 PM.
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  #39  
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Boats are like cars our houses... Everyone has an opinion about what they need or could afford... For us a family of four might require a bigger boat than a single. In my mind you need to keep the crew happy or you'll have a mutiny on your hand.

That's why I think it is interesting to see what everyone would do with $300,000. Some feel that is a ton of money for cruising some think that isn't enough for even the boat.

What would you do with $300,000???
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Old 02-06-2010
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Budget for turning an old hull into a cruising boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
I think the person that spend 50 for the boat and added 80 for upgrades probably ended up with a pretty sweet boat. I'm anxious to hear how the numbers broke out. That way some of us dreamers could decide what they would be willing to live without.
Thanx Davidpm, we think the boat is "pretty sweet" now ourselves Here's how our numbers broke out:


We replaced "everything." Everything we put in was new, mostly purchased at Annapolis Boat Show sale prices. The refit took about 2 years and we - mostly Dan - did everything ourselves except the engine, heater, and rerigging installations (for insurance/warranty reasons). The first priority was things that make the boat safer or sail faster, then, everything else (all prices in boat bucks, a.k.a, thousands of dollars)

Yanmar engine 20
Frigoboat keel cooled refrig/freezer 2
Lofrans windlass & remote switch 3
Autohelm under deck mount autopilot 5
Webasto diesel heater 2.5
replace all standing rigging 5
arch for solar panels with integral cockpit rail 5
Brig 10' inflatable dinghy with 9.8 hp outboard 5
Cruisair reverse cycle air conditioner/heater 2.5
North Sails new mainsail & genoa 5
Force 10 stove/oven 1.5
replace fuel tanks 2
100' chain, 200' rope and Rocna 44 anchor 1.5

Those bigger ticket items account for $60K of our refit budget. The rest of it (each item $1000 or less) went for: solar panels, bilge pump & 4000 gph "Hail Mary" pump, upholstery/paint/varnish/formica, marine-grade wire, LED lighting, cockpit cushions, trifold swim ladder, bimini, stereo, sinks and faucets, Seagull water filter, 4 AGM batteries, Xantrex Link 20, 2 Garhaur 6-part purchases for dinghy lift, handheld Garmin chartplotter, and (*winks at CruisingDad*) a BBQ.

4 months into our cruise, there is not one single thing I'd change! The solar panels make all of our power needs on sunny days; we generally run the engine about 45 minutes every 4 days to make up the difference due to occaisional cloudiness. We chose not to use a generator (too noisy) and instead use extremely energy-efficient systems, like LED lights and the keel-cooled fridge/freezer, so that we could maintain ourselves with solar. We have no watermaker, but with a 100-gal water tank for 2 people, we can go 3-4 weeks before refilling. We also chose not to install radar because our chosen cruising grounds, US southeast & Bahamas, rarely have fog and we rarely run at night, therefore less need. Disclaimer: these are our solutions, for the way we like to live, I'm not assuming they'd be right for everyone.
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