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  #11  
Old 06-13-2012
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

Quote:
My question remains... can an alcohol stove be readily refit into a kerosene? or are they completely different.
I've converted two alcohol stoves over to propane, but not to Kerosene. It was trial and error on the first one, drilling extra holes in the diffuser cup until I got a nice flame. If I were in your shoes, I'd get a free alcohol stove from someone, take it to the shop, pour kerosene in it and see if it works and then start making adjustments from there. Alcohol stoves are pretty cheap around here because folks are pulling them out in favor of something else. When you find something that works, get the alcohol stove you like and then apply what you learned.
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  #12  
Old 06-13-2012
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

The Dickenson carb can run well on light stove oil or diesel. Never tried it on kero .The primus preheat burner types tend not to like the heavy stuff and will require a lot deckhead cleaning. Price of fuel keeps me heating with wood and cooking with barbi on deck or electric below .If plugged in ,easy. If cruising may have to plan a bit and run the Kybota for galley, freezer and recharge.It also can haul the anchor (hydraulic) so my life is full of executive decisions but the best is the Panasonic microwave /convection oven. If I save 10 bucks a day to not run the Atlantic stove unless it's a cold ,dark and stormy night i've got my Appletons for free.
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

I don't see any reason why new Primus burners couldn't replace the guts in a nice pressure alcohol stove (if you go for kero) The boat stuff stores here are full of Dickinson stoves as everybody went to propane.
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

erps, great video! A whale under the keel.... explain that feeling to the nautically challenged! Wonderful...

In following everyones thoughts further it occurred to me that the way to look at this is; in an ideal world (for my boat anyways) I'd love to try diesel for the main fuel for everything. My history with kero has been favorable and I have wondered about using straight diesel, but I have never seen it in use for a stove or heater. My boat is certainly tanked for it. In thinking about this does anyone have any experience with diesel for the stove fuel? I am used to the obvious fume issue from kero... I wonder if diesel is much different?

The thoughts you have posted are steering me toward looking for a used alcohol stove and converting it. Looking further into that would anyone know of a PROVEN REPUTABLE dealer for the primus parts for kero and also a link to parts or information for diesel stoves?

Thanks!
Sail on!

ps. this photo is of Aperio after she first arrived from Florida last November. My son (14 y.o) and I are just finishing the site work for the roof structure under which she will live for the refit. Hope to have the roof up within a month or so.

J.
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Old 06-13-2012
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

The biggest problem you would have with running diesel through a kerosene stove is the smell and the fumes. With the burners set for kero they would go apeshite if you loaded them up with diesel and the soot would probably drive you from the boat.

That is not to say that a properly configured diesel stove is smelly or dirty.

I'd be interested to know where you intend sailing ? Reason for asking is twofold. First, if you intend heading for warmer climes then for mine a diesel or kero stove would be damned uncomfortable to live with , even LPG heats a cabin up in summer and secondly why do you think LPG is difficult to obtain outside of the USA ? In our part of the world LPG is probably the most common fuel for on board use and in SE Asia and the Oceanian Islands it is replacing or indeed has replaced most other portable fuel sources and in ten years time it will be even more firmly entrenched than now.
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Old 06-13-2012
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UsailIbail! View Post
My question remains... can an alcohol stove be readily refit into a kerosene? or are they completely different.
NO. only way it could work is to scavenge the burner/s out of a kerosene heater. It's a cage burner that super heats the kero as it wicks up to the burner ring.
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Old 06-14-2012
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

If the alcohol stove is the optimus/primus burner only need to change jets.orfice.
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

Usail

I also lived with Kerosene on my previous boat for many years without any problems. A 20 liter jug lasted many months. Available anywhere there is an airport. I had a pressurized tank that needed pumping (bicycle pump) twice a week and filling once a month out of the jug. This is for everyday cooking. No soot, no flare ups, no smell and a tiny bit of alcohol to preheat on any weather. Never had to clean the burners. Had blue flame all the time.
The only problem I ever had was a bad purchase of dirty Kero from a fisherman supplier in the Azores, cause I was lazy to go to the airport - jet fuel is very clean kerosene.
I converted my stove from a Shipmate alcohol, but I bought a conversion kit which included the manifold and four burners (1 for the oven) from Force Ten out in Vancouver Canada, they used to make conversion kits.
I wish I had a picture of the manifold - I wonder if it was a basic distribution. The burners I bought were made by Patria, in Portugal and I found they are still sold here:
Patria 207 Regulating Burner Kerosene / Alc. (Portugal) [Patria Part #207K/207A] - $75.00 : A & H Enterprises, A & H Enterprises is the only North American service center for Optimus and Svea stoves.


At $75, pricey, but unlike the gas one, they last forever.

If you find a way to build the manifold, please let me know as I am also thinking about going back to kerosene.
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UsailIbail! View Post
Thanks for your replies. There is no question that I will be ripping the LPG system out - for many reasons, firstly being availability of LPG worldwide. I plan on departing the US within months of launching and kero or diesel is everywhere. Secondly, I am familiar with many deaths and injuries from LPG - as a full time firefighter I see its effects all the time. There is an entire house missing less than one mile down the street from my home... few pieces found were larger than 4' x 4'!. You can have all the LPG in your enclosed space that you like and you can depend on all the electronics you can muster to keep an eye on you. Salt air kills electronics, LPG kills boats. Don't mean to be rude here... just clear. Forgive me.

Flare ups on the kero stove were always entertaining - but never much more than that.

Thanks for the thoughts on the alcohol stove. The 38'er that I lived on nearly burned to the ground from an alcohol fire prior to my purchasing it. The owner was a world sailor who had a bad day with his stove. He was severely burned in the event. The reason I mention alcohol stoves is only to consider them as a unit to change over to kero. I am wondering at this point if anyone can target that question specifically. Thanks! I hope you don't think I am rude in this post. I am just clear that I love the kero! Yup! I hadn't mentioned that the same fuel line may go to my heater, pending the stove does not have one built in.

Jay
Thank you for the first-hand report on the effects of propane. I am absolutely with you there. As some propane-proponent said earlier in this thread, when used correctly propane is 'quite safe.' Sorry, that does not cut it for me! It is my life and that of my family that is at stake, 'quite safe' is not good enough!

The only reason for the popularity of propane that I can see is that it is just as at home. I admit I have used propane, on charter boats where I had no choice, but there is no way I am going to give up my kerosene stove on my own boat.

Finally, to your question: The answer is an unqualified YES. If you have a pressurized alcohol stove (we are obviously not talking about the wicked versions), the only thing you have to change are the burners. I have a converted pressurized alcohol stove myself that I run for more than 10 years now.

And, for the nay-sayers, a properly tuned and operated kerosene stove does NOT smell. And even though kero (paraffine, jet fuel, ...) is available world-wide and incredibly cheap, this is not the reason why I use it, it is the inherent safety of the fuel.
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Re: Difference between alcohol & kerosene stove?

Thank you all very much. Your replies give me a very solid start and now at least I have an idea what direction I can move in.

I did not know about the aviation fuel being kerosene... a very good thing to know!

To answer the question where am I going with this vessel? The short answer is that after a few deaths of my closest friends recently I realized that prior to leaving this wonderful planet for good, I would very much like to at least see it. I have read many of the books written by those who have managed to make the trip in a way similar to my requirements (not much cash, but fairly handy with the tools). Previously, I lived on my wooden double ender between Maine (USA) and South America. I tried to talk my fiance into making the big loop and she didn't have any interest. She is still of the same opinion. But I came to realize that now is the time for me to go... on my own if need be. I only hope I am able to survive long enough to complete the event! Departing when the kids are old enough to make the decision whether or not they want to climb aboard. Sure hope they do! Not many others I know understand the drive... it is so strong I am not able to describe it.

Life is not just 'good'.... it's awesome.

Sail on!
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