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  #31  
Old 08-04-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayton49 View Post
The aft cabin on the Catalina looks something like the MRI I had to be removed from after realizing I had become claustrophobic at some point. That being said its good to know a smaller boat could still have a large enough berth for our needs. Checking it out in person should give me a better idea. Boat show here we come.

I've been in an MRI machine and I have a Catalina 380. There is NO comparison. There is a lot more room than it appears in the photo. Plenty of room to read in an inclined position. We don't live aboard by we have been on board for a week at a time and space in the aft cabin has not been an issue.

Would be interested to know what you end up with.
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  #32  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by elspru View Post
We sleep on a single twin size bed (the smallest mattress size), though I'm 5'8" and she's 5'4".
We tried a queen once, but it was too big, and not cuddly enough so we threw it out.
On our single our cat oftentimes sleeps under or betwixt our feet.

Personally I'd rather stay away from those large boats that can't be singlehanded, else how would we take shifts?
Also the bigger the boat, the bigger the "Boom", which is bad enough if someone gets caught on a dinghy.
Also bigger boats have more draught so have fewer places to go, and have to be farther from shore.

We were planning on something in the 24-30ft range,
that we can buy in cash, as have intense aversion to debt.
That way as soon as we buy something, can save for next thing.

We do intend on having a landbase later on also,
so can dock and do various projects, like boat building,
permaculture provisioning, resource harvesting and storage.
Hopefully by then the canadian residential bubble will burst,
if so perhaps we could get a place big enough for a marina.
We have a Ta Chiao CT 56, ketch, and we can single hand her. She has a 6.5 foot draft. We also have a walk around queen size aft bunk, with couches on either side of that; and 2 other staterooms, with 2 heads and 2 stall showers. She also has a washer and dryer, a full galley, a dinette, a large main salon with a spacious floor instead of a narrow path.... etc., etc.

So, some people can live in a very confined space, and some of them will rationalize why they like that; but others choose to live more comfortably, without having to rationalize anything.

Choose what you want, but don't tell me you have to live in a little boat.
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  #33  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by DougSabbag View Post

So, some people can live in a very confined space, and some of them will rationalize why they like that; but others choose to live more comfortably, without having to rationalize anything.

Choose what you want, but don't tell me you have to live in a little boat.
I can't speak for the poster in question , but I CHOOSE a little boat- I don't have to rationalize anything.
Do you have to rationalize coming across as a condescending jerk, doug?
For a guy trying to make a living in the charter (aka customer service) business, your posts filled with arrogance and insulting condescension demonstrates that your people skills just plain suck.
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  #34  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

I've recently written a page on my website on the risks and rewards of living aboard which includes the issue regarding personal relationships. At the risk of breaking the forum rules here's a link to it:~
How Living Aboard a Sailboat Worked Out for the Crew of Alacazam
Moderator ~ Are you happy with this? If not, profuse apologies...
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Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayton49 View Post
I'm looking to live aboard in a few years with my wife. We will be empty nesters and would love to hear from other couples that are in the process of moving to the lifestyle or have been living aboard. How has the stress of the change and limited space affected your relationship? What stories do you have you wouldn't mind sharing with us. My wife and I have a very strong relationship and we complement each other very well. Hopefully living in such close quarters all the time won't change that. One more thing, has anyone seen a sailboat not 70 feet or more that has a Queen/King size berth one thing that would make the transition easier for my wife, I tend to be a bed hog maybe because Iím 6í2 and not small.
Don't take this offensively even though it may come off that way, but have you thought about loosing some weight in the first place? I don't mean it just to be able to fit in a boat or particular size bed, which would be the most ridiculous reason in the world, but for all the other benefits in addition to it. It certainly would make a world of difference in your health, you relationship, your way of living in general, your comfort 24/7, and would help you enjoy life in general much more. Despite you being 6'2", it will feel like you are another person all of the sudden. Most of us carry too much baggage (in other words, we are too fat) and continuously try to compensate by getting bigger everything around us instead of trying to address the problem in the first place. Just a suggestion!!

I know it is un-american to suggest you loose some weight rather than buying a much bigger boat and spending more money in buying something instead, but I will take one for the team
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  #36  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones View Post
I can't speak for the poster in question , but I CHOOSE a little boat- I don't have to rationalize anything.
Do you have to rationalize coming across as a condescending jerk, doug?
For a guy trying to make a living in the charter (aka customer service) business, your posts filled with arrogance and insulting condescension demonstrates that your people skills just plain suck.

And your tone and speaking skills are something to be applauded? REally?

As far as the discussion which you are commenting on, the gentleman who I replied to had indicated that only a small boat, (30 footer), could be single handed. Which therefore came with the sleeping accomodations of a twin bed for he and his partner.

I felt the inspiration to point out to the general population, and specifically the original poster, that you actually do not have to have such a small boat to single hand her.

And, yes, I used the word "rationalize" because from my view that is what that poster was doing, perhaps more to himself and his partner than seriously to us, as his reasoning for their limited accomodations.

I could better accept someone saying that they selected a smaller boat in order to experience the greater speed and manueverabilty vs. a heavy displacement vessel. But, not that only small boats can be single handed.

I have solo sailed 50 + footers, for decades, as many others may also do, and can simply not mutely read that this is not possible.

This thread might be read by future or hopeful liveaboard people and I felt they should have a wider range of experiences to draw from, which they could make better informed decsions from.

I am sorry that you feel that my support of a larger displacement yacht is perceived as condescending to you; however, for a liveaboard vessel I honestly feel that size does matter, and shouldn't be kept out of the discussion in order to avoid hurting someones' feelings.

I have had my share of a "hard life", probably much worse than yours, so I have worked very hard to build my life into one in which my wife and I can be as comfortable as possible. There is nothing wrong with that, and nobody should fault us for our "success". If you don't like to hear it, or see it, don't look at it.

But, calling me names and such, is not the mature or adult response to that which might be beyond your reach.
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  #37  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by dgasmd View Post
Don't take this offensively even though it may come off that way, but have you thought about loosing some weight in the first place? I don't mean it just to be able to fit in a boat or particular size bed, which would be the most ridiculous reason in the world, but for all the other benefits in addition to it. It certainly would make a world of difference in your health, you relationship, your way of living in general, your comfort 24/7, and would help you enjoy life in general much more. Despite you being 6'2", it will feel like you are another person all of the sudden. Most of us carry too much baggage (in other words, we are too fat) and continuously try to compensate by getting bigger everything around us instead of trying to address the problem in the first place. Just a suggestion!!

I know it is un-american to suggest you loose some weight rather than buying a much bigger boat and spending more money in buying something instead, but I will take one for the team
Oh come on man..... the poster was nicely asking for some honest information toward he and his wife reaching for the liveaboard life and you suggest weight watchers?

He and his wife want a comfortable spacious vessel. There is nothing wrong with that, and that is quite easily obtained. Provide your knowledge toward his goal instead of your anti-obesity rhetoric.

To the original poster.... Buy as big a boat as you can afford. Weight watchers is for an entirely different web site.
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  #38  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Doug, the problem with "buy as big a boat as you can afford" is that only a more experienced person knows what that implies. I wonder if someone new to to boating wouldn't be taking on too much with a 50+ footer? There is a lot to learn about managing a complex boat, not to mention sailing and docking (which I agree with you on- no big deal to do singlehanded once you have the experience). I have to say that I think my 35ft boat is just about ideal for me and my family. I have all the comforts I need and have kept the systems as simple as possible. I can handle all the maintenance and it takes only a few minutes to put up the sails to go sailing (and a few to put the boat to bed). It's very comfortable inside and the cockpit is better than any I've seen on any boat to date. The best part is that we don't feel like we're slaves to the boat- always fixing, cleaning, adjusting, revamping, resealing, repairing and so on. There are people who are happy living on small boats and people who are happy living on big boats. The challenge is knowing what size you need BEFORE you have the experience of living on both big and small boats. I think that a smaller boat has so many advantages over a big boat, but that's just me. However, I would only consider a small boat that had exceptional storage so that EVERYTHING is stowed in its place. There is NOTHING worse than a cluttered small boat!
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  #39  
Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by copacabana View Post
Doug, the problem with "buy as big a boat as you can afford" is that only a more experienced person knows what that implies. I wonder if someone new to to boating wouldn't be taking on too much with a 50+ footer? There is a lot to learn about managing a complex boat, not to mention sailing and docking (which I agree with you on- no big deal to do singlehanded once you have the experience). I have to say that I think my 35ft boat is just about ideal for me and my family. I have all the comforts I need and have kept the systems as simple as possible. I can handle all the maintenance and it takes only a few minutes to put up the sails to go sailing (and a few to put the boat to bed). It's very comfortable inside and the cockpit is better than any I've seen on any boat to date. The best part is that we don't feel like we're slaves to the boat- always fixing, cleaning, adjusting, revamping, resealing, repairing and so on. There are people who are happy living on small boats and people who are happy living on big boats. The challenge is knowing what size you need BEFORE you have the experience of living on both big and small boats. I think that a smaller boat has so many advantages over a big boat, but that's just me. However, I would only consider a small boat that had exceptional storage so that EVERYTHING is stowed in its place. There is NOTHING worse than a cluttered small boat!
Good points..... but, for a liveaboard, I'd rather start with the largest possible and learn that, then when that phase is behind me, we have the space for comfortable living.
When we had the 50 foot GulfStar, as large as that was, when we were in the main salon, there was only a relatively small area between the opposing settee and couch to walk through. So, when we both wanted to move / walk, it was a tight maneuver to walk past each other. The boat we have now has an open floor space, which is large enough to dance upon.
:-)
As far as the amount of time it takes to raise or lower the sails, well, there might be a few seconds more time to raise each of them, just because they are a bit higher, but I'm not in the Americas Cup racing, so a few seconds isn't anything of value to me.
I still have one halyard for one sail, and a pair of sheets per forward sail(s).
I haven't noticed any additional hassles or time to deploy those, or furl them either. It is the same configuration, the same lines, just slightly longer, and or, slightly larger all the way around.

As far as docking, the bigger the boat, as I have experienced, the smoother she pulls into or leaves a dock. This boat is 65,000 lbs., with a full keel and a 135 hp Ford Lehman. It has hydraulic steering too. As I learned a long time ago, for dock maneuvers, go as slow as you can, and with this larger boat, the currents and wind have a much lower influence on the boat when docking. Clearly a lighter boat will be more easily affected by those influences. This one is like a slow moving train, which requires a lot more energy to make it deviate from where I am directing her to go.

As far as keeping her "simple", from the key in the ignition to the throttle / shifter controls, to the lines / sheets, and the navigation equipment, all of these I had in a smaller boat, and are neither new things to deal with, nor are they any more involved than the smaller boat ones. Depth, wind velocity / direction, auto helm, SOG, etc., are the same issues regardless of size.

And, if I have a bigger "family" onboard, everyone is out of the way, more often than not, instead of having to be directed where to sit, or where to go.

More space will require more sandpaper and varnish, without any argument.
Longer wires if you need to add a device are required, larger tanks to clean, bigger sheets for the bigger beds, larger tables to wipe down, larger shower stalls to wash the walls of, bigger floor space to vacuum or mop, more windows and port lights to clean, bigger couches to fluff the pillows on, and all the other slightly greater tasks involved with a larger living space are unarguably more not less laborious. But, do I really mind having to vacuum or mop more than a small walk way so much that I don't like a spacious floor plan? Really? No, I like having the space and have never minded maintaining it.

Even maintaining the engine is basically the same. There is one oil filter, one input and return fuel line, etc., though it does contain more oil.... and instead of one gallon per hour this runs 2 gallons per hour, including the 8 kw diesel generator.... not a real problem, considering I generally run the motr for about 1 hour at the most from the dock until I raise the larger sails, and then press the same size engine kill button to turn that off.... :-)

It isn't any more complex than the smaller one, just stronger, and bigger.

What I have already mentioned is not a "plus" vs a smaller sailboat is the amount of low wind speed, and maneuverability. A large displacement boat requires more wind to move along, requires more space to turn around in, and is clearly not as "nimble".

I could also mention that it requires bigger waves to rock us! I have been delighted by the fact that when a motor boat goes flying by me, I am barely affected!!!! Cool, VERY cool!

So, all in all, my "family" is more comfortable, and less bounced around, not to mention SAFER since they are less likely to break a rib by being thrown around, or worse yet, thrown overboard.

Come on out with me, and note how relaxing it is being able to really stretch out, and remain that way while you read a book, or just watch the waves go by the hull.

This isn't camping out, this is comfortable relaxing living; and isn't that what a liveaborad should be?
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Old 08-06-2012
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Re: Couples living aboard how goes the relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by DougSabbag View Post
And your tone and speaking skills are something to be applauded? REally?

As far as the discussion which you are commenting on, the gentleman who I replied to had indicated that only a small boat, (30 footer), could be single handed. Which therefore came with the sleeping accomodations of a twin bed for he and his partner.

I felt the inspiration to point out to the general population, and specifically the original poster, that you actually do not have to have such a small boat to single hand her.

And, yes, I used the word "rationalize" because from my view that is what that poster was doing, perhaps more to himself and his partner than seriously to us, as his reasoning for their limited accomodations.

I could better accept someone saying that they selected a smaller boat in order to experience the greater speed and manueverabilty vs. a heavy displacement vessel. But, not that only small boats can be single handed.

I have solo sailed 50 + footers, for decades, as many others may also do, and can simply not mutely read that this is not possible.

This thread might be read by future or hopeful liveaboard people and I felt they should have a wider range of experiences to draw from, which they could make better informed decsions from.

I am sorry that you feel that my support of a larger displacement yacht is perceived as condescending to you; however, for a liveaboard vessel I honestly feel that size does matter, and shouldn't be kept out of the discussion in order to avoid hurting someones' feelings.

I have had my share of a "hard life", probably much worse than yours, so I have worked very hard to build my life into one in which my wife and I can be as comfortable as possible. There is nothing wrong with that, and nobody should fault us for our "success". If you don't like to hear it, or see it, don't look at it.

But, calling me names and such, is not the mature or adult response to that which might be beyond your reach.
Don't attempt to make your problem my problem, Doug. I don't care to hear about your rationalization for owning a big boat because a) it's not that interesting and b) has nothing to do with the topic at hand, unless your reason for buying the biggest boat your insurance company will pay for is so that your wife has some room to escape your overbearing oversized over rationalizing ego.
Whatever, Doug, you keep rationalizing your boat, your attitude, your philosophy, your overcompensation, you do whatever you have to do to justify why you react the way you do, and i will continue to charter from someone else...
because folks who sail small boats often do so , so they can afford to charter bigger boats once or twice a year... and they likely won't charter from a captain who sneers at their choice of primary vessel.
It might behoove you to learn about search engines, SEO and how your snailtrail follows you when you use the web.


You could have taken my post in the manner it was intended, viewed it constructively.and taken it to heart. instead ,you chose to continue to be you. Good luck.


BTW, regarding "name calling"- I call 'em as i see 'em- you wouldn't get your Hanes in a hitch if i called you a genius, master seaman, or a sailor extraodinaire, so don't start whining when you get called something you DON'T like. If you don't like what i and others have called you, the problem isn't me.
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Last edited by bljones; 08-06-2012 at 09:23 PM. Reason: clarification
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