So, how do I prepare for a 5 year cruise with kids? - Page 14 - SailNet Community

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Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Cruising and Sailing with Children
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Cruising and Sailing with Children All things sailing and kids related, from safety to life aboard.


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  #131  
Old 01-01-2008
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You can probably find a Hallberg Rassy Rasmus in that price range. It's 35 LOA IIRC.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
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—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #132  
Old 01-01-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
You can probably find a Hallberg Rassy Rasmus in that price range. It's 35 LOA IIRC.
Yup, but then we'd be committing to a 1970s boat vs. a late eighties or early nineties Westerly.

Most of the HR Rasmus boats we've seen so far have been less expensive (around $70k), but in rougher shape, and I'm not a fan of the long side galley interior design. Example:

http://ybw.yachtworld.com/core/uk/li...50289&url=true

In contrast, consider this 1990 Westerly Oceanranger with a new engine:

http://ybw.yachtworld.com/core/uk/li...29864&url=true

The difference is significant in the asking prices ($70k vs. $130k), but I haven't seen heavily updated 1970s Rasmus boats yet that I'd consider in the same league. The newer HR 352s seem to start in the $165,000 range over here. So, it all seems to be a matter of steps.

We don't need a 1990s boat, but I'd rather stay in the range of 1985 or newer, unless there was something really amazing from the 1970s (usually in the range of lavishly updated and maintained by a previous owner to pristine condition.)
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Last edited by Jim H; 01-01-2008 at 12:42 PM.
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  #133  
Old 01-01-2008
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A friend of mine has one that is in wonderful shape... That's pretty much the only reason I mentioned them.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #134  
Old 01-01-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim H View Post

The only thing we really hate about these plans is that we don't sail as a family. Both of our kids are really keyed up about taking Opti sailing courses in the spring, and I will buy them an opti if they love the courses and want to sail at Welsh Harp resevoir north of town. That's all good for their learning curve, but it really bugs us that we won't cruise for a week as a family this year, unless we find time to charter in the UK, Europe or Puget Sound.
Don't get worried about this: I consider it a plus. My wife and I are crewing separately on purpose, and my son will do Optimist this year, naturally alone. I think it's important that everyone learn at his/her own pace and that everyone brings their own experience in a variety of conditions to the table. Why? Because everyone (including the kid if he takes short watches by 11 or 12 years of age) *is captain of that watch*.

My wife is less experienced than I am and needs the most "beefing up". She is taking nav courses this winter that I took seven years ago, and I want her to crew on a delivery, preferably U.S. to B.V.I.s or something well-travelled. That way, she'll gain experience and skills that I *don't* currently possess, and which will be complementary to my own. Similarly, if my kid takes dinghy sailing for a few years, he'll bring something to the table in the form of sail trim I might not possess, because I've never sailed dinghies.

Sailing as a family is great for the interpersonal dynamic side of things, but on passage, there is usually only one person in charge. Even if I am "captain", if I wake up from a four-hour nap, it is my wife who will have made all the decisions...which I am unlikely to second-guess until I have woken up and apprised the situation.

The alternative is that you are the captain 24/7 and your crew can't grow into the semi-autonomous roles necessary. The sea is a dynamic system, and this must be mirrored in the "command structure" of the boat. In a time of crisis, one person may naturally fall into the role of leader due to aggregate experience, skills and even strength. But if, say, I sustained a concussion in a knock-down, I would hope that my wife would know how to save the boat (and our lives) by taking charge.

Besides, I'm the better cook. Galley slave holds no terrors for me!
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  #135  
Old 01-01-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valiente View Post
I think it's important that everyone learn at his/her own pace and that everyone brings their own experience in a variety of conditions to the table. Why? Because everyone (including the kid if he takes short watches by 11 or 12 years of age) *is captain of that watch*.
I don't disagree. My wife took all of her ASA certifications on her own, and my son did Opti classes for two summers on his own. I'm glad we're doing the RYA certs the same way, and that my daughter is now going to sail an Opti on her own. The independence is great.

It's just that I'm going to miss the day sails that we used to do on our Cal 20 and C&C 27 together, and the weekend trips. I'll also miss the week-long charters on Puget Sound. They didn't replace the independent learning, but complimented it with the family sailing together. Learning to work together as a crew, and taking on shared roles, is something I'm loathe to forgo for a year.

Anyway, it's just another challenge-- either to find time to charter, or figure out how to afford something long-term as our local boat. I'm gradually figuring out how moorings are done here, and what different ones cost, and hopefully I'll find something that fits the bill. (I have to admit I'm missing the $85 a month private slip on Columbia river we had ).

BTW, at the moment my wife is actually ahead of me on RYA certifications, and don't imagine that she doesn't remind me of it frequently... It's cool that you want your wife to do a delivery, and we had friends in the Pacific Northwest who did that around the globe for years. Not commercial deliveries, but sailing back race boats after events. An example is Oregon Offshore-- after the race from Astoria to Puget Sound, an entire second crew would sail a fair number of the boats back to Portland, Oregon, and get their first, low-stress off-shore experience in the process (on safe, certified and safely equipped boats).
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  #136  
Old 01-01-2008
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Valiente-

Sounds like a very sensible approach to prepping crew for the upcoming trip.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #137  
Old 01-01-2008
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We're doing what we can. I know two things about my wife, one of which she has great potential as a sailor, and the other of which is she doesn't much like being at a knowledge disadvantage to me...I don't like that either. Having a steel boat is helping her learn how to dock, at least...it's only paint.
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  #138  
Old 01-02-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ladyh View Post
Do it for your kids.....look a a used Amel....great family cruising boat......and my thoughts on cruising


Go Cruising Now

When should one go cruising??? I asked myself that question 1000’s of times when I was still tied to land. I define happiness as living my dream of cruising…. The following was emailed to me………how true it is….I think back over the last 2 ˝ yrs and all the cruiser WANT2B’s who would want to ask this cruiser the same questions I asked for the last 20 yrs as my wife and I chartered sailboats in the Caribbean and other exotic places where the CRUISER migrated because he could…. 98% of these WANT2B’s never go because the wait till…………..
My Father, God bless his sole worked till he was 62….yes he retired a few years early…but died 2 yrs later….no he did not go fish all those trout and steelhead rivers he always dreamed of while working…..cut the land lines and GO…and Go NOW.


I'll be happy when...
>
> We convince ourselves that life will be better after we get married, have a baby, then another. Then we are frustrated that the kids aren't old enough and we'll be more content when they are. After that, we're frustrated that we have teenagers to deal with. We will certainly be happy when they are out of that stage. We tell ourselves that our life will be complete when our spouse gets his or her act together, when
we get a nicer car, when we are able to go on a nice vacation or when we retire. The truth is there's no better time to be happy than right now. If not now, when? Your life will always be filled with challenges.
>
> It's best to admit this to yourself and decide to be happy anyway. Happiness is the way. So, treasure every moment that you have and treasure it more because you shared it with someone special, special enough to spend your time with .... and remember that time waits for no
one.
> So, stop waiting ...
> Until your car or home is paid off.
> Until you get a new car or home.
> Until your kids leave the house.
> Until you go back to school.
> Until you finish school.
> Until you lose 10 lbs.
> Until you gain 10 lbs.
> Until you get married.
> Until you get a divorce.
> Until you have kids.
> Until the kids have graduated from college
> Until you retire.
> Until summer..
> Until spring.
> Until winter.
> Until the boat is paid for.
> Until fall.
> Until you die.
>
> There is no better time than right now to be happy. Happiness is a
journey, not a destination. So work like you don't need money, love
like you've never been hurt, and, dance like no one's watching.


I would have liked to recieved that 10 yrs ago....the the wife would have made the trip...she did always want a " boat baby"...funny thing....boat kids do better in college...and in life ....cruising is unique...special people....with a different slant on life....Capt Paul>






Great post......... just what the doctor ordered...... thanks
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  #139  
Old 03-29-2008
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A quick update on this thread.

I still like the original premise of the thread, but I haven't been able to work out the sustainability elements of how to afford to leave, cruise, and then return and still have something for the kids' college tuition etc.

It could still work, especially if my wife and I taught English as we cruised, but since the start of this thread in May 2006, we've done a lot of thinking and acting. We've owned a 27 footer and now a 34 footer. We moved overseas. We've progressively built on our experience base both individually and as a family.

More than anything, building on the experience base has been the number one priority. That's maybe the best answer to the question posed in the title of this thread.

To build on the experience base is expensive, though. It may mean that you don't exclusively save for the cruising kitty, for example. I think that's the main paradox. To save for the cruising kitty, you should live like you are already cruising, minimize expenses, etc. That would also mean not chartering too much, or owning interim boats, until you are within 2 years of departing and then you buy “the boat” and starting pumping money in it.

In the end, I think this approach is flawed. It's too much “putting off” for something “big” in the future, instead of just doing all you can in the present and seeing what happens. I guess I've seen too many examples of the big boat being saved for, bought, prepped, and then the trip either doesn't happen or is cut short for one of a million reasons. Too much investment risk, maybe.

Anyway, that's our excuse for owning a 34 footer now, instead of saving for some 40-42 footer in the future. (I still haven't seen a 42 foot cruising baot that I'd day sail for fun....) We get to sail now, learn more, and see what happens. That's the plan really-- sail and see what happens.

I'll post a report from our English Channel and Solent sailing last week later this afternoon. For an alternative view, see the Rard website, where they did go for the multi-year break with their kids--
Ruby Slippers » Rard Family Ocean Adventure

Meanwhile, here's a pic from yesterday:



Fair winds!
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Last edited by Jim H; 03-29-2008 at 01:05 PM.
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  #140  
Old 03-29-2008
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Actually, Jim, we take our "barge" out for daysails frequently. It's our break from otherwise thinking of it as a construction site.

We also stay on the boat even at dock a fair bit, because the boat has A/C and our poor old house doesn't!
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