Cuba?

[ccam]

Originally Posted by Valiente

Careful, or what? You'll bring democracy to my country?

Maybe thats what you need!
"Canada is not a democracy in the strictest sense of the word, but rather can be aptly described as a Constitutional Monarchy. The highest ranking official in government is not an elected representative, not even a Canadian (residing in or born in), but rather an un-elected British monarch."

Originally Posted by Valiente

Ask this young woman about the concept of "justice for all".

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/Story?id=3977702&page=1

In a war torn country it is very very dangerous to be a woman. I hope she recovers, but what about your pristine civilized neighborhood. Statistics show one in four Canadian women will be sexually assaulted during her lifetime. ( J. Brickman and J. Briere, "Incidence of Rape and Sexual Assault in an Urban Canadian Population.
A survey on date rape showed that 60% of Canadian college-aged males indicated that they would commit sexual assault if they were certain they would not get caught. (Helen Lenskyj, "An Analysis of Violence Against Women.

Originally Posted by Valiente

Ask the prisoners in your gulags.

Hey Val, our prisoners are Taliban Terrorist. Lets see what Canada has:
[Former political prisoner Brad Love, who was sentenced, in 2003, to
18 months in prison for writing non-threatening letters to public
officials, keeps his writing skills sharp with his comments from
Alberta. He served two further terms for writing non-threatening
letters to other politicians and newspapers for alleged "breach of
probation" gag orders, yes, here in Canada, not in North Korea or
Burma.]
Back in the diverse (crime-ridden) City of Toronto, free speacher Paul
Fromm lost his teaching certificate due to his alleged ties to others
who utter truths most others only dare to whisper. What a joke this
is. Our school system is riddled with left wingers, black militants,
porno addicts, holocaust preachers, radical Israelis, advocating
homosexuals, all with their own agendas and never shy to mouth off
about it. Yet, the Peel School Board under pressure from Jewish groups
of which there are very few in Peel, strained with all their might
(and your tax $$$) to silence one man whom the majority in Canada (or
are we the minority now?) agree with anyway.

Brad
Fort McMurray, Alberta
Dominion of Canada
---------------------------------------
Canada's Crime Rate 50 % Higher than U.S.
2006 Press reports that Canada is a Shangri-la –
In fact, statistics show that the violent crime rate there is double that of the United States
-----------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Valiente

Ask your offshored torture victims. Ask the vets in your hospitals trying to get the benefits and care promised to them. Ask countries with DIRECT elections of their executives, not with convenient, anarchronistic fudge factors like "the electoral college". Either reform your behaviour on the world stage, or embrace your will to power and really start with the camp-building and the "Hank Wessel Song". This mincing about pretending to have republican values is getting tiresome.

The Electoral College does serve a purpose Val-
-contributes to the cohesiveness of the country by requiring a distribution of popular support to be elected president(Niether California nor Mass. can decide the election, It kinda of prevents another civil war)
-enhances the status of minority interests,
-contributes to the political stability of the nation by encouraging a two-party system, and maintains a federal system of government and representation.

Ok Val, we will take care of our problems and you sir should take care of yours. Hey Val, by the way, your posts on sailing related subjects are outstanding I enjoy reading them. But, bashing your favorite citizens to the south is not only impolite, but down right rude! Fair Winds!

[vadimgo]

Since we sailors majority do not vote together, as opposed to the vocal SoFlorida minority...
Iron curtian supposedly is down and a freedom to sail to any place should be part of the overall FREEDOM. But obviously we do not live in a perfect world.

So, take a plane to Cuba if you insist, or hope for the better

[tommyt]

Val,

You know I enjoy your company over a beer, dinner, and sailing. I usually agree most of the time with your sailing posts here. I remember telling you as we walked around Villamoura that politics was off limits as we were not going to agree, and what I or you thought about American or Canadian politics was not going to sway either of us. We agreed to disagree and had a beer instead. However, in this post, you are just way out of line. You really need to get your head out of that very dark place you have it. There Cam, I showed restraint and did not say ass!

The US is a country of WE the people. WE elect our politicians, and yes sometimes they disapoint us. I think that happens in other countries where they have the freedom to vote as well. You can't say that our politicians and our policies are horrible but the people are nice any more than you can say all American women are ugly, "except your wife of course", and not get in a pissing contest. This is our government and we do have a say in it if we participate. There has to be a reason that the PEOPLE in other countries that you are trying to protect from us, Cuba certainly a good example, risk their lives to get here. Why?

Certainly we have those that have elected out of the process and just bitch in hindsite, but that is OK. In fact, there are many of us that are happy that they elect out because they are the same ones that usually just pull the party lever and walk away. Thought...whats that? There are certainly a few on this thread that seem to fit that slot fairly well. Bitch...and do nothing! Except bitch of course!

Unlike Rick, I do hope that you stop and shop along the way. Our economy is based on consumerism. And, we don't have a minimum bank balance to let you in. Stop, spend some time, and please spend your money.

[Cruisingdad]

I find myself having to walk a thin line between being a patriot of my country and the moderator at sailnet. As such, I will withold any and all comments on my opinions of these posts.

That being said, I find the tone of this thread to be offensive to Canadians and Americans. I think it is time we stopped openly criticising each others country. I feel by doing so we promote hostility toward each other where there would normally not any. In essence, if you hate Canada or hate America (or any other country for that matter), keep it to yourself.

I will give slightly more lattitude to the Off Topic forum, but not here. And even in the Off Topic forum, I feel my patience is wearing thin.

No more.

- CD

[PorFin]

CD,

Thanks for your admonition, and efforts to return civility to the net.

Now, to bring it back more in line with the OP, here's some news:

A US vessel (Gulfstar 50) with a family of five aboard recently put into a port in eastern Cuba with serious rudder damage. The Cuban authorities were not overly helpful in securing assistance for the Captain to effect repairs. However after pointed inquiries made by State Department and USCG officials in Havana, the vessel was towed to a port in which temporary repairs may be possible.

Initially, the Cubans demanded that the vessel put to sea in spite of the fact that the vessel would have been difficult -- if not impossible -- to control.

Yet another reason anyone should seriously ask themselves "Why do I really want to cruise to Cuba?"

[sailusvi]

I do believe there will be great opportunity there in the near future....IMO.

Originally Posted by pedrodelrio

I advise them not to under the current circumstances. Regime change--theirs and ours--is not far off.



Peter Swanson

[Cruisingdad]

Originally Posted by RickBowman

CD,

I am wondering why that it took you 3 weeks to arrive at your conclusion? My chief complaint with this particular thread has zero to do with patriotism but wiith civility, decency and politeness to each other. Was the moderators radar screen turned off or ...

Rick

Rick,

Cam and I do our best to read as many posts as we can. However, we absolutely cannot read them all. I spend half my time trying to make sure Paris Hilton stays out. I am already on this board most of the day (believe it or not). Basically: I did not know.

Also, as I said before, it is a fine line we have to walk in trying to keep a unbiased opinion. You may or may not know, but being from S FL, Cuba is a VERY hot topic for me that I decided best to avoid in fear of infuriating many members.

I am trying to be fair to all sides.

- CD

[camaraderie]

Perhaps going forward this thread should be restricted to discussions of Cuba as a destination and the LEGAL requirements for entry/exit rather than opinions on the political side or whether current US law is a good or bad thing. Anyone interested in the political side of the Cuba issued may feel free to start an "off-topic" thread and post there.

[pedrodelrio]

Cam

I second that. That's what I try to do on cubacruising.net, though it isn't easy because politics taints the subject, no matter what your views.

Peter Swanson

[tdw]

Originally Posted by camaraderie

Perhaps going forward this thread should be restricted to discussions of Cuba as a destination and the LEGAL requirements for entry/exit rather than opinions on the political side or whether current US law is a good or bad thing. Anyone interested in the political side of the Cuba issued may feel free to start an "off-topic" thread and post there.

Thouroughly agree with you there Cam. Good of you to take that attitude given your feelings on the matter.

It does become pretty irritating that every time someone mentions the Cuba word it automatically devolves into a political rant. For those of us who do not suffer any legal ramifications should we decide to cruise Cuba that does become damned boring.

Political opinions should be kept isolated in Bedlam aka Off Topic.