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-   -   Yanmar oil filter question (http://www.sailnet.com/forums/diesel/81665-yanmar-oil-filter-question.html)

copacabana 12-12-2011 02:50 PM

Yanmar oil filter question
 
I have a Yanmar 3gm30f engine. When I bought the boat it came with a supply of spare filters. The oil filter is not an original Yanmar filter, but an oil filter for a Renault Clio (gas engine). It's the same size and almost identical in every way. I am wondering if it's wise to use this automotive filter in place of a Yanmar one. It's 1/4th the price of the original Yanmar, but is it going to do the same job for the engine?

Thanks in advance.

hellosailor 12-12-2011 04:37 PM

I'm not a great Renault fan, but by and large if a filter is about the same size, it may have the same internals, and if the filter fits properly, that's what counts. There are A LOT of interchangeable filters for oil, manufacturers want you to believe only gen-you-whine parts are good but when it comes to oil filters, almost any brand name will also carry a warranty against engine damage from a filter failure. Which is a very rare event, but happens even for brand name filters.

They're not all the same--but there's no real way to tell them apart, other than "does it meet the spec for this use" (i.e. pressure and bypass filter and capacity) and changing it often enough.

Some filters will tell you that they are rated for xx% effectiveness at xx microns particle size, but most won't. Mobil and Bosch are among the few that do, and they charge dearly.

NAPA stores tend to be quite resourceful about substitute parts and cross-indexing them.

CalebD 12-12-2011 06:22 PM

Not many NAPA stores in Brazil I'd suspect.
I think the actual filter element for most all brands is made by the same company so the outside label matters little to none.
Buy the filter that fits as HelloSailor suggests. If it does not leak then it could be made by Peugot, Fiat, Renault, Hyundai or ...
Why pay 4 times more for a label on the outside of the filter?

dabnis 12-12-2011 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalebD (Post 805830)
Not many NAPA stores in Brazil I'd suspect.
I think the actual filter element for most all brands is made by the same company so the outside label matters little to none.
Buy the filter that fits as HelloSailor suggests. If it does not leak then it could be made by Peugot, Fiat, Renault, Hyundai or ...
Why pay 4 times more for a label on the outside of the filter?

Different filters may have varying pressure relief valve settings and filtration capacities. When in doubt use "the right stuff". The incremental cost difference may be good insurance, and most people don't use that many filters in a year. Think of it as "you bet your engine" when trying to save a few dollars. Only way to know is to try it. It may be OK for short term but over time if pressures are not proper it could be bad? My opinion, based on my experiences, offered at no cost, and FWIW, your mileage may vary :D

Dabnis

hellosailor 12-12-2011 07:03 PM

"I think the actual filter element for most all brands is made by the same company so the outside label matters little to none."

Sometimes it is worse than that, with the same label, same part number, made by different jobbers so the internals can vary as well. Or even with a prime maker, they may change internals from time to time.

IIRC there's a chunk about filter tear-downs from "bobtheoilguy" on the web, he's literally cut apart dozens of filters to get some idea of just what is inside them.

If you've got an oil pressure guage and it doesn't object to the new filter...I'll spend a buck or two more for a brand name but at 4x the price? I'd bet on filters spec'd for similar displacement engines as being a safe bet. And you know what thye say, what happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas. Including bets on oil filters. :-)

RichH 12-12-2011 08:34 PM

In engine oil filters, the filter material is produced essentially by one world company -Alstr°m of Finland; almost all filter 'assemblers/builders' buy this filter material and then 'assemble' the filters.
Renault filters call for a 20ÁM nominal rated filter material with a bypass pressure relief of 16-19 psi.... and that is the exact same specs. for Yanmar 3GM .... 20ÁM nominal @ 16 psi bypass pressure.

Yanmar makes NO filters but buys all its filters as 'private branded' made by various automotive filter manufacturers.

An engine oil filter is a very crude filter because its a 'recirculation' filter and constantly re-filters and re-filters the same oil over and over again .... so that the 'resident' particles in the oil are probably approaching 1ÁM in actual size ... the carbon fines from combustion are well below 1ÁM and thats why such a filter will allow the 'black' to build up. Changing the filter often is THE most important, ... dont worry about 'brand', use the cheapest (non-Chinese made) you can find.

Its the 'filter material' that is THE important aspect of an automotive oil filter ...... bobtheoilguy.com has no idea what he's talking about and he's skewing the data towards one certain 'brand' do consider that website nothing more than 'slick marketeering'.
FQWI - Im not directly involved in automotive filtration but was deeply involved in 'filtration engineering' for almost 40 years.
:-)

CalebD 12-12-2011 10:13 PM

Paging RichH, clean up in aisle 2.
Oh, I see you have already cleaned up that mess.
I knew I had heard this bit somewhere else before and it was from you.
Our resident expert on filtration: RichH!
Rearrange a few letters and you get: flirtation.
Thanks for confirming my hearsay.

FSMike 12-12-2011 10:23 PM

I once owned a 1500 cc v-twin motorcycle. The aftermarket oil filter was about 1/2 the price of the factory branded one. The factory filter had an anti-drain device which prevented the oil from draining down into the crankcase. This ensured that the engine still had lubricating oil throughout the next time it was started. The after market filter did not have this feature.
Not much relation to marine diesels, just wanted to show that there can be more than one way for filters to differ.

MarkSF 12-13-2011 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hellosailor (Post 805785)
I'm not a great Renault fan, but by and large if a filter is about the same size, it may have the same internals, and if the filter fits properly, that's what counts. There are A LOT of interchangeable filters for oil, manufacturers want you to believe only gen-you-whine parts are good but when it comes to oil filters, almost any brand name will also carry a warranty against engine damage from a filter failure. Which is a very rare event, but happens even for brand name filters.

They're not all the same--but there's no real way to tell them apart, other than "does it meet the spec for this use" (i.e. pressure and bypass filter and capacity) and changing it often enough.

Some filters will tell you that they are rated for xx% effectiveness at xx microns particle size, but most won't. Mobil and Bosch are among the few that do, and they charge dearly.

NAPA stores tend to be quite resourceful about substitute parts and cross-indexing them.

I just paid $3.64 each for 3 Bosch filters for my Universal. Is that dear?

copacabana 12-13-2011 06:49 AM

Thanks for the informed advice. I guess I'll use the spare filters I have on board and then start buying Yanmar or other brands that have the same specs. I just hate paying US$25 for a Yanmar oil filter when the Fram sub costs about 6 dollars ...


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