New to marine networking...NMEA vs. Garmin marine Network? - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance > Electronics
 Not a Member? 
  #1  
Old 11-09-2009
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Denmark
Posts: 11
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
sapster77 is on a distinguished road
Question New to marine networking...NMEA vs. Garmin marine Network?

Hi,

I am considering how to refit the electronics setup in my sailboat. The boat is from 1997 and all electronics date back to then, so i want to renew it all, and i have som questions about how to network it all together. Hope you can help!
Its (probably) going to be:
1 garmin 4210 plotter.
Garmin GWS 10 wind sensor
Raymarine S1 autopilot
Raymarine 218E DSC VHF
Furuno AIS50 transponder

Possibly Garmin HD radar.

How is all this networked together? Will it just be a NMEA backbone cable with t-connectors going to each instrument and in that case, how is that cable terminated?
How do I integrate the Garmin marine network, which seems be based on standard RJ-45 LAN cables?
I suppose i will need a VHF splitter for the AIS. Seperate GPS-antenna also?

That's it! Hope someone has a take on how this is supposed to be set up, so I can get going..:-) Thanks!
Opinions on my equipment selections are also very welcome - I haven't bought it yet, so I can still change my mind:-) But having as much as possible integrated into the chartplotter display is important to me...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 11-09-2009
osirissail's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Caribbean
Posts: 76
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
osirissail is on a distinguished road
NMEA 183.x is a serial flow system. You cannot "T" off from one brand device to another. You will need a "multi-plexer" junction box that will accept all the various output NMEA feeds from the various instruments and then "order" the signals in a serial flow and output them back to the various devices. Some brands of instruments are compatible with each other and some are not, so there may be an opportunity to "sub-link" of the systems but eventually they will need to feed a multiplexer junction box to get true 2-way signal feed around the system.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 11-09-2009
rikhall's Avatar
old guy :)
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Fredericton, NB, Canada
Posts: 1,036
Thanks: 12
Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 7
rikhall will become famous soon enough
Sapster

Welcome to 2009! I just did what you are talking about and have been very happy with the Brookhouse Mux (with USB out) that we installed. Osiris is right - listen to him. Most of the stuff either talks, listens or does both. Most of it goes the same speed (maybe 4800 baud). Some talk much faster and the Mux (mulitplexer) is like a traffic cop and translator all built in. It remembers what one things says when two talk at once and then repeats what did not get sent. It allows for multiple talkers in and selected listeners out.

Ok - yes, that was VERY simplistic, but it was what I needed to hear when I first started. I now have a radio listening, radar listening, AIS talking, autohelm listening and talking, a computer listening at two different bauds and talking as well. OK - I think you probably get the idea.

Rik
__________________
Irwin Citation 34
Mystery
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 11-09-2009
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 729
Thanks: 6
Thanked 54 Times in 49 Posts
Rep Power: 9
knuterikt is on a distinguished road
Hi It's almoast 2010, lucky you..

Some of the equipment you hav listed simplifies the installation as it supports NMEA 2000. NMEA 2000 is superior to the old NMEA 0183 standard and simplifies cabling. NMEA 2000 uses a backbone cable with t-connectors and drop cables.

But you will have to use at least two(three) different network types.
NMEA 2000 can be used for the Garmin equipent listed, but you must use the "Garmin Marine Network" to connect the radar to the diplay since NMEA 2000 (and 1083) does not support radar images to the display unit.

All raymarines equipment supports seatalk, the S1 unit also supports NMEA 2000 with a proprietary adapter (please verify - this modell has been replaced by the SPX series), this can be used to interconnct the autopilot with the chart plotter.

You should be able to get heading data from the S1 fluxgate compass (you will need this to get radar overlay on the chart plotter). Please verify that you can get the rate gyro heading this way as this is normaly e requirement for good radar overlay.

The Furuno FA50 seems to be able to communicate with the plotter using NMEA 0183, it can also use ethernet to communicate with other Furuno devices.

Raymarine 218E DSC VHF will have to use NMEA 0183.
The garmin 4210 plotter has 4 receiver (RX) ports and 2 transmitter (TX) ports for NMEA 0183, so this should solve your problems.

But as you can see it will be some cables going to the plotter.

Power cable
NMEA 0183 Cable (one cable for all ports)
NMEA 2000 drop Cable
Garmin Marine Network cable for the radar

I will advise you to pull all the necessary cables even if you wont use all in the start.

Are you going to shop all this equipment at one supplier? Try to get a guarantee that this configuration will be interoperable.

I must tell you that Raynmarine is notorious in telling that even if the support standards the can not interoprate with other equipment

The Garmin documentation for the plotter can be found here https://buy.garmin.com/shop/store/ma...=148&pID=11187
Take a look at the "Installation Instructions"


Good luck, keep us updated.

Last edited by knuterikt; 11-09-2009 at 02:14 PM. Reason: More information
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 11-09-2009
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,290
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapster77 View Post
Hi,

I am considering how to refit the electronics setup in my sailboat. The boat is from 1997 and all electronics date back to then, so i want to renew it all, and i have som questions about how to network it all together. Hope you can help!
Its (probably) going to be:
1 garmin 4210 plotter.
Garmin GWS 10 wind sensor
Raymarine S1 autopilot
Raymarine 218E DSC VHF
Furuno AIS50 transponder

Possibly Garmin HD radar.

How is all this networked together? Will it just be a NMEA backbone cable with t-connectors going to each instrument and in that case, how is that cable terminated?
How do I integrate the Garmin marine network, which seems be based on standard RJ-45 LAN cables?
Basically, you'll connect the Garmin Radar and the 4210 plotter together via the Garmin networking RJ45 cables. THe GWS 10 will be connected to the GM10 display and the 4210 via NMEA 2000. The 4210 will need a GPS 17 or something similar for GPS information, which connects via NMEA 0183 or NMEA 2000, depending on which model it is.

I don't see the Furuno AIS50 listed... the closest thing listed is the Furuno AIS FA-50, which requires a PC connected via Ethernet.

The Raymarine autopilot and Raymarine VHF would be connected via NMEA 0183 off of the 4210 chartplotter.

Yes, you will need a splitter for the AIS, but you'd be better off having a separate antenna for the AIS.

Quote:
I suppose i will need a VHF splitter for the AIS. Seperate GPS-antenna also?

That's it! Hope someone has a take on how this is supposed to be set up, so I can get going..:-) Thanks!
Opinions on my equipment selections are also very welcome - I haven't bought it yet, so I can still change my mind:-) But having as much as possible integrated into the chartplotter display is important to me...
As for equipment, I'm partial to Icom radios over the Raymarine ones... and a big fan of Garmin's chartplotters and radar. The one piece of gear, which is a luxury but a nice one to have, is the Raymarine Smart Controller autopilot remote.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 11-09-2009
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 476
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
negrini is on a distinguished road
Send a message via AIM to negrini Send a message via Yahoo to negrini Send a message via Skype™ to negrini
Regarding AIS, take one that comes with built-in antena split (Icom receivers, Raymarine/Westmarine transponders, etc) it will simplify installation. AIS baudrate on older NMEA 0183 is higher than standard (38K4 bps) requiring prompt receive of information to be effective on target/sector calculation (like gyros), so it's not a good idea buffering it in a MUX at lower speeds to the plotter. It's wise to run it directly at the specified baudrate. I second SD too, Icom is the best choice on VHF.
__________________
Nave Rara
Beneteau Oceanis 43
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by negrini; 11-09-2009 at 11:34 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 11-10-2009
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Denmark
Posts: 11
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
sapster77 is on a distinguished road
Ok-thank you very much for all the answers. It's great!
As I wrote I have not bought the equipment yet, but I've seen most of these instruments in use, like their functionalities and trust the quality. It is however not paramount that it must be these parts. Im very open to suggestions that will simplify the installation. At a first glance on your feedback it looks like i could replace the Raymarine parts with something NMEA 2000 as I could remove the need for NMEA 183 all together? Any thoughts on that idea? Specific equipment suggestions are very welcome
Once again thank you.

@Knuterikt: Yes the S1 was correct. I found a cheap one, but I might replace it in my inventory to simplify installation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Marine Surplus and Consignment Shopping Sue & Larry Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 10-14-1999 09:00 PM
Marine Surplus and Consignment Shopping Sue & Larry Cruising Articles 0 10-14-1999 09:00 PM
Marine Radios Overview Jim Sexton Seamanship Articles 0 09-30-1999 09:00 PM
Marine Radios Overview Jim Sexton Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 09-30-1999 09:00 PM
Marine Radios Overview Jim Sexton Her Sailnet Articles 0 09-30-1999 09:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:31 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.