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Old 09-15-2013
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Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

Hey all, I've been working on some ideas for upgrades for next year for my Precision 165. We get a lot of light air where I'm at, so the main idea is to add hardware to support a genoa. Also, I'm looking to add some nice-to-haves to make the boat a little more single-handed friendly. This includes running the halyards back to the cockpit, and a lazy jack to douse the genoa, and adding slugs to the main to make it easier to hoist.

I'm completely new to hardware modification so I've been drawing out my ideas to hopefully fine tune everything before actually drilling any holes. I've pieced this together from photos and measurements, it's not quite accurate, but close enough to hopefully get the idea.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1g2p7rwguj...cision-165.pdf

I'd appreciate any suggestions!
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

If you can reduce the angle formed by the deck organisers on the halyards, that would reduce the load on the organisers. It looks like 90 degrees might be necessary to avoid the hatch slides, though.

What about reefing lines for the main? I find it rather useful to have the boomvang brought back to the cockpit too.
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

Look at some of the tricks used on dinghies to get good halyard tension without a winch. You certainly shouldn't need two cabin top winches on a boat this size, a single one that can handle both halyards is good enough.

The first thing that I'd add is something that allows you to tie off the tiller so that you can comfortably handle the sails without being stuck in the cockpit. Then you can keep the boat rigged more simply. A "Tiller Tamer" is the brand name for one of these devices, but a clove hitch around the tiller and going to two cleats works fine too.

I'd try the genoa without a lazy jack first, I bet you'll find it easy enough to handle.

MarkSF: On a boat this size a normal boom vang is easily accessed from the cockpit.

I can't tell what 4 lines you are running back. Each line run back to the cockpit costs at least $100 in hardware, so just do the essentials.
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkSF View Post
If you can reduce the angle formed by the deck organisers on the halyards, that would reduce the load on the organisers. It looks like 90 degrees might be necessary to avoid the hatch slides, though.

What about reefing lines for the main? I find it rather useful to have the boomvang brought back to the cockpit too.
Thanks for the feedback. I'll see if I can re-position the organizers somehow, that's a good point. I do have reefing lines currently, but they're pretty bare-bones. How would you run the vang back?
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex W View Post
Look at some of the tricks used on dinghies to get good halyard tension without a winch. You certainly shouldn't need two cabin top winches on a boat this size, a single one that can handle both halyards is good enough.
Is there something specific you would recommend? Maybe just a 4:1 block setup or something like that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex W View Post
The first thing that I'd add is something that allows you to tie off the tiller so that you can comfortably handle the sails without being stuck in the cockpit. Then you can keep the boat rigged more simply. A "Tiller Tamer" is the brand name for one of these devices, but a clove hitch around the tiller and going to two cleats works fine too.
I've been using a 6' bungie wrapped around the tiller and hooked on each rear mooring cleat. Not the most sophisticated, but it has helped. I also have an extension on it to do the "between the knees" towards the front of the cockpit.

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Originally Posted by Alex W View Post
I'd try the genoa without a lazy jack first, I bet you'll find it easy enough to handle.
Cool, yeah, maybe that's a nice-to-have later if it's a little unwieldy. This won't be a furling genoa so the thought here was to use it as a emergency "oh crap" tool if a gust blows in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex W View Post
I can't tell what 4 lines you are running back. Each line run back to the cockpit costs at least $100 in hardware, so just do the essentials.
My thought here was to plan ahead for a possible spinnaker in the future, so if I was making the investment and doing the work, sort of a do it all at once kind of thing. But you're right, I could really do one side at a time and build on it later.

Thanks for the feedback!
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

The vang is routed just like the halyards in your diagram
- to a block at the mast base, then back to the cockpit. I had to remove the cleat from the vang assembly.
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

The primary dinghy that I've sailed is a Lightning (though that shall soon change, I bought a used 5o5 recently with a friend). On the Lightning the halyard is raised by hand, then another line links into a loop on the halyard and uses a 4:1 block and tackle to tension. A cunningham basically works the same way.

I'd put a downhaul on the genoa before messing with lazy jacks. That is a line that goes through every other hank and allows you to pull the sail down to the deck immediately.

You'll likely find that you don't benefit from a winch on a spinnaker halyard (high luff tension isn't a big concern there), so a spinnaker halyard can just go to a cam cleat.

MarkSF: My vang is also routed that way, but only because my boat has a dodger. It's completely unnecessary on a boat without one (especially a boat of this size), a boom or mast base fiddle block with cleat is easy to access.
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Re: Diagram for upgrades - will they work?

I agree that if you can reach the vang from the cockpit INCLUDING when heading downwind, there's no need to bring it back. However if you can't, it certainly is necessary to bring it back, as the ability to adjust it quickly, in a gust, without putting yourself in danger, is an essential safety feature, IMHO.

I know sailors who have it long enough to reach the helm, and have a cam cleat, so they can release it quickly.
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