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Old 12-04-2013
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Testing antifreeze products

Starting a new reseach project; this will be a big one, out in phases for Fall 2014. A call for brands.

We have contacted:
* West Marine
* Camco
* Star Brite

We will include, in several different catagories:
* Vodka
* PG, EG, and alcohol based freeze proofing agrents
* Auomotive and heavy duty (diesel) products

We will be looking at:
* Burst Point
* Elastomer and plastic compatibility
* Value ($/freeze point)
* Bio fouling and taste
* Coorosion (potable and engine product will have separate test protecols)


Any specific brands? Any specifc questions to investigate?
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Old 12-04-2013
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Re: Testing antifreeze products

I would throw Prestone 50/50 into the mix.
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Old 12-04-2013
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Re: Testing antifreeze products

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdqaltair View Post
Starting a new reseach project....

We will include, in several different catagories:
* Vodka

We will be looking at:
* Burst Point
* Elastomer and plastic compatibility
* Value ($/freeze point)
* Bio fouling and taste
* Coorosion (potable and engine product will have separate test protecols)
Good luck with what sounds like an interesting project. But could you include "rum" in addition to "vodka" as it's usually more in stock on sailing vessels.

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Old 12-04-2013
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Re: Testing antifreeze products

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdqaltair View Post
Starting a new reseach project; this will be a big one, out in phases for Fall 2014. A call for brands.

We have contacted:
* West Marine
* Camco
* Star Brite

We will include, in several different catagories:
* Vodka
* PG, EG, and alcohol based freeze proofing agrents
* Auomotive and heavy duty (diesel) products

We will be looking at:
* Burst Point
* Elastomer and plastic compatibility
* Value ($/freeze point)
* Bio fouling and taste
* Coorosion (potable and engine product will have separate test protecols)


Any specific brands? Any specifc questions to investigate?
Drew,

Would love to see you guys show what dilution does to both freeze and burst points in thin wall copper and plastics. I see LOTS of DIY winterizing failures caused by the dilution of -50 PG. Folks often shut down an engine when they "see pink" and this is often not enough to adequately protect a copper tube HX because it leaves what is in there rather diluted...

I test engine concentrations in customers boats with a sight refractometer until what comes out the back matches what came out of the bottle.. The next winter I know exactly how much she takes with no guess work. I think a lot of boat owners get lucky with the mild winters, but every winter that we hit 0F to -20F I know I will have freeze repairs in the spring..

I would add Wal*Mart SuperTech -50 RV and the Home Depot RV. Both are alcohol based. Those are the two I see most in the dumpsters each fall other than typical "boat brands". Don't forget Pahnol PG...
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Last edited by Maine Sail; 12-04-2013 at 03:23 PM.
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Old 12-04-2013
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Re: Testing antifreeze products

Suggest samples are well marked if they find their way into
your freezer, as antifreeze will surely will resemble frozen Margarita
to the late night holiday guest...well maybe don't mark the Vodka!
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Old 12-04-2013
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Re: Testing antifreeze products

Keep the feedback coming!

* Yes, Prestone will be in the mix, as well as some heavy duty brand. There are some that believe "heavy duty" in AF is just a sales pitch, but this is one product where it has a very specific meaning and the products are required to pass specific ASTM standards in order to be suitable for diesels with wet sleeves. For most boats using glycol cooling (since most are diesel) heavy duty products are more appropriate. Complicated topic.

* Rum. No, it is vile drink. Stout is far more civilized.

* Burst point testing. Mainesail is dead on; a focus will be under treatment, which causes bursting and... foul lines and tanks. Like alcohol, antifreeze is ONLY a sterilizing agent IF the concentration is over 25%. We will focus on PVC burst points because copper data is already well represented in the literature. However, there is another factor that many ignore at their peril; burst point numbers are only real if the glycol has not been separated by repeated freeze/thaw cycles (think about apple jack). I have seen pipe systems that were fine at the bottom but burst near the top; the water ice floats.

While we may not collect all of the brands, we can still generally get compositional information from MSDSs and other sources. For example, my local Home Depot carries Dowfrost RV, not their own brand, and Dowfrost is one I trust to be exactly what they say (premium brand I have tested before in my day job).
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(when asked how he reached the starting holds on a difficult rock climbing problem that clearly favored taller climbers - he was perhaps 5'5")

"Well, I just climb up to them."

by Joe Brown, English rock climber




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