Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods - SailNet Community
 1Likes
  • 1 Post By azguy
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 10 Old 01-27-2014 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 218
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

I would like to make sure the standing rigging on my tall rig Catalina 27 is properly tuned. The goal isn't so much racing but general maintenance/upkeep. The Cat 27s use 3/16 inch and 5/32 inch for the fore/back stays and foward/aft lower shrouds, respectively which requires two different Loos gauges at around $90/gauge.

I've been reading the rigging guide by Selden and considering the folding rule method as it seems like a nice DIY alternative to expensive gauges.

Has anyone successfully used the folding rule approach? Are there other methods?

For what its worth the details on my rig are:
Masthead rig with forward and aft shrouds and inline spreaders
Roller furling on the headstay
NO running backstay
Deck stepped mast

Josh
engineer_sailor is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
blt2ski's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 6,845
Thanks: 0
Thanked 25 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

WHile I will not say it is truly accurate, I have teh same issue with my Jeanneau that is similar in size etc as you C27. I have a PT2, for the wire that is one sized smaller. Using the differences in the larger sizes, I've swag'd the setting for the slightly too small size. When I had a pt1 or equal available, it comes in pretty close. Close enough for my stds. any how! I do race more frequently than not. MY 02 for what 02 is not worth.

Marty

She drives me boat,
I drives me dinghy!
blt2ski is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #3 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
"Nubile Southern Sailor"
 
christian.hess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Columbus, Ga
Posts: 4,516
Thanks: 181
Thanked 181 Times in 177 Posts
Rep Power: 2
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

ive always tuned by hand and feel...but that is not a common way to do it

however I will be doing it this way on my islander 36 down here...

Ill find a write up if you are interested...its a very easy and time honored method of tuning your mast

its easy...and remeber never overtighten...

the good way to do any rig tune is to always test sail in steady(10 knots then 20knots for example) conditions...and then tune(tighten or loosen) in calm flat water with a balanced boat..if your listing cause of half full water tanks or fuel or cans of food on one side your feel or readings will be wrong...

last tip always use a lead weight or carpenters weight to make sure your mast is completely centered

NEVER EVER EVER GO by thread count or number of turns on turnbuckles since you dont know if they are exactly the same length on each side

other than that easy

good luck

Islander 36 now FOR SALE!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
christian.hess is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #4 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
azguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 559
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

Try asking around your marina, I did, and found more than one person that was willing to lend their Loos gauge to me. The person actually came down to my boat and helped me through the whole process since I was a new boat owner....


Then I found out the local chandlery lends them out with a drivers license for security...
JimMcGee likes this.

1988 C22 Owner
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
azguy is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #5 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 707
Thanks: 1
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

I've used the folding rule method and found it did well. However, since I have a foil on the headstay, I was not able to get an accurate measurement on that. It's a masthead rig and I assumed that getting a good adjustment on the backstay would translate to the headstay.
lancelot9898 is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #6 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 844
Thanks: 8
Thanked 63 Times in 58 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelot9898 View Post
I've used the folding rule method and found it did well. However, since I have a foil on the headstay, I was not able to get an accurate measurement on that. It's a masthead rig and I assumed that getting a good adjustment on the backstay would translate to the headstay.
The folding rule method works fine to get the initial correct tension on the the rig.
You must start with all wires without tension, a fine time to lube all the turnbuckles before starting to adjust.

It's correct that the headstay / backstay on a masthead rig will balance out.
The same way you only need to use one folding rule when you adjust the shrouds in pairs.

The most common error with rig tension is having the rig set too loose...
This cause unnecessary flexing / movement in the rig with fatigue failures as result.
knuterikt is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #7 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
rbyham's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 516
Thanks: 0
Thanked 10 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

I sometimes wonder how close my rig is to correct. It is my first boat and a year ago I knew very little about any of this. When we stepped the mast I assumed that the forestay was key along with getting sidestays exactly equal. Here is what I did. I first rigged the forestay as it is a furler and has no adjustment in it. So my assumption was that the length as I found it on the hard was the same length the PO had taken down 8 years previously. So I tightened the backstay until fore and aft were near tight by feel. Then using a spinnaker halyard I measured and adjusted side to side until exactly equal. I confirmed their being equal by measuring up from the deck to a fixed point on port and starboard stays. Having sailed it a year now and watched mast and forestay carefully all looks straight and no flexing. But I must confess I wonder what a pro rigger would say about my rig and I have heard that a professionally trimmed boat can make a huge difference.
rbyham is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #8 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 743
Thanks: 3
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

I can vouch for the Selden method. I used it on my Catalina 309. I cut a piece of plastic electric conduit pipe to the required length to use instead of a folding rule. I ground down the lower end of it to just a small tang or tab, to make it easier to measure (using vernier calipers) from the top of the turnbuckle to the end of the conduit. It's a good method.
Siamese is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #9 of 10 Old 01-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 844
Thanks: 8
Thanked 63 Times in 58 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

Quote:
Originally Posted by rbyham View Post
I sometimes wonder how close my rig is to correct. It is my first boat and a year ago I knew very little about any of this. When we stepped the mast I assumed that the forestay was key along with getting sidestays exactly equal. Here is what I did. I first rigged the forestay as it is a furler and has no adjustment in it. So my assumption was that the length as I found it on the hard was the same length the PO had taken down 8 years previously. So I tightened the backstay until fore and aft were near tight by feel. Then using a spinnaker halyard I measured and adjusted side to side until exactly equal. I confirmed their being equal by measuring up from the deck to a fixed point on port and starboard stays. Having sailed it a year now and watched mast and forestay carefully all looks straight and no flexing. But I must confess I wonder what a pro rigger would say about my rig and I have heard that a professionally trimmed boat can make a huge difference.
The Selden "Hints and advices" can be found here Hints and advices : Seldén Mast AB
Download and have a look, even if your mast is from another spar maker the information is good.
knuterikt is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #10 of 10 Old 02-02-2014
Senior Member
 
norahs arc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Saint John NB Canada
Posts: 140
Thanks: 12
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: Loos Gauges and Alternative Rig Tuning Methods

Quote:
Originally Posted by engineer_sailor View Post
I would like to make sure the standing rigging on my tall rig Catalina 27 is properly tuned. The goal isn't so much racing but general maintenance/upkeep. The Cat 27s use 3/16 inch and 5/32 inch for the fore/back stays and foward/aft lower shrouds, respectively which requires two different Loos gauges at around $90/gauge.

I've been reading the rigging guide by Selden and considering the folding rule method as it seems like a nice DIY alternative to expensive gauges.

Has anyone successfully used the folding rule approach? Are there other methods?

For what its worth the details on my rig are:
Masthead rig with forward and aft shrouds and inline spreaders
Roller furling on the headstay
NO running backstay
Deck stepped mast

Josh
In his book "Boatowner's Mechanical And Electrical Manual" (Third Edition Pg 763)
Nigel Calder describes a simple methood of setting up rigging with a tape measure and some tape or a marker. The methood is based on known properties of the material and common engineering.(Use it myself - sometimes called the folding rule methood)

Catalina 27 Aft. galley, dinnet L/O
Update - Sold Norah's Ark Buying A 24'Shark
Saint John NB
Canada

Last edited by norahs arc; 02-02-2014 at 10:15 AM.
norahs arc is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tuning the rig.... blutoyz Gear & Maintenance 5 06-03-2013 11:04 AM
rig tuning specs needed C27 standard rig PaulRJordan Catalina 4 06-27-2010 08:50 AM
C&C 33 Rig tuning glorydays Gear & Maintenance 1 05-29-2010 04:29 PM
Rig tuning help zz4gta Gear & Maintenance 6 04-23-2009 04:32 PM
Tuning the Rig Dan Dickison Racing Articles 0 03-07-2002 07:00 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome