Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets - Page 4 - SailNet Community

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  #31  
Old 03-14-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

I am a fan of horn cleats, they let go when overpowered which is a tad bit better than a knock down.
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  #32  
Old 03-14-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailormon6 View Post
WaterGeus - During the summer, I race about 3 days a week on competitive boats from 25' to over 40', and you're right that almost all of them use cam cleats. I don't recommend clam cleats for big boats, but for smaller boats than about 28-30', they work very well. I don't expect many people to change over to clam cleats, but if anyone isn't satisfied with the way their cam cleats have worked for them, i want them to know that, on a smaller boat, they might want to give clams a try. For the reasons I mentioned, I liked them better than cam cleats.

Most of the boats I race on are equipped with Harken 150s, and they are much better than the cams of old, but, IMO, they still have the drawbacks of the old ones that I described previously - just not as bad. For big boats, I think they're the best device available for the purpose, but that doesn't mean I like them.
It is good to have options, so we can all use what we like best.
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  #33  
Old 03-14-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

ST winches you will never look back
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  #34  
Old 03-14-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

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Originally Posted by tommays View Post
ST winches you will never look back
Depends on your needs. I love my ST winches for short handed sailing. However tons of race boats with plenty of budget to upgrade have kept with standard winches.

The standard winch is easier to strip and works across a wider range of line sizes.

The fastest way to move a lot of line (during a tack in a race) is to have one crew member tailing as fast as they can when there is no load on the sheet, and a second crew member cranking on the winch as loads increase. After the tack it is easier to get the sheet into a cleat than onto the self tailing part of the winch. ST offers no advantages here.

For a crew of 1-2 self tailing makes things a lot easier, especially as sail loads go up.
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  #35  
Old 03-14-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailormon6 View Post
On a smaller boat, below about 30', I think most serious sail trimmers would prefer clam cleats - not the cheap plastic ones that wear out quickly, but the aluminum ones. A serious sail trimmer is constantly re-trimming the jib in the puffs and lulls. What is important to him is that it be easy to cleat and uncleat the line.

If you have cam cleats, you have to lay the line on top of the cleat and pull it back far enough to open the jaws so that they can grip the line. When the line is under a heavy load, such as on a very gusty day, it becomes difficult to pull it that extra little amount, to get it to open the jaws of the cleat. With a clam cleat, all you have to do is lay the line in the Vee of the cleat, and it will grip the line. Likewise, when you want to release the sheet from a cam cleat, you have to first pull in on the line a bit, in order to open the jaws of the cleat. Then they will release their grip on the line, and you can lift it out of the cleat and then you can adjust the sheet. With a clam cleat, all you need to do to release it is to lift it out of the Vee. These are small differences, but when you do them over and over during a race, a hundred or more times, it matters a great deal that you can do them easily. The advantage of clam cleats is also their disadvantage. Because they are so easy to cleat and uncleat, they can occasionally become uncleated accidentally, just by bumping the line, but you quickly learn how to avoid such things, and, since the line is constantly being attended while racing, it just isn't a problem. On my 25' boat, I used mine for both racing and cruising, and almost never had them release unintentionally, after I learned how to avoid it happening.

My 35' boat has cam cleats and jam cleats. I usually use the jam cleats when singlehanding, because I don't adjust the sail trim nearly as often, but when I do, it is easy to just wrap the line around the jam cleat and, with a slight tug, the line is held securely. Likewise, another small tug will release the line. I wouldn't like jam cleats very much for serious racing, because wrapping and unwrapping the line around the cleat a hundred or so times during a race would require too much motion, and would be inefficient.

I'm trying hard to think of a use for which cam cleats would be more efficient, but nothing comes to mind at the moment. I'm not a fan of cam cleats.
I would prefer the cams wear out rather than the sheet wear out
Disclaimer I still use the horn cleats on my Discovery 32
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  #36  
Old 03-15-2014
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Re: Cam or Clam Cleats, re: Jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by utchuckd View Post
I need to replace the clams behind my winches for my jib sheets. What are the pros and cons of cam vs clam? Any other options?
I have used both cam and clam cleats without fairleads for cruising and racing. I prefer cam cleats without fairleads in both situations.

Look for boats with each set up.
-CH

Last edited by Faster; 03-15-2014 at 01:15 PM. Reason: Loud font
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