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Old 05-29-2014
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Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

Hi,

I am in the final stages of buying a Tartan37, and need to rethink the self-steering.

I am plannning on gettting a Windvane, and there is at least 2 used model on craigs, an Aries(1.5k) and one Monitor (2.5k).
I am tempted to go with the monitor because it is all stainless steel and I could eventually adapt a M-RUd Emergency. But I could save the bucks on the Aries.

However, reading around, It seems that not all windvanes fits all boats.
What would be the best one for my type of boat, 37ft, Fin Keel ?

I am planning on building a Jordan Series of drogues and with a short line, it seems to be helping with steering emergency. Is it practical ? could that replace the MRud emergency tiller in case the worst happen ?


Help appreciated.
Olivier
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Old 05-30-2014
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

Either will work just fine. May have circumnavigated with each.

May I suggest that you contact Scanmar and/or check out their web site to see how the Monitor is attached to a T37. They'll have the photos and sell you the requisite tubing made for its attachment to your boat.

With regard to the Aries, Helen Franklin used to sell parts for the unit. Her operation is/was in England, but I am not sure she is still in business. There is an Aries operation in Denmark that will be worth checking out. You may need to make your own tubing, but it is a simpler attachment than the Monitor.

As to an emergency rudder, take a look at what Mike Keyworth has posted as to his solution with a Galerider. It is fascinating and looks like the way to go.

Emergency Steering with a Drogue: A New Approach - Newport Bermuda Race
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Old 05-30-2014
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

You may want to check with Scanmar and confirm that you can attach the emergency tiller system to an older Monitor. Monitors have evolved over the years. I certainly would not equate a drogue system with emergency steering. They really are different in purpose. BTW, we have used our Monitor for more than 30k miles and it has been terrific. It is also nice to have sold factory support available. Parts are not cheap but they are available.
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Old 05-30-2014
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

Thanks.
I was hoping to adapt (somehow) the existing stainless tubes to my boat. Maybe by adding an extension or asking a welder to short some.
Do you think it is possible ?

Parts are really expensive, but it will be way easier to work with Scanmar as they are still in business. Looked around and it seems that the Aries is for bigger and heavier boat. Seems like there are hundreds of Tartan 37 with the Monitor on the Scanmar website .
Then I definitively going for the Monitor, even if more expensive.
I might keep the MRUd for better days and relies on the drogues in the unlikely event I lost the rudder.
Did someone hear about a Tartan 37 losing a rudder ? is it a weakness on those boats ?


Serie Drogue As steering device:

6700 kg buy page

Auxiliary steering:-
This series drogue can be used as an auxiliary steering device if problems occur with your vessels main steering system.
In fine weather The 12mm 75 cone drogue line is removed from the complete series drogue setup, and the bridle legs are run from your cleats, the leader with 25 cones attached is trailed behind the vessel.; Secondary lines are then run from the bridle legs ( see white 3 strand nylon line in photo below) to your sheet winches, adjustment of these secondary lines by the winches will guide your vessels course.
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Old 05-30-2014
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

You may be able to modify the existing tubes to fit your boat. I think the way they make the Monitor is that they start with the unit and four pads that bolt to the transom and then they make tubes to go between the two - adjusting the length as necessary so the unit ends up being vertical. If I remember correctly (the boat is in Grenada and I am not) the tubing is expanded at the aft end to fit over the tubing of the Monitor while the forward end of the tubing just goes into the mounting brackets with a bolt going through to hold it together. I think you would want to keep the expanded part and cut or lengthen the current tubes as needed. I wonder if you could do a mockup with plastic tubing?

I don't think the Monitor is necessarily for a smaller boat than an Aries since the unit is not steering the boat it is steering the wheel. There are some very big boats with Monitors (70'+) it is really a function of how hard the boat is to steer. Our boat is about 40,000 pounds and was no problem for the Monitor (or an Aries I am sure), but was right at the size limit for a Hydrovane which actually must steer the boat. The Hydrovane guy said his unit 'should' steer my boat which is why I went with a Monitor since the Monitor guy said it would steer the boat just fine. He was right.

One suggestion, use very good, low friction blocks to lead the lines to the wheel (tiller?). Don't skimp on these. Also make sure that the leads for these blocks are as perfect as you can make them. I thought my original ones were fine but the chafe of going back and forth thousands of times will show you any flaws. I actually filed away part of the cheek of one block to avoid wear. We find that a set of lines lasts something like 5000 miles. In the instructions they recommend having lines that are several feet longer than you need. As you get wear you can just shift the line back a foot or so and expose a new area to the blocks.
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

I've sailed with both, although most of my experience is with my Aries. Basically both are the same type of beast. I'd expect that either would work for your boat, but one might be easier to adapt than the other.

As of a year ago Helen Franklin was still selling parts for older Aries models. She was very helpful when I contacted her.
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Old 05-30-2014
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

I can vouch for the aries as well...both the tiltup model and the fixed...

just oil and protect the stainless parts for corrosion and youll be fine...

both(monitor and aries) need input in heavy weather on deep angles like ddw or slightly off to each side but that goes for most windvanes...

can go wrong with either having said that I beleive the monitor to be a bit overpriced especially used

whereas a good used aries sometimes goes fo less than 1k...

take your pic!

cheers
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

I think you will find that people find a vane that works for them and are happy to have them which likely means that any of the major brands are just fine. One nice thing with the Monitor is that you only need to lubricate it with fresh water.
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

Thank you for the input.
If the deal fail through for any reason on one I can go with confidence with the other :P
I think I read somewhere that Aries was way " heavier" than other vanes, maybe due to the way it is built, therefore was not adapted for small vessels. But a 37' is not that small after all...
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Re: Windvane for Tartan 37, self-steering questions

I haven't lugged around a Monitor the way I've done with my Aries, but I bet that might lighter. And for what it's worth, our boat is a 37-footer, although it does weigh in at around 28,000#, so is a tad heavier than your Tartan.

Either vane would do you well, I'm sure.
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