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Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
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  #11  
Old 12-26-2006
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Thanks for the link to the yahoo groups. At this point it looks like the RE-E-Power company is the #1 choice. They have about an 8 week lead time though. I definitely want an electric system with the motor below the boat if I do go electric.

Part of the reason for my pullout this time is that the hose on the stuffing box is worn out. My diesel engine is old and leaky so I was initially planning on just dropping a new Yanmar 3-cyl in, but now I'm really seriously considering the electric route. Price seems to be about the same. I need to find out some more about the actual electric motors used and make sure they are brushless. This is a big decision for me as it would be so easy to just drop a new diesel in. And the diesel would probably last longer in the long run.
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Old 12-26-2006
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Alternative

Here's a link to Solomon Tech & their e-version which uses convestional shaft, etc
http://www.solomontechnologies.com/m_recreational.htm

I crewed on a boat with a ST-37 set-up....other threads on various forum on same topic.
Advantages - quiet, instant power, re-gen
Dis-advantages - Power mgt challenges, difficult to punch thru heavier waves & winds, generator needed for extended motoring

It could have been this particular setup.............would suggest lots of time spent on power mgt (in & out), storage (batteries), motor power & prop
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  #13  
Old 12-26-2006
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"This of course is known as a Deisel electric which is used by the big cruise ships and locomotives... it is more energy effieceint than a straight gas or deisel engine, thats why they use it. "
It *can* be more efficient, if you deem "efficient" to mean "suitable for a specific purpose" rather than "more work per unit of energy". The dual conversion will always be less efficient than single (direct) conversion. But locomotives need 100% torque from a dead stop, which diesel engines simple can't provide. Diesel-electric gives them the option of 100% torque from the electric motor. Then again, that's also why *steam* was a better way to run locomotives, same 100% torque all the way.
There are also long comments about how GE killed the steam locomotive, when in fact the triple and quad-conversion steam turbine engines were more efficient, more economical, more reliable, and less expensive overall. But cheap sales and the marketing of "clean, not old dirty ashes" killed the steam engine in the RR business. It was very successful marketing.

Now, if Solomon would only have the courage to put a Hobbs meter in their systems and offer a warranty that was *longer* than the average combustion motor, instead of barely meeting the middle ground, that might get them more sales. If their "better" and more "reliable" and "simpler" system really could meet those claims.
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  #14  
Old 12-26-2006
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Of course for the DIY there is always this kit.

http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/sailboatkit.htm

for about $1,250.00 bucks you can even have regan.

However remember to switch props, the props that come with deisel and gas engines aren't good for mixing wash water.
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Old 12-27-2006
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A displacement hull requires about 2-3 HP per metric ton to achieve hull speed. If we have a 5 metric ton vessel (approx 11,000 pounds) we need 10-15 HP depending on wave and wind action. to make it easy lets call it 10. We now need 7460 watts to produce 10 HP. factor in another 15% for inefficiency we are up to 8500 watts. 0.44 pounds of diesel will produce 1 HP per hour. so we need 4.4 pounds of diesel or about 0.6 gallons per hr. To produce 10 HP or 8500 watts with batteries at a convenient 72 volts we need about 120 amps. 12 golf cart batteries at 225 amp hrs (1080 pounds) will give us 112 useable amp hours (discharged to 50%) or .93 hrs at 10 HP. It will actually be considerably less than this as the batteries are rated at a 20 hr duscharge rate and about 11 amps a 120 amp discharge rate will probably discharge them in about half that time or less. So now we have about a half hour or less of running time. So we now have produced 10 HP for half an hour with 1000 punds of batteries as against 10 HP for half an hour with 2.2 pounds of diesel. If we factor in the engine, weight of 350 pounds and assume 200 pounds of electric motors and associated equipment. we have
1280 pounds of electrical equipment to produce 10 HP for half an hour versus 352 pounds of diesel engine and fuel. To achieve 5 hrs of run time at 10 HP we would need 10,000 pounds of batteries. 10 HP =8500 watts x10 hrs = 85000 watt hrs/72 volts 1180 amp Hrs. but since we should only discharge to 50% we will need twice that much (12 golf carts, to get 72 volts we need 12 6 volt batteries so we end up with 144 batteries.144 golf carts at $150.00 each $21,600 but only about 360 pounds of diesel engine and fuel In reality we would not use golf carts as that is way too many batteries (432 cells to maintain, not to mention the cabling nightmare and cable weight.) But even if we used large batteries like the Rolls 4KS25P 1350 amp hrs we would need 36 at 315 pounds ($36,000) so we are back to our 10,000 pounds plus of batteries. And we're still out of power in half an hour. And we haven't even begun to consider the weight and expense of recharging. If we have used 112 amp hrs we need to replace about 130. at 72 volts we need 9400 watts worth of solar panels. If we use 3 24 volt 200 watt panels panels in series and have 5 hrs of maximum charging per daywe will need 10 f them at $1200.00 each,$12,000, plus a charge controller $500.00 and 1250 square feet of space.The panels will add another 500 pounds. The pounds per horsepower ratio between the two systems is outrageous, not to mention the cost.
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  #16  
Old 12-27-2006
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Hi everyone. I'm Kevin Plank from RE-E-POWER. I just had someone inform me that there was a discussion on here that involved our product and thought I would chime in to let everyone know I would be happy to answer any questions.
I would also like to add that I must agree with the last post. There is a HUGE difference in electric torque and diesel torque. All of our tests have been overwhelming. Our main test boat right now is in Norfolk VA. It is a 30 foot sail boat. We are cruising around currently on a small bank of group 24 batteries. Since we installed them we have NOT charged them. We've been out 3 times for over an hour each time. They still show over half charge on the "state of charge" meter (gas gauge). We have varied the speeds from 3 to 6 knots. The amazing thing is that we have not had to go all the way to full power to attain hull speed even into a 15 knot head wind.
We are working like crazy to update the website and also working on a new video. There is a huge amount of work to do and the website as well as our promo campaign is just a small but important part of the equation. We ARE looking for folks who want to be reps and install facilities. That's a whole other department.
I don't want this to be a commercial for RE-E-POWER.com but I just want to inform all of you on what is happening with our company and let you know that we would be happy to answer questions about our product and EB's in general. There is a steep learning curve for all of us.
Let's kick our "oil addiction" !

Kevin Plank
RE-E-POWER.com
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  #17  
Old 12-27-2006
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Kevin...Welcome! Just so you know...there is no problem with you reponding to questions about your product on this or any other thread as long as you state your affiliation. The input on appropriate subjects by experts is appreciated.
Should you wish down the road, you should contact Admin Jeff for actual advertising on the site. Where in Norfolk are you running the boat out of? I get up there once in a while and it might be an interesting side trip!
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  #18  
Old 12-27-2006
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Thanks!
The boat is located at Bay Point Marina just down from Little Creek Marina and the Cutty Sark. The Blue Oyster restaurant is right on the corner.
Let me know if you are headed up that way. We will be planning to have someone there to do demos at least once a month starting sometime in 'O7'. We are also looking to set up demo boats in Seattle, Tampa, San Diego, and a few other places.
We can post our schedule if you'd like.
Look forward to meeting up with you!
Kevin Plank
RE-E-POWER.com
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  #19  
Old 12-27-2006
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what size unit would you reccomend for a Cal-29,8000 lbs displacement?
And what size battery bank would be needed to power it at hull speed for 2 hrs?
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  #20  
Old 12-27-2006
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Sharkbait:

I had a correspondence with Kevin about my boat (Pearson 10M 33 footer, 12,000 lbs displacement) and he suggested the model 3000-S puller.

I would also like to know about the size of the battery bank required.
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