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post #11 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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http://www.dropshots.com/day.php?use...13&ctime=16000

Link to a homemade test.

Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.

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post #12 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
A little less cheek
 
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Hey Foothillscuba

Buy one of each of a size 10 feet longer than your boat, that should settle any arguement. Besides, some anchors are better under some conditions.

Or better yet, if you dive, go to a popular anchorage and scrounge the bottom. I've found 15 anchors that broke loose or were cut loose and later sold them at swap meets for some rightous bucks.
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post #13 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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THe preferred anchor of a true sailor is the rock with a rope tied around it. Plus it is just MORE effective than a Danforth but half the cost.

Save your money and go buy a good plow (Delta). Oversize it 1-2 times. Put it with all chain. Take the galvanized plow and throw it in the bilge when you come into port and grab one of those fancy new mousetraps. It should be stainless steel with 2 feet of stainless steel chain decending into the anchor locker (no one will open up your anchor locker to tell the difference). That way you can be the pride of the marina but still have a good night sleep when you really need something that works.
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post #14 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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By the way, I saw the Rocnor film, and was not too impressed. It seemed that some anchors were pulled faster than theirs, and .... I don't know....

Where I come from we don't have this BS about anchors. If its not holding, get the second anchor on a tandem. Simple done, end of discussion.
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post #15 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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CruisingDad - ROFL!!!

s/v "Pelican" Passport 40 #076- Finished Cruising - for the moment -
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post #16 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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I like the new water filled anchor from Ronco, builder of the pocket fisherman....:-)
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post #17 of 46 Old 01-11-2007
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Manson or Rocna then Spade...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasco

Hey thanks Vasco thats my video!!!

For a long time I used a CQR, like everyone, and would set it but never get what I considered to be a solid set. I would even dive on it and find it dug in sideways, or that it just dug a plow trough the bottom while I backed down on it. I then Switched to a Bruce, which did set better, but I always worried about the holding power as I could definitely move it with my boats engine and the Bruce was oversized for my boat. Next I tried a Spade and I thought it was the end all be all until I hit some harder bottom areas and my aluminum Spade would NOT penetrate the bottom. After reading many reviews of the Spades I decided to try a steel version and guess what it set perfectly on the first try in the same spot the aluminum version did not.

At this point I thought I had found my ultimate anchor. I could not budge it with the motor, it set first try 96+/-% of the time and when I dove on it it was burried in the stereo typical perfect set every time. I still beleived however that I could do better.

So one day I'm in Hamilton Marine in Portland, ME and I see this new fangled funny looking anchor with a roll bar called a Manson Supreme. I figured what the heck I already own a CQR, two Spades, a Fortress, Bruce & Delta what the heck why not try this one too. I figured it may become a weed anchor for me or a very hard bottom anchor and my steel Spade would be my primary. Well the day I launced my boat it was dead calm so on the way from my boat yard to my mooring I decided to try a few sets with the Manson. Now this is in an area I know to be very tough to get any anchor to set. I could never get my CQR to set in this location, ever, and so I avoided it for three years. The problem is it's a beautiful spot to anchor in and my wife and I really enjoy iit.

So I dropped the Manson and backed down on her attempting my first set with with the new anchor at about a 3:1 scope. I normally set long and then shorten scope to assure a good set and I NEVER set at 3:1 but I was experimenting remeber.. I backed down and BAM my boat just stopped dead iin the water and then lurched forward as the elasticty in the rode pulled the boat back forward. In my 38 years of boating I have never had an anchor that set so abruptly and definitively as the Manson Supreme. With the Manson you KNOW your set and there is NO mistaking it. I have made approximately 170 anchorings so far with the Manson and asside from catching a string of lobster pots on one set this anchor has set a 100% on the first try. The highest wind we rode out was a 50 knot blow and although we were well protected 4 boats out of the 6 total around us dragged. We stayed put but 50 knots in protected waters is no Hurricane! No matter how hard I back down I have not been able to move this anchor with my aux engine. The boat actually winds up spinning in an arc, due to prop walk, and yet even while spinning through a 180 degrees the Manson stays set. If you don't want to drag I advise 30+ feet of chain minimum and either a steel Spade or a Manson but the lead certainly goes to the Manson Supreme in my book. The Manson is my primary anchor with the steel spade as back up an the Fortress as my "directional" stern anchor. My Bruce, CQR and Delta make my boat shed have that nice nautical feel. They look nice hanging from the beam next to my old SeaGull outboard another relic from the past...

Above is a video I made of my Manson setting in a very, very hard packed intertidal zone. Yes I was anxious to try this anchor and my boat was not in the water yet. I was very anxious and wanted to see the setting characteristics of how the Manson Supreme anchor acted and I'd done this in the same spot with my CQR and Bruce before deciding to switch from the CQR to the Bruce years earlier. This intertidal zone is where I launch my brothers Boston Whaler and I drive my truck on it without even sinking in. I am in no way connected to Manson, hell I live in Maine, and Mansons are made down under in New Zealand. I have no motive in promoting the Spade or Manson other than the more Mansons out there the less I have to worry about other boats dragging into me..... Enjoy the video click on Drop Shots Day to view it...


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post #18 of 46 Old 01-12-2007
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Within all this debate about anchors and the tests in Practical Sailor and Sail Magazine, I have never had anyone point out that on land, plows are designed to plow a furrow, not dig in and hold. All the new anchors seem to be reverse plows. If I tried to plow the north forty on my dad's farm with a Spade, I don't think the old John Deere would get very far!
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post #19 of 46 Old 01-13-2007
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Well I think we've finally reached the point where we don't have to write two pages of theory and detail to build an argument. It's very simple:



Last argument, why to avoid copies, if the Supreme's position on the above chart isn't enough:


Here, the 35lb Supreme performs comparably with the 32lb Rocna in two of three locations, but proves unreliable "west of wharf"

Is a 2/3 reliability good enough? Just like Bruce always argued with regard to their imitators, "Would you leap from a plane with a haversack on your back because it looks like the real thing and comes at a rock bottom price? Remember an anchor is a safety device upon which the survival of you and your boat may ultimately depend."

Meanwhile the recommendation of a Delta continues to be good advice. As can be seen, even when tested in a very unfriendly environment, it compares very favorably even with the more modern designs. For example, SAIL's averaged holding power of the Delta was 3250lbs, vs the Manson Supreme at 2400lbs. Yachting Monthly reported the (genuine) Delta "set quickly and firmly" and called it "a consistent performer".

---------

Giulietta, while you have the right to be a cynic of our video, your tandem set-up is a disaster waiting to happen. I addressed that briefly on another thread.

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Sailnet Disclosure: Craig is the son of the designer of Rocna and has a financial interest in its success.

Last edited by Craig Smith; 02-01-2007 at 08:15 PM.
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post #20 of 46 Old 01-13-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Smith
Giulietta, while you have the right to be a cynic of our video, your tandem set-up is a disaster waiting to happen. I addressed that briefly on another thread.
Please, I am not cynic, that is a stong word, at least where I am (a cynic is a deceiver), I might be hard to convince.

Anyway, let me tell you that it's been 30 years now that I have been waiting for the disaster, and I am not in the caribbean or in a lake, this here is the North Atlantic . But, I have no charts to prove my point, on the tandem. Never needed to....

Tell you what, send me an anchor to Portugal, I'll test it during the summer on Giulietta, in the Culatra island, where we have sand/mud/weed/stones sea floors, 5 to 6 kts currents twice a day, and sometimes 30kts winds.

If I like it, I'll pay it, and come here publically to tell everyone that you're right, and eat my hat.

Deal??

Last edited by Giulietta; 01-13-2007 at 01:13 PM.
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