effectiveness of solar & wind

[conchyjoe]

Originally Posted by sailingdog

I'd second Cam's last post. You really won't get the efficiency they're claiming out of their panels, unless you are anal-retentive about trackng the sun with them. That gets old fast...

The other problem I see with the solar stick type mounts is how durable they will be when you have any significant wind. Rigid solar panels are heavy and present a fair bit of windage. Without proper support, they can destroy the mounts. Mine mount to two 1" stainless steel rails and the bases are through-bolted where they attach to the boat.

Actually they are as efficient as they say, according to 3-4 folks I have talked to that actually have them installed. One couple keeps them pointed in the direction of the sun during midday when their boat is in it's slip, and gets the rated output of the panels. The MPPT controller does the rest. They NEVER got rated output from their permanent mount panels because they never got direct sunlight.

I don't think moving a panel 3 times a day is anal retentive. After all, we are looking to get the best charge rate, right?

The SolarStik has been in development for a number of years according to the owners I interviewed, and I found the mount points and hardware to be stronger than anything I had seen. And the whole unit can be removed in seconds and stowed in case of inclement weather. Try taking a bimini top down when you have panels mounted on it.

Solarstik is at all the large trade shows, you should stop by and talk to them. And they are expanding into the EU soon as well.

[camaraderie]

tookewl...with a 100 watt solar panel at 12V the physics dictates that in direct sunlight you can get 8.3 AMPS at full output in direct sunlight. You are suggesting that WITHOUT adusting the panels for the angle of the sun that you can get the equivilent of between 10 and 12 hours a day of direct sunlight on the panels (setting aside wiring losses). That is complete BS.
The solar stick may be a good solution for some to get their panels out of the shade and get more output by tending to their angle frequently but I don't recall them claiming to have repealed the Ohms law. First post here...could you have some commercial interest in solar stick?

The owner of "solar stick" says: "Let’s take a look at the Solar Stik power production... It produces about 6 amps per hour "
You wanna explain how you're getting 80-100 AH out of that?? Maybe you live on a different planet that gets 16 hours of direct sunlight a day???

[sailingdog]

Cam-

I'd also question ConchyJoe's authenticity, as both of his two first posts are advocating SolarStiks oddly enough. I would also ask how he knows they're expanding into the EU if he has nothing to do with the company.

[LaLeLu]

Originally Posted by mikeedmo

We've been looking at the solarstik system which we can mount on a vestigial radar mount on our stern. The system has two solar panels and a mount for a wind generator. We've checked the units out over the last year and have heard nothing negative about them so we're getting ready to pull the trigger and install a system. Hope this is of interest for your given application and if anyone has any good or bad to say about solarstik I'd appreciate hearing from you before we write the check!

I can highly recommend the SolarStik. We just installed one on our boat a few weeks ago. As mentioned above, the system consists of two 50 watt panels, combined with a BlueSky "smart" charge controller. We consistantly get 80 - 100 amp hours per day out of these panels. (Our fridge is the biggest power consumer @ 40 amps, so we have plenty juice to spare). Last weekend we were already making 7.5 amps from 9am to 10am - after that through 4p, we were making 8+ amps per hour (then 7.5 amps and tapers off until sun goes down). The secret is you "pitch" them to the sun 3 times per day. Pitching them just means tilting them so that they are facing the sun - it takes about 3 seconds.

Another issue we faced with deciding which solar panels to go with was that we needed something that was easily removable. The Panels on the SolarStik easily come off and on, and if you choose, the entire mast part of the stick is removable. A few years ago we had to remove our fixed panels three times in preparation for hurricanes - what a pain that was. If you are making an ocean crossing, or had really big following seas, you might opt to remove the panels and the stick. They do have a lock that holds the panels in the down position though, so it would have to be pretty serious conditions that would necessitate removing them.

The SolarStik is built very well - I can stand on the arms of ours and it doesn't even flinch. The materials are high quality, marine proof. The components have pre-built in plugs. The latches have safety lines already attached so the can't be lost. Seriously, I can not say enough good things about this system.

Installation is a bit intimadating at first, but once you understand the process it is really not bad at all. The instructions are written very well. After you have the bottom foot cut and set, it's just a matter of finding the correct angle for the arms. (With a speed square, this is a breeze). We found a local metal fab shop to bend the arms. It took him about 10 minutes and cost $10 each. (Or hire someone to do it - I can't imagine it would cost very much). Installing the wiring is simple - especially since the unit is already pre-wired with plugs. All you need to do is run the wires from the charge controller, to the batteries.

Definately pm me if you have any questions on this system. I am totally sold on it.

[LaLeLu]

Originally Posted by camaraderie

tookewl...with a 100 watt solar panel at 12V the physics dictates that in direct sunlight you can get 8.3 AMPS at full output in direct sunlight. You are suggesting that WITHOUT adusting the panels for the angle of the sun that you can get the equivilent of between 10 and 12 hours a day of direct sunlight on the panels (setting aside wiring losses). That is complete BS.
The solar stick may be a good solution for some to get their panels out of the shade and get more output by tending to their angle frequently but I don't recall them claiming to have repealed the Ohms law. First post here...could you have some commercial interest in solar stick?

How can you make that claim - what are you basing that on? Do you have any personal knowledge or experience with this product? I own a solarstik and I have personal, first hand knowledge of getting 8+ amps per hour out of it. I have been at anchor for several days at a time, using only the solarstik and have kept my batteries at full charge - running our fridge (that makes ice), using the stereo, running anchor and cabin lights, (and we even use the microwave to make several bags of microwave popcorn As a post note, I have no affiliation with SolarStik (but I would buy their stock if they went public

[camaraderie]

Conchy Joe...you run a commercial equipment review website with the owner of solar stik as a contributor and as one of your TWO advertisers. Do you think you might have mentioned that in your post??

While you may feel free to contribute here as you see fit. Please adjust your signature to reflect your commercial interest in the success of different products. Note also that as a commercial poster, you may feel free to contribute answers to questions asked but may not introduce products here or direct people to your site except in answer to their specific questions. Thanks.

[conchyjoe]

Originally Posted by camaraderie

tookewl...with a 100 watt solar panel at 12V the physics dictates that in direct sunlight you can get 8.3 AMPS at full output in direct sunlight. You are suggesting that WITHOUT adusting the panels for the angle of the sun that you can get the equivilent of between 10 and 12 hours a day of direct sunlight on the panels (setting aside wiring losses). That is complete BS.
The solar stick may be a good solution for some to get their panels out of the shade and get more output by tending to their angle frequently but I don't recall them claiming to have repealed the Ohms law. First post here...could you have some commercial interest in solar stick?

The owner of "solar stick" says: "Let’s take a look at the Solar Stik power production... It produces about 6 amps per hour "
You wanna explain how you're getting 80-100 AH out of that?? Maybe you live on a different planet that gets 16 hours of direct sunlight a day???

I guess you didn't read my post. I'll make it simple for you.

If you take to 100 watt panels and lay them flat on the earth, they will almost never get direct sunlight. I think you can agree to that.

If you take the same 100 watt panels, and place them where you will get direct sunlight for a few hours during the day, kinda like being in a slip, like LaLeLu is, you will get full rated output of the panels for those few hours. You will also get the indirect sunlight you get from laying them flat on the earth as I explained above.

Therefore, the ability to point them is a gain over the inability to point them. Not to mention keeping them out ot the shade, not having them mounted on your Bimini, or cabin roof, or even hanging of the side, etc, etc.

Also quite a few people simply hook their solar panels and wind generators to their batteries, and then wonder why their batteries fail.

As far as your other comments are concerned, I do know the owners of Solarstik, and I did review it. I am not compensated in any way. I also review many others products from many other owners, speak at sailboat shows, and am respected in the community. You, obviously, are some young whipper snapper, that thinks post count means brains. That IS complete BS.

What I am trying to say is don't knock something, until you have tried it. The truth is, solar panels DO NOT put out 12 volts as you suggested, they put out anywhere from 15V to 20V in some cases. So you need a reliable solar charge controller to tie the whole thing together. A good MPPT charge controller will accentuate those hours of direct sunlight on the panels, increasing your charging capability once again.

[camaraderie]

LeLaLu...
I own a solarstik and I have personal, first hand knowledge of getting 8+ amps per hour out of it.
Since the owner of solar stick says it puts out 6 amps and you claim 8 I think you might need to adjust your measuring devices. I am NOT disparaging the product only claiming that CONTINOUS output of greater than 8.3 amps is impossible for a 100 watt panel. (100 watts= 12V x 8.3amps!!) and that therefore claims of 80-100 amp hours a day are ridiculous...especially since there are losses in the system and the owner says 6 amps is the average output INTO the batteries after regulation.
Sorry... I'm glad you are happy with the product but again...the laws of the universe don't get altered just cause somebody mounts a couple of panels on a rotating adjustable mount.

[conchyjoe]

Originally Posted by camaraderie

LeLaLu...
I own a solarstik and I have personal, first hand knowledge of getting 8+ amps per hour out of it.
Since the owner of solar stick says it puts out 6 amps and you claim 8 I think you might need to adjust your measuring devices. I am NOT disparaging the product only claiming that CONTINOUS output of greater than 8.3 amps is impossible for a 100 watt panel. (100 watts= 12V x 8.3amps!!) and that therefore claims of 80-100 amp hours a day are ridiculous...especially since there are losses in the system and the owner says 6 amps is the average output INTO the batteries after regulation.
Sorry... I'm glad you are happy with the product but again...the laws of the universe don't get altered just cause somebody mounts a couple of panels on a rotating adjustable mount.

Sorry, but I am going to believe my eyes, and the eyes of LaLeLu over what folks who have not even seen the product say, no matter what the website says.

Once again, solar panels don't put out 12V. I would consider checking out the BP website for specs, as well as the Blue Sky website, and redo your math.

I don't produce reviews about products unless I see them in action, and research all the components.

I'll debate price with you all day, but the product does at least what it says it does on the website.

[camaraderie]

Conchy...Please read MY post. I was responding to TOOKEWL...not you. Too kewl said that WITHOUT ADJUSTMENT they were getting 80-100ah out of their solar stick. I said that was BS.
I agree the ability to adjust will get you more amps. The point is that the owner and your friend said that 6 amps was maximum in direct sunlight. That means with the ability to adjust you can get a maximum of 6 amps out of the panels while the sun is out if you adjust. 10 hours of sunlight then would give you 60 AMPS.
As for the MPPT controller and your claim...100 watts is 100 watts...a funtion of design. At 17V output that = 5.88 amps....at 12V output that = 8.33 amps. The MPPT controller makes sure you don't lose too much of the available power in direct sunlight but does not change the maximum theoretical output of 8.33A at 12V and losses in the wiring and charging/regulation /acceptance process probably account for Brian's very realistic 6amp specification.
I think I'll await the practical sailor test rather than rely on you or your site for my data.
EDIT: JUST saw your latest post. I'll debate price with you all day, but the product does at least what it says it does on the website. Yes it does and the website says 6amps....and makes no outrageous claims. I think they are honest and simply market their product as a unique turn-key solution which it is (at a hefty price premium but with payback in performance over time.) I am objecting to outrageous claims by others.

As for the personal attack...stuff it or I'll pull my moderator button out. We don't allow that here.