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Major Damage!

5K views 32 replies 15 participants last post by  cardiacpaul 
#1 ·
Getting a bottom job. When they hauled the boat, we noticed a new crack about 6" long just in front of the keel where the keel meets the hull. I thought perhaps it was delamination, just cosmetic. The yard says it was caused by the keel/hull flexing away from each other and that it is structural. They say I am looking at a $2000 glass repair.

I have a modified full keel. The crack runs about 6" fore-to-aft just in front of the keel where it joins the hull. It's a 44', 27,000Lb vessel with GRP hull.

I'll post photos later.

Comments? Advice?
 
#2 ·
Ouch... I'd get a surveyor in to look at the issue. THe yard is going to have a vested interest in saying it needs to be repaired, since they are in the repair business. A good surveyor can also tell you what else may need to be looked at, and possibly what could have caused it, and what can be done to remedy it.
 
#3 ·
JR...the yard could very well be right. Have they ground down through the gelcoat and does the crack extend THROUGH (not TO) the woven roving? Are you seeing any water ingress into the boat or can you see the crack from under your floorboards? I agree with the need for a surveyor to take a look as whatever has caused this may need to be attended to before a fix in the glass is made. On the other hand...this may just be some gel-coat flex cracking in which case it should not be a big deal at all. You need a pro to look at it.
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the replies guys. I cannot see the crack from inside. There is no water ingress. My first impression was that it's just, as you said, a surface crack and not one that goes deep. We had a rather rough soft-grounding last year and the boat was repeatedly lifted and dropped onto the keel before we could get out of it.

The yard has not dug into the crack yet, but they seem confident that it's a big deal. This sound odd to me, hence my post. They are a reputable yard. I'll ask them to do this before I hire a surveyor.
 
#5 ·
Given that you had a soft grounding and the boat was lifted and dropped on its keel repeatedly, it is very likely that something broke back then. I would still rather have a surveyor look at it, and examine the keel-hull connection structures particularly closely, as that may have been cracked by the repeated groundings, and while it may not be leaking yet, it could mean that you could lose the keel later... that would be bad.
 
#6 ·
Guy...altough it may seem big and scary...without opening, seeing and confirming, its all speculation...

Those areas are pretty well reinforced (unless your boat is a Bavaria), so chances are its superficial.

So please...open, see smell...then worry, if you have to.

Send a photo, I like watching stuff.
 
#8 ·
"So please...open, see smell...then worry, if you have to."

Very sage advise.

its a 44 ft boat, and they're telling you 2000.00 to fix it? bubba, that ain't much moollllaaaaa at all, considering.
 
#9 ·
Agreed, $2K to haul the boat and repair the crack would be expected. The problem I have is that I am already paying $2500 for a bottom job, and the crack was discovered in the course of doing the bottom job. The yard wants an ADDITIONAL $2K just to fix the crack. If it is superficial, I would think that would be a lot of extra dough to grind it, fill it, and fair it. They are already fixing other blemishes in the bottom (blisters and scratches) as part of the price of the bottom job. To me, this just seems like another blemish that needs fixing.

I just scooted over there and inspected it closely and took a ton of pictures. I'll upload them later today. It seems to me that if the keel was flexing and in jeopardy of falling off, there would be other stress cracks around the perimeter of the keel/hull joint. There are not. I'm starting to wonder if the crack is simply the failure/delamination of a previous repair job from where the boat possibly hit something at that spot.
 
#10 ·
It is better to find out if the hull/keel join is in good shape or not now, while the boat is on the hard, than on the water, the hard way. ;)
 
#12 ·
What boat is this? And, is there any sign of damage or deformation aft of the keel, or arond the keel bolts?

If you hull was built (as some are) in halves that are joined afterwards, this could be the centerline joint opening up as the boat flexed over the keel, or just a cosmetic top layer moving. So some "optimistic caution" is called for.
 
#14 ·
Just removing the gelcoat over the crack is an easy job. I had this done on one of my previous boats over the entire keel-hull joint. Hired a guy that does "bottom peeling" and he used the peeler machine (basically an electric plane), took him less than an hour for the entire seam and i paid accordingly. So, I think uncovering a 6" crack should be pretty cheap.
Ditto for covering it up if there is no problem - some epoxy with silica filler and a few hours of your time is all that is needed.
By doing this, you will be able to find out what the problem really is. Without that you are just speculating. In my experience what looks "bad" from the outside could easily turn inconsequential and, conversely, something that looks small and insignificant could be a sign of a serious problem.
 
#15 · (Edited)
This is a 1981 Bob Perry Cheoy Lee. The mast is keel-stepped. The crack is not actually in the keel. It is in the hull just forward of the keel, directly in the center. (Again, pictures to follow in bit! :D ) I don't see any keel bolts. How do they attach a keel like this? Is it just one continuous piece, formed seamlessly with the hull? Or, do they still use bolts and the bolts are just glassed over? Sorry, my ignorance is showing.
 
#16 ·
cardiacpaul said:
2k is STILL cheap. regardless of whatever else they are doing.
Not if this isn't fixing the underlying problem that caused the crack.
 
#18 ·
Yes, but did the grounding cause some of the hull-keel bolts to fail? Did it cause the hull to flex and break stringers? That's the question. If either of those happened, you can fix the crack, but then the motion of the boat will cause the hull to crack again, since the underlying structure of the hull is damaged. You need to know if that is the case or not.
 
#20 ·
jr438234606 said:
We're thinking that my grounding the boat caused the crack. In that case, no amount of money would be enough to fix the problem. :eek:
Sure, you could always buy something that grounding doesn't bother, like one of these:

 
#21 · (Edited)
Pictures

Ok, here we go. Attached are the pictures. I stuck a screw driver in the crack for size/placement reference. The other pictures of the keel are to show that there is no apparent :)eek: ) damage around the keel. The portion of the hull material that is hanging down on each side of the crack is about 1/4 " thick. I could not see any hair-line crack inside the larger crack. The yard is not suggesting that we remove the keel, or even do destructive inspection around it. They say that all they need to do is remove the loose material, grind around it, build it back up, fair it and paint it. If that's the case, I could do that myself!

I've inspected inside the hull where the crack is and I can't see any evidence of damage. I've been all under the cabin sole and have inspected the stringers and bulkheads. None show any signs of the hull flexing. The mast is stepped well aft of where the crack is. It seems to me that if the keel was twisting around enough to cause a crack of this type, there would also be evidence around the keel in other places.

Anyway, here are the pics. The bottom has already been sanded and is ready for paint. Comments welcome:















 
#24 ·
Looks like the laminate tore or delaminated.... maybe it was a dry void in the laminate. Definitely want a surveyor to look at it IMHO.
 
#25 ·
I would definitely fix that. I would be worried about water ingress into the laminate and eventually causing more problems. Personally, I would do it myself by grinding it down until I was at solid material and then building back up, sealing and fairing. Might as well do it now versus getting the boat wet and then discovering that water is getting into the glass. Do it now before they finish the bottom job. I'll do it myself and give you a deal... only $1900 ;)
 
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