Automatic lifevest - Page 2 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
 Not a Member? 
  #11  
Old 05-24-2007
foxglove's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Columbus OH
Posts: 180
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 12
foxglove is on a distinguished road
Hooking to the Mainsheet

For years, I have hooked my harness to the mainsheet. It gives me access to the belowdeck area as well as the entire cockpit with no possibility of going over the side. I could never think of a reason not to use the mainsheet as a hookup. Perhap you guys can.

To go forward, I hook up to the slab reefing line on the boom, then hook up to a jack line that I tie around the mast and cleat at the bow.

I also prefer my trusty harness over the combo harness/autoinflate pfd because it is so comfortable, even under foul weather jacket, that I don't mind wearing it all of the time on board. That way I am used to moving about the boat while harnessed, which takes practice because you constantly find yourself wrapped up and doing funny waltzes to spin free.

I guess I'll use the auto-inflate/harness when the weather gets rough although I'm worried that the extra bulk will restict my movement enough to throw me out of routine and over the side.

My two cents
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #12  
Old 05-24-2007
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,290
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Foxglove-

The forces generated by a body falling across a boat in a broach or similar situation are high enough that they can probably rip the reefing lines off the boom or damage the boom in the process of halting your fall—same with the mainsheet. The acceleration of a body across a boat in a broach situation is often rotational, not gravitational and can far exceed that of gravity alone.

Finally, having to clip and unclip as you move forwards leaves you vulnerable at the times you are moving the harness connection from one point to the next. Having a continuous jackline that runs from the cockpit up to the foredeck, as I do on my boat, means that you can just clip in and stay clipped in.

Most of the inflatable PFDs with harnesses are pretty compact and really don't get in your way much at all.


BTW— just remember that inflatable PFDs do not count towards your PFD count in a USCG inspection unless they are being worn.
Carrying extra non-inflatable PFDs can prevent you from getting a stiff fine, should you be boarded and someone not be wearing their inflatable PFD.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #13  
Old 05-24-2007
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 19
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
VMacDonald is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giulietta
In Europe you have to have Navy approved (we don't have Coast Guard as a separate body) life vests, equal to the number of declared boat human capacity. Plus a raft for equal numner of people, raft type depends on boats authorized sailing type. (coastal, off shore trans oceaninc etc.).
I think these rules vary by country, in the UK a yacht under 13.7 metres doesn't need to comply with any safety equipment regulation (assuming it's a pleasure craft - i.e. not being used for financial gain) and the rules for yachts under 24 metres are very few.

We also have no requirements for any kind of qualifications to skipper a yacht and no legal requirement for insurance, though most marinas in the UK require that yachts moored there carry insurance. The only required paperwork in the UK is a radio licence and that's obviously only needed if you actually have a radio equipment installed!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #14  
Old 05-25-2007
foxglove's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Columbus OH
Posts: 180
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 12
foxglove is on a distinguished road
SD, as always, I greatly repect your opinion. It just seem that all of that tension I put on the mainsheet or reefing line when grinding upwind in strong winds is more than any stress my fat ass could put on it.

Non-the-less, I will rig a bow to stern jack line and use that this year.

Thanks
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #15  
Old 05-29-2007
Thanks Courtney.
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: IL
Posts: 3,954
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 11
T34C has a spectacular aura about T34C has a spectacular aura about T34C has a spectacular aura about
Just my $.02

SD- is right reguarding the forces exerted when you get flung around and off the boat. However, there is a difference in that the jackline he suggests running is a very static attachment and will result in a much greater shock load to all its components than a more dynamic system. I'm still thinking about the idea of clipping into the mainsheet, but it is certainly "dynamic"!

Big difference between the canister of a PFD from Worst Marine and those already on the airplanes... they know what is in the ones already on the planes.
__________________
hunter Legend 37 Semper Paratus
Formerly - Tartan 34C Yawl
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #16  
Old 05-29-2007
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 730
Thanks: 6
Thanked 54 Times in 49 Posts
Rep Power: 9
knuterikt is on a distinguished road
Some thoughts about lifevests
Here in Norway all leisure crafts have to carry CE approved PFD for all persons currently onboard.

One important issue with all inflatable PFD’s is that they must be checked for leaks regularly (at least every year). There have also been reports of new lifevest with leaks, so I will also check new lifewests before bringing then onboard.

I just read the accident report after the loss of sailing vessel Ouzo southwest of Portsmouth 21. August 2006.
This report is interesting reading for all safety aware skippers.
Report can be found here Marine Accident Investigation Branch: Ouzo - Flyer to Leisure Industry

One of the conclutions in the report is I quote:
“One of the crew members survived in the water very much longer than the others probably due to the fact that he had fitted his lifejacket tightly. The simple addition of a crotch strap would have significantly increased the survival times of the yachtsmen. Crotch straps should not be optional extras on lifejackets; they should be supplied, fitted and worn.”
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #17  
Old 05-29-2007
hellosailor's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10,875
Thanks: 2
Thanked 101 Times in 98 Posts
Rep Power: 10
hellosailor has a spectacular aura about hellosailor has a spectacular aura about
T34C-
Realize that the mainsheet is INelastic line, while traditional tubular nylon jacklines are ELASTIC stretchy nylon. That's one reason to use tubular nylon, it will absorb impact loads.
Same thing in rock climbing ropes--you want your safety line to be elastic, so the shock doesn't break your neck when you fall and it pulls you up short of the ground. Stretchy isn't always a bad idea.

Crotch straps were never a big seller because they cost money and they are "more stuff" and worse, they tend to leave male people squeaking in high voices. But they also force the vest down low, and unless a vest is forced down BELOW the water level, it provides zero bouyancy. So simply adding a crotch strap can add 1/4 more lift to a PFD (or scuba BC) and that can keep your nose and mouth out of the water--a very good thing.

The new Crewfits come with two crotch straps, intended to avoid the castrati problem, but to me that's just Too Damned Much Stuff compared to one strap and riding it sidesaddle. So to speak.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #18  
Old 05-30-2007
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,290
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
The Spinlock DeckwarePro, which is my personal favorite, has thigh straps rather than crotch straps... much more comfortable IMHO... especially for the guys.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #19  
Old 06-06-2007
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 5
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
cstockard is on a distinguished road
I am a lifelong sailor, sailing instructor, and liveaboard cruiser and have seen the good and bad of both PFDs and jacklines.

Inflatable PFDs with built in harnesses are the way to go. We are never underway without them on. If the seas are calm and the situation stable then we allow them to be removed while in the cockpit, but they go back on before any maneuvers or movement away from the cockpit. An example of why this is important occurred this winter as we approached an anchorage after a hearty sail upwind. The wind was about 15 knots and the seas were small but lumpy as we dropped the main at the edge of the anchorage. It is still not clear to me what exactly what happened, but I remember pulling up on the sail tie and the boat making a jerk so I lost my grip. My feet rose from the deck and I went flying. I expected to land on the side deck, but instead my shin hit the 30 inch high lifeline and I was cartwheeled into the water. My vest immediately inflated and I popped to the surface!

The point is that you never know when you might go in the water, or after hitting what object on the way. In my case I was uninjured, and since the sails were already down and the boat barely moving, I was able to swim to the stern and clamber back aboard. You need to be wearing your flotation anytime you are working, because it is when you are working that you are distracted and can find yourself unexpectedly in the drink.

I also really favor the built in harnesses. Often building waves and winds come up suddenly. If you have a built in harness all you have to do is grab a tether and clip in. With a separate harness you have to find the harness, put it on, and clip in, perhaps while conditions are rapidly worsening.

As for jacklines, the common practice of running them the length of the boat along the scuppers is a bad practice as if you are falling off the boat the jackline won't stop you until you are dragging alongside...not a happy place to be. You really want the jacklines to be as close to the center of the boat as possible, preferably combined with a tether length that causes one to fetch up short and drop INSIDE the lifelines. We've divided our jacklines into three "tracks". The first is on the floor of the cockpit and is easily reachable from the companionway. With a short tether you can just reach sit on the the coaming and lean on the lifelines. The second track run from the cockpit around the outside of the dodger to strong points near the centerline of the cabin house. The third track runs straight forward on either side of the mast to the foredeck. We use ORC tethers with two working ends and a quick release shackle at the chest. The object is to keep a falling sailor as close to the centerline of the boat and inboard of the lifelines if at all possible.

I sort of like the idea of a short tether on the mainsheet or reefing lines because they also keep the attachment point inboard and high, making it hard to get outside the lifelines. On a really small boat with relatively weak lines this wouldn't be strong enough, but on a 35-40 class boat I expect that the lines would have plenty of reserve strength for this use. Dedicated jackline are probably better, but this is a useful idea to keep in mind.

Chris
Legacy Sailing

Last edited by cstockard; 06-06-2007 at 03:03 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #20  
Old 06-06-2007
welshwind's Avatar
Re-Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Lake Michigan
Posts: 225
Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
welshwind is on a distinguished road
Auto-inflate with harness -- Let me tell you a little story that ends with a father (me) standing soaking wet and responding to his daughter's question as to what happened by saying "Do as I say, not as I did"

We got our first RIB and slapped a 15hp engine on it. My family was coming up to our sailboat. I was all ready there, everything was shipshape and I had 40 minutes to kill. I need to break in the RIB engine which required getting out on Lake Michigan in order to get up to proper speed. So I put on my auto-inflate vest, for some reason attach the engine shutoff lanyard to my wrist (I never do that when I'm just idling around the marina) and headed out onto the lake. It has some rollers and I thought I was being really careful as I got the RIB up on plane. Little did I realize I was followed by a large powerboat. When it exited the channel and accelerated, it kicked out a huge wake. Not knowing that it was behind me, I went to make a gentle turn to starboard (still at pretty high speed), hit this huge wake at an awkward angle and the next thing I knew, I was in the 60 degree water thinking "hey, my vest inflated!" I really would not have been wanting to find the handle to inflate it at that moment. The lanyard was ripped from my wrist (and the engine, thank God) and was nowhere to be found. I swam back to the RIB, climbed over the side and rowed back to the dock. Fortunately, I was not very far from the channel entrance.

So, I learned that:
- I loved my auto-inflate
- attach the engine kill lanyard to your vest in a way it can't be pulled off and lost
- and, in case it is lost anyway, always travel with a second lanyard so one doesn't have to row much
__________________
S/V Benediction
Catalina 445

"To reach the port of heaven, we must sail sometimes with the wind and sometimes against it - but we must sail, and not drift, nor lie at anchor.”
- Oliver Wendel Holmes
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Selector switch or Automatic Relay PBzeer Gear & Maintenance 17 09-04-2007 09:25 AM
AIS (Automatic Identification System) admin Gear & Maintenance 2 02-13-2006 01:57 AM
comfortable lifevest for wife & mother in law paulmcquillan herSailNet 4 08-25-2002 07:48 PM
Inflatable Lifevest Maintenance Mark Matthews Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 07-03-2002 09:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:04 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.