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Honda 2hp ??

14K views 42 replies 20 participants last post by  MarkSF 
#1 ·
Anyone have any experience with the Honda 2HP with centrifagul clutch? Looking at a new outboard and weight is primary concern. Had a dealer say stay away from the Honda because clutch engages when starting?? Any real life experience??
 
#3 ·
I've had one for a couple years, it can lurch a little if you've got the throttle open a little more than required when starting cold. When starting warm doesn't require any thottle and it's not a problem. The clutch takes some time getting used to, but I really like it.
 
#4 ·
In so far as the $1000 price tag, I did some shopping around for the honda and found many local marina's offering it for under $800.00. Also with the boat shows all coming up, a deal can be had.
 
#5 ·
I use a Suzuki 2.5HP 4-stroke. Comes with gear shift for Forward and Neutral. Great little obm. Had used a Yamaha 3.3hp 2-stroke with clutch. Didn't like it as runs a risk of jack rabbit start and close quarters control without neutral gear.
 
#6 ·
When I bought the Honda it was the only 2 HP available new in Calif., best price I found was Oceanside Marine Center $869. Dockmate recently got the Suzuki and I believe he said he was able to get it for $680. Besides gearing, I think the Suzuki may be water cooled, Honda is air cooled. I find it impractical to "rinse in fresh water after each use", I wouldn't be any better about a water cooled engine, but I feel less guilt. The centrifugal clutch works okay on an inflatable after you got it wired, might be a handfull on a hard dink.
 
#7 ·
Hi,
I just returned from sailing yesterday (a group of friends asked me to be a skipper for the boat they chartered) and we had a Honda 2HP 4 stroke engine on the little inflatable.
1) It really is light - very nice.
2) starting: first time users used either too little throttle to start or too much (gear engaged), several pulls were needed - more than I am used to with 2-stroke Tohatsu (4 to 10 HP models) for example.
3) running: It died almost every time when opening throttle when cold, but when started again it usually managed to engage clutch without killing the engine. Perhaps we should a) use (more) chock or b) wait a minute to warm up just a little
4) landing: with more throttle you hit the sailboat (or pier) fast, with less the clutch disengage and you stop before you get to your destination.
We were first time users of that motor and after a few try-and-error attempts we got it.
I did miss the manual gear: when landing to a sailboat on the anchor I often left the motor in gear with min. throttle - so dinghy is gently pushed against the boat allowing me to tie it.
With centrifugal clutch it is either too fast or not engaged.
4) fuel consumption: I do not know. We got it almost empty and after 4 days it was almost empty. So perhaps it does not use any :)

Conclusion: For charter use (first time users, complete novice to outboards, ...) I prefer manual clutch and more power.
Ability to run it in gear at very low RPM was missing a little.
When we learned how to use it we appreciated how light it was.
 
#8 ·
4) landing: with more throttle you hit the sailboat (or pier) fast, with less the clutch disengage and you stop before you get to your destination.
That's what I disliked about it. Even after a few years it seems impossible to find that 'magic spot' where you are creeping at a high idle but not low enough to have the clutch dis-engage.
 
#10 ·
Not with the Honda, but with a Nissan I think it was. It was ok, but when you are at the shore, you will often have to start that motor while in the water (so you can keep your nose into the breakers before you get in). Are you ok with that? Also, that little engine is going to have to push hard to get through any breakers at the shore.

When going back to the boat, you will get used to just killing it and coming in at a slow ramming speed. Better grab the ladder first time.

I honestly am a fan of a GOOD, properly sized outboard. It is one of the most used pieces of equipment on our boat. In a very controlled atmosphere, the small outboards are fine. However, if you are planning on cruising or will be using it on the coast wheere you might beach the dink, I think you will not be happy.

Just my real life experiences.

- CD
 
#12 ·
Thanks for all the input. Really want the light weight but sounds like the Honda is not all I thought it would be. Hard to beat Honda but sounds like the clutch could be a problem. Willing to live with the "starting" issue but never thought about the low speed potential problems. Thanks again, will keep looking.
 
#14 ·
Actually the air cooled engines are not really the way to go. The Honda 2 hp was a great little engine when it was watercooled. Then Honda redesigned it around seven years ago as an air cooled model and gave it the centrifugal clutch. It was a step backwards in my opinon. In fact its really the only marginal engine that Honda offers. It's only advantage is that it is light. If that's more important(and in some situations it is) than engine life than it may be your best choice. There isn't a bad brand out there so Suzuki, Yamaha, etc would all be a good choice.
 
#18 ·
The old Volkswagen Beetle engines were air-cooled. Are you saying there is something intrinsically wrong with air-cooling on an outboard, as opposed to the added weight, complexity and need to flush a seawater cooling circuit?

I can accept that Honda's made a poorly designed air-cooled outboard with a wonky clutch. I have trouble accepting that the entire premise is bogus for engines in the "mini" size range.

Having crew who are themselves fairly compact, I am interested in all options. As I'll be pushing either a 10-foot "hard" rowing tender or a Portabote, 4 HP is my UPPER limit, so things like weight, ease of stowage and mechanical reliability become paramount.

If I thought I was bringing my 11 foot RIB long-term cruising, I'd just stick with either the 80 lb 9.9 two-stroke or 110 pound 9.9 four-stroke I already own...but both are too big to be buggering around with in three feet of sea, even with cranes. I want something I can haul up with the boat or have manually passed to me on deck. That means 40 lbs. or less...a "luggable" outboard.
 
#16 · (Edited)
I have a great wife......last christmas a very large present was under the tree in the morning and as it turned out, it was the new Yamaha 2.5 four stroke I was lusting after:D We really like it, it has a neutral/fwd gear, not heavy, starts easily and is relatively quiet. This one replaces an older Evinrude 2 hp that was always temperamental to start when cold.
I like the light weight because I always take it off the dink and mount on the stern rail, plus I have a hard dink that doesn't require a lot of horses to push her along.
One thing about an air cooled engine is that it's a lot louder than a water cooled. I also have a couple of old Tanaka air cooled engines(LOUD) that are reliable, but not too robust. My two cents....
 
#17 ·
I purchased a new 2 hp Honda the first of this summer and just love it. As to the clutch. During start up of the Honda the clutch will engage if the throttle setting is too high. This has happened to me several times. However, if anticipated it can be prevented. I do not find this a problem. I have had four persons in my tender and the honda pushes us along without difficulty. The honda runs quietly at lower speeds but has the speed increases so does the engine noise. Also, the fuel tank, so far, seals well to where I have not had leaks or fuel smell.

I hope this helps.
 
#21 ·
christyliegh and valiente,
I think you are both on target with my thinking. I have a larger outboard now, went with "get the biggest ya can" advise. Also have a crane, but, even with that it's quite a balancing act, other than at the dock, getting 100lbs on and off the boat. I take it you are satisfied with the Honda?? Any starting/relieability problems??
Jerry
Tsing Tao
 
#22 · (Edited)
I'm not a heavy outboard/dingy user but since my Honda still runs good after my lack of use and poor maintenence habits I guess that's an endorsement. I used it a few times this year because the 15 hp that came with the NC/Caribe dingy package was down. The year before that it sat in my garage improperly winterized because with the new boat, new enging, etc... I didn't know what I was going to do with it. Sometimes I don't treat my old machinery well. It's a Honda - It Runs.
 
#24 ·
I have a walker bay "hard" dink. Walker bay recomends a 2 hp engine, I am not sure if that is because of weight of the motor or power.
 
#25 ·
Dealer showed me the trick for starting the Honda, slowly pull till you feel resistance which indicates start of compression stroke. Let it rewind and then give it the starting pull. When cold, it coughs with full choke on first pull, reduce to half choke, it starts on second pull. When warm it starts first pull everytime this way.
They are susceptible to oil leakage if laid down the wrong way. I wouldn't call the clutch wonky or whatever, just gotta get used to it. You learn exactly how far your dink will fetch in all kinds of conditions.
 
#26 ·
Good information. My '85 Honda BF100 (a 9.9 HP 4-stroke) starts the same way: pull until tension...release...full choke, then cut back in a couple of seconds to half-choke.

Come to think of it, my Atomic 4 likes five seconds of full choke, and then ease it back until it picks up speed, then lean her out completely. I rarely need choke when running, unless the engine is near freezing.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Air cooled engines just never seem to hold up to the salt water environment. Combine that with the burn up factor on the clutch and the Honda just does not leave me or anyone I know feeling warm and fuzzy about it. I used to sell Honda's and I think they have a product line as good anyone else. But, that 2 is not robust and the number one thing I look for is reliability in an outboard. The five and up I would trust with my life. But, I would let my ex-wife use the Honda 2, actually I would recommend one for her anytime:)
 
#28 ·
I'm still not getting a straight answer from you, 'Guru. What fundamental aspect of air-cooled engines is a negative in salt water when compared with seawater cooling (that needs freshwater flushing?)

And from where is your contention that the clutch "burns up"? I wish to learn, if you can tell me, why my intention to buy an air-cooled Honda 2 is misguided, despite a number of endorsements from individuals and tests run by Practical Sailor.

I haven't bought anything yet, but I wish to understand why a more standard engine (neutral, water-cooled, heavier) in the same HP range is superior to this particular featherweight Honda.
 
#29 ·
Air cooled engines are more susceptible to internal corrosion and overheating than water cooled engines. That's why you never see any air cooled engines that still work after ten years of use. Once this model get's its tenth year birthday it will have been around long enough to see if it beats the air cooled curve. The clutch is prone to burning up when the engine pushes anything other than a light load. IE, the heavier the load the more likely that you will have a failure. Back before Honda ruined the 2 I sold many of them with great confidence. After the modification we began seeing a significant amount of clutch failures when the engine was used to push loads greater than 600lbs. I remember it as having 4 of them with clutch failures out of some 30 sold between 2002 and 2003 at the company location at which I worked. That's versus no failures from any other brand. It's also a little louder than the previous 2.

If you want to buy one do so. You probably will get years of flawless use out it since you are in a cold water climate. But, my contention is that virtually any other engine in that 2-2.5 range is more reliable than the Honda. This is based on my personal past experience as a dealer for Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Tohatsu/Nissan and Mercury. I don't have an axe to grind with Honda. They make outboards as reliable as any other brand. But, that 2 was/is/will be a step away from their usual rock solid reputation.
 
#30 ·
But, that 2 was/is/will be a step away from their usual rock solid reputation.
Thanks for the specifics. I am in southern Canada, where the water is 20-24 C for much of the summer...not tropical but not cool, either. This would be for a tropical application, so I thank you for the explanation.

Durability is also important to me, but I needed to see a more specific argument against the Honda 2. You've provided that, particularly as we would row or sail the tender with light loads, and merely use the OB to push...at a slow speed...a laden Portabote for cargo or three people and light gear in the sailing tender.

If I move into the 2-3.5 HP water-cooled range, then what would you recommend is the best compromise between durability, low weight and torque-y pushing power? The recent PS article indicated some negative attributes, but if you sell a variety of models and understand my parameters for "10-12 foot Portabote and/or nesting sailing dinghy used to convey groceries needing the lightest practical engine that is 4-stroke and can be hauled up a ladder by a fit 115-lb. woman in her 30s", then I'd welcome your suggestions.
 
#31 ·
Any brand that she can lift. I would go with the largest that she can carry keeping in mind that engines are light in the cool of the morning and seem to double in weight on a hot July afternoon. All brands of 4-stoke in the same hp have the same power output at the same RPM range so there is little or no difference in useable power at the prop. On a side note; Torque is a measurement at the engines crankshaft and is only one factor in determing hp at the prop which is where outboard hp is measured. The Feds stepped in back in 1987 and required all manufacturers as of 1988 to quote their hp as prop shaft rated at a given max RPM so that consumers would be able to have a valid way of comparing an outboards useable power. It's not a perfect system as it does not take into account prop slippage, but it will give you a fairly good idea of what an engine is capable of.

If you want a criteria for determing what is best for you I would think in the following terms:

Relaibility (All brands in this size range with Honda being iffy)

Is the dealer a jerk or a gem. ( Any easy way to find out is to call them and say you bought an engine from another dealer a year ago and are having a problem with it suddenly stopping. If they are helpful then they will be helpful if you buy one from them. If they tell you to take it back where you bought it, well you have just learned that they have no character.)

Intial price shouldn't be an issue as all brands are priced based on local market conditions and the "thief" factor of the local dealer.

Dealer availability. Some people think this is the most important factor. I don't agree, but I wouldn't by a brand of outboard if you have to take it to a dealer over 25 miles away.

The following brands start up on the first or second pull out of the box: Yamaha, Honda andTohatsu/Nissan/Mercury

The Suzuki 2-6 usually needs to be adjusted out of the box before it will stay running. Once it gets that intial adjustment it's fine. That size range of Suzuki is not Japanese made and for whatever reason seems to lack that last bit of QC
 
#32 ·
I'm leaning toward the Yamaha because they are so ubiquitous where we are heading, which is likely to be some distance beyond 25 miles from a dealer.

I guess I'll have to get used to FW rinsing, because the usage pattern will be occasional (a few times a week in port, not at all in a lagoon).

Thanks for the suggestions.
 
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