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  #1  
Old 10-29-2007
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Winterizing - When to do engine in terms of haulout

I will be winterizing my 18HP Perkins diesel for my Catalina 270 for the first time. The marina requires it before winter haul-out. Assuming I change the oil and antifreeze the raw water intake, how do marinas deal with getting the boat the the haul-out area? I'm confused. What order and when should I do the winterization of everything?

Also, what is your opinion on this? The marina I currently keep my sailboat in sent me the usual winter contract for storage. Attached was an optional list of their offerings for winterizing. After sending my check for winter haul-out, I was called by the manager to tell me that this marina "is a full service marina". Basically, he told me that we needed for THEM to do ALL winterization or else I could not store my boat there.

I mentioned that my boat neighbor does all his own winterization to which the manager replied, "well, I'm not letting new people do that." Is this strange? Why send an optional list when it is required? Again, confused here.

Thanks!
Jim
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Old 10-29-2007
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You are being hosed ...

... but so are a lot of people. Many marinas behave like storm troopers toward their customers. You are not alone, but that doesn't mean you have to take it lying down. You may be stuck with this boatyard for this winter season, but start talking with your neighbors on the dock, people you race or cruise with to find out whether there is a better choice in your area.

Many boatyards do not allow their customers to paint their own bottoms, or to perform any other work on their own boats. One of the boatyards in our harbor will force you to launch on their schedule in the Spring. If you are not ready they will charge you to move your boat out of the way. Maybe the boatyard you are dealing with is not the worst in your area. But you need to talk to people to find out.
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Tell them to expletive off.
This is restrictive practice.... no-doubt it is $10,000 to winterise, plus taxes.
You are being ripped off.
No-doubt they have to make the coffeee for you when you are on board?
Tell them you do not want it winterised after all, then do it yourself, quietly.
All you have to do is drain the coolant anyway, and blow the coolant water out of the gearbox.
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Old 10-29-2007
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You are definitely getting hosed... many marinas do this, figuring that you are basically a captive market. One marina near me requires that all work, even just pressure washing the deck, be done by their staff. My marina on the other hand, allows you to do the work yourself, or to hire whatever vendor you choose—provided they can meet the liability insurance requirements—which shouldn't be an issue for any legitimate vendor.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trescool View Post
Assuming I change the oil and antifreeze the raw water intake, how do marinas deal with getting the boat the the haul-out area? I'm confused. What order and when should I do the winterization of everything?
Ideally you do it w/in very close range of the haul-out apparatus so the boat can just be walked over to the lift/crane. Otherwise the fresh-water system anti-freeze has to be done on the hard, which almost certainly means removing the thermostat (temporarily) and might mean having to capture the exhaust.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trescool View Post
Also, what is your opinion on this? The marina I currently keep my sailboat in sent me the usual winter contract for storage. Attached was an optional list of their offerings for winterizing. After sending my check for winter haul-out, I was called by the manager to tell me that this marina "is a full service marina". Basically, he told me that we needed for THEM to do ALL winterization or else I could not store my boat there.
As somebody else suggested: You're probably stuck this time, but I'd be looking for a new marina.

When we brought our boat up, all the local marinas wanted to charge us for a full season when the season was already half over. That told me all I needed to know about how commercial marinas operate. So we joined the sail club we were planning to join, anyway. With slip fee, annual membership dues, and haul-out/storage/put-in fees it comes to about the same as one of the marinas, plus we have the camaraderie of the club, the facilities of the clubhouse, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trescool View Post
I mentioned that my boat neighbor does all his own winterization to which the manager replied, "well, I'm not letting new people do that." Is this strange?
Strange? No. Seems predatory to tell you at the point you're already committed, tho. (I assume you weren't warned when you signed up for a slip there.) Could be any number of reasons. Could be insurance reasons. Could be the decided they needed another revenue stream. Could be both.

Jim
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However, if it wasn't mentioned that using the marina for winterization of your boat was a requirement, I am pretty sure you can argue with doing it yourself, especially if other people at the same marina do it themselves. I would talk to the marina owner regarding this, not the manager, who has a more vested interest in getting the service work. The marina owner has more interest in not having pissed off potential customers and getting bad word-of-mouth about his facility, which has a much more negative impact in the long run.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

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2 things,
a) review your current lease, is there anything in there about it...

b) have them put in writing what they're telling you.

if there is noting in the lease, and they won't put it in writing, tell 'em to piss off.
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Old 10-29-2007
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tell the guy you already winterized the boat. and are they still interested in your storage business? tell them you may need some work done in the spring.

where do you live? perhaps others can recommend a yard.

also, to move your boat - find a place near the haul out area to flush out the motor - then get a couple of 5 gallon buckets of water/anti-freeze - stick the seawater intake into the bucket and move the boat to the haul out area. once you're in the left well, shut the motor down.

as others have said - marinas all over the place are doing things like this - or forcing restrictions- some of this is due to insurance reasons or state EPA type issues. unfortunately some boats - sailboaters included - are pretty sloppy in doing work on their boats - and yards are forced to deal with the consequences. also, most yards figure at the end of the day, they make more $$ - honestly yards probably don't make much $ on storage - they make it up doing work.

i try to give my yard some amount of work - but do most myself. i think it is OK to give these guys some business - buy spare parts, some work, etc. - its the way they can make a living.

Note that I do now work for or have an interest in any boat yard..

Rick

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trescool View Post
I will be winterizing my 18HP Perkins diesel for my Catalina 270 for the first time. The marina requires it before winter haul-out. Assuming I change the oil and antifreeze the raw water intake, how do marinas deal with getting the boat the the haul-out area? I'm confused. What order and when should I do the winterization of everything?

Also, what is your opinion on this? The marina I currently keep my sailboat in sent me the usual winter contract for storage. Attached was an optional list of their offerings for winterizing. After sending my check for winter haul-out, I was called by the manager to tell me that this marina "is a full service marina". Basically, he told me that we needed for THEM to do ALL winterization or else I could not store my boat there.

I mentioned that my boat neighbor does all his own winterization to which the manager replied, "well, I'm not letting new people do that." Is this strange? Why send an optional list when it is required? Again, confused here.

Thanks!
Jim
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Old 10-29-2007
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winterizing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trescool View Post
I will be winterizing my 18HP Perkins diesel for my Catalina 270 for the first time. The marina requires it before winter haul-out. Assuming I change the oil and antifreeze the raw water intake, how do marinas deal with getting the boat the the haul-out area? I'm confused. What order and when should I do the winterization of everything?
I'm confused. Are you going to winterize the engine, or are you having the marina do it?

Anyway, the yard that I use moves boats with a small Boston Whaler, so it doesn't matter what you have done to the engine. I assume that means you will winterize the raw water at their dock?

Regarding your marina and working on boats, it seems that more and more marinas are going in that direction. I can understand it, but it seems a little strange to me, since the places around here have more work than they can handle, and actually turn people away.

Good luck,
Barry
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Old 10-29-2007
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I do agree that the marina deserves some work thrown its way. When I started out in July with them, I had them install the GPS unit, new radio, and a new wind speed indicator. I thought maybe $1000... turned out it took them 14 hours at a cost of $2200. Blew my budget for this year!.

I did find a marina which the present one recommended. Strangely enough, same price for winter storage, they are about 1000 feet from each other but then will allow me to do my own winterization of boat.

Thakns for all the input!

Quote:
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i try to give my yard some amount of work - but do most myself. i think it is OK to give these guys some business - buy spare parts, some work, etc. - its the way they can make a living.
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