The bad, worse and the ugly!

[sailboy21]

Since this forum seems to be on the topic of wiring, I'd like to share some of my latest heart stopping (almost literally) findings.

I knew it had to be redone... but I did not know how seriously ill-convinced and inadequate my shore power system was, nor how close I was to major disaster. I'm in the process of rewiring my whole boat it seems as a result of simply running one bilge pump wire!!! While pulling apart and re bundling the harness coming from the DC panel I felt something warm... not a good sign. I investigated further and found 16 gage extension cord going into a ball of very warm electrical tape, and two more wires coming out of it!!! Not good I think!!! So I start ripping and this is what I end up with:



The port and stbd AC outlets were both powered from this one orange extension cord, teed off using wirenuts encapsulated in electrical tape, and all was completely commingled with the DC wiring!!!

{start rant}
THIS IS BAD BAD BAD BAD!!!! I CAN'T BELIEVE I STILL HAVE A BOAT. I WAS RUNNING A 1000 WATT HEATER AND POWER TOOLS OFF OF THIS MESS!!!!! I WANT TO FIND OUT WHO DID THIS AND STRANGLE THEM, AND STRANGLE THE SURVEYOR, AND THEN MYSELF!!!!!!
{end rant}

So... the story of how one bilge pump is going to cost me $1000's and probably 100 hours of work continues.

I am currently soliciting advice on how to construct a surface mount AC main panel. I have no bulkhead real estate left, so its going to have to be surface mounted somewhere. Any advice on materials (starboard, wood, aluminum etc..) would be appreacited.

[Jeff_H]

That's about what I found on my boat. My boat had a steel Square D fuse box with the kind of screwed in glass fuses that were popular back in the 1930's. The knock out was removed on the top of the box and that was installed in my lazarette where it could get wet when the hatch was opened, or small leaves and the like could drop in and did drop in. The 110 system was wired with residential style Romex. The portion that went through the bilge was stained but we could not tell if it was shorted or not. The receptacles lacked ground fault protection as well.

Needless to say I put in a new system when I bought the boat.

Jeff

[sailingdog]

Yes, but it also may have saved you from your boat burning down or you getting electrocuted...

To surface mount the AC panel, you'll need to get a plastic housing for the AC distribution panel. Starboard or plexiglass would work fairly well. I would avoid metal, since corrosion is always a problem on a boat...and electricity, metal and water aren't a great combination. When you make the box, make sure you've got drain holes in the bottom of the housing.

Originally Posted by sailboy21

Since this forum seems to be on the topic of wiring, I'd like to share some of my latest heart stopping (almost literally) findings.

I knew it had to be redone... but I did not know how seriously ill-convinced and inadequate my shore power system was, nor how close I was to major disaster. I'm in the process of rewiring my whole boat it seems as a result of simply running one bilge pump wire!!! While pulling apart and re bundling the harness coming from the DC panel I felt something warm... not a good sign. I investigated further and found 16 gage extension cord going into a ball of very warm electrical tape, and two more wires coming out of it!!! Not good I think!!! So I start ripping and this is what I end up with:



The port and stbd AC outlets were both powered from this one orange extension cord, teed off using wirenuts encapsulated in electrical tape, and all was completely commingled with the DC wiring!!!

{start rant}
THIS IS BAD BAD BAD BAD!!!! I CAN'T BELIEVE I STILL HAVE A BOAT. I WAS RUNNING A 1000 WATT HEATER AND POWER TOOLS OFF OF THIS MESS!!!!! I WANT TO FIND OUT WHO DID THIS AND STRANGLE THEM, AND STRANGLE THE SURVEYOR, AND THEN MYSELF!!!!!!
{end rant}

So... the story of how one bilge pump is going to cost me $1000's and probably 100 hours of work continues.

I am currently soliciting advice on how to construct a surface mount AC main panel. I have no bulkhead real estate left, so its going to have to be surface mounted somewhere. Any advice on materials (starboard, wood, aluminum etc..) would be appreacited.

[sailboy21]

Another thought I had was is there any boat cable triplex color that has a yellow jacket vice white? I am certainly not going to run the new AC wire in the middle of DC cable bundles, but it would be nice if there was a way to make certain this will never happen again!

[chucklesR]

The good news is you know better.

No seriously, that's the good news.


The bad news, the Rawson 30 isn't exactly a well known boat.

The other good news, they have an owners site: Rawson 30 » Home

Other owners have experience the same problems. They even have a yahoo group (linked to on the link above). rawsonownersnet : Rawson 30 Owners' Network It's members only, and I've not joined just like you have joined the Gemini user group on Yahoo

Start talking to them - surely they have worked out the issues you have (no space for a real distribution box etc..).

I assure you, the good news is you know better, add that to the fact that there are many many people here (and undoubtedly on the Rawson site) that have already worked out and fixed the problems and you are very much ahead.
Most of the solution if finding place to find the answer, and you've already gotten there

[sailboy21]

chuckles,
Ah.. but some of us have the joy of owning a completely unique one-off custom interior! This AC install was not factory either. The price tag indicates it was bought at Kilgo's Hardware (Hawaiians will know what that is).
The new AC panel and box will have to be placed near the foot of my quarter berth I'm afraid... right next to the charger and fluxgate compass

[sailingdog]

Helping keep the AC wiring separate from the DC is one reason the ABYC has revised their code so the DC ground is now YELLOW, since the older black wires could be mistaken for the AC hot wiring...

[chucklesR]

Sailboy,
Since it custom, pictures, 1000 words et al.
Meaning, post more pictures so the experts here (I'm not one, I am just electronics literate - Saildog knows his stuff) can really help. In particular a layout of the boat, what's where would help - something to give a idea of the length of wire needed helps us to tell you what gauge of wire is correct etc.
Also, we who have greatly modified out current or previous boats might have ideas and suggestions on how to find space to install panels etc. that you might not think of.
Bottom line from my previous remains, all is not lost.
As a pilot house the Rawson 31 looks good. It's worth the pain.

[thekeip]

I've seen two installations recently that I liked...the owners probably knew each other. An owner had bought some selection of the 'Blue Sea' AC parapheneralia appropriate for his use... switches, circuit breakers and such, and mounted everything in a yellow 'Pelican' case which he mounted vertically on a bulkhead. You can get Pelican cases in all sizes, they make really nice waterproof cabinets, and standard electrical paneling can fit very nicely inside. Not at all unattractive.
Howard Keiper
SeaQuest
Berkeley

[sailingdog]

Not a bad idea really, but if go with the pelican case, you'll want to make sure that all the wires coming into it have drip loops on the outside of the case... to minimize water getting in...just in case. It sure beats fabricating a case...but the Pelican cases aren't cheap.

Originally Posted by thekeip

I've seen two installations recently that I liked...the owners probably knew each other. An owner had bought some selection of the 'Blue Sea' AC parapheneralia appropriate for his use... switches, circuit breakers and such, and mounted everything in a yellow 'Pelican' case which he mounted vertically on a bulkhead. You can get Pelican cases in all sizes, they make really nice waterproof cabinets, and standard electrical paneling can fit very nicely inside. Not at all unattractive.
Howard Keiper
SeaQuest
Berkeley