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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 05-10-2008
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Halekai
Thanks for the input. I hadn't heard any negative reports about Ray RECENTLY.

My new boat only has a small GPS unit so I can go in any direction.

I've never owned a radar so I'm unfamiliar with the complexity of setting up a system.

Garmin has RJ-45 network cabling. So I can just plug the dome into my laptop and use Seaclear II, right? If only it was that easy! Or is it?
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Old 05-10-2008
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Old 05-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xort View Post
Halekai
Thanks for the input. I hadn't heard any negative reports about Ray RECENTLY.

My new boat only has a small GPS unit so I can go in any direction.

I've never owned a radar so I'm unfamiliar with the complexity of setting up a system.

Garmin has RJ-45 network cabling. So I can just plug the dome into my laptop and use Seaclear II, right? If only it was that easy! Or is it?
Setting up takes time, practice and will change with the sea conditions. You will need to use your radar in clear weather to fully get a grasp on it's capabilities and what a real return is vs. a false and to master target tracking. Do not wait until the fog comes in to flip on your radar for the first time.

As for the Rj-45/Cat 5 Garmin stuff I believe you will need a computer program to decode the Garmin radome code/language, but I may be wrong???.

I don't know much about plugging a Garmin dome into a lap top, nor really understand why you would if you have a plotter with overlay mounted at the helm, so I can't really answer that question.

Here in Maine the best spot for a radar is AT the helm but in some areas away from the helm might suffice. Radar overlay is the best feature I've seen come down the pike in a long time and is WELL worth it!!!
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Old 05-11-2008
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I am currently shopping for a radar and am leaning toward either Kodan (SiTex) or Furuno, mainly because I want just a radar display with the option to feed an overlay to a laptop plotter. My chartplotter needs are going to be laptop-based, also, as I intend to use paper charts primarily. I have a middle-aged Raymarine 420, but with no cartridges, so it's more like a really big handheld GPS.

Were I in exclusively North American waters or even European waters, I would probably use more chartplotting and less paper, but as we intend to go a bit beyond that, I will focus on paper, Notice to Mariners, pilot books and the like.

Consequently, I feel the quality of the RADAR as a stand-alone device is paramount. Difficulty of use is not a big deal to me so much as accuracy of return, after I have practised with the unit in all conditions, starting, naturally, with familiar waters. It's easy in a pilothouse to pull down a shade and "fly on instruments" with a crew on deck keeping an eye peeled.

I hadn't considered Garmin as RADAR contender, because they seem...uh..."consumer-grade" to me. I would also wonder about service in distant ports, frankly. But I am open to persuasion on the point, as I likely won't buy until this winter.
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Old 05-11-2008
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In the end you need to REALLY think through what you want to have installed. I learned the hard way with my C-80 purchase although everything worked extremely well (zero issues with my setup - but I probably do not run my radar all that much because the screen size is so small).


But contemplate what all devices you want integrated into the system. For me - I want all the speed, wind, engine, tank levels, radar etc to be accessible via a single screen and have the ability to remote that data to a PC or secondary display at the Nav station. If all you intend to do is run the radar as standalone - be aware that normally stand alone units do not interface with PCs generally speaking. Much like fish finder only units have no ability to share data across a network for the most part.

The concept of the newer devices is plug and play expansion much like a computer and USB devices. But, they still rely on a micro processor or what that call the "brain unit" to shuttle all that info around. The price points include the ability to expand much like a gaming pc is much more expensive than your $250 base desktop that all you can hope to do on it is surf the web. Hence the higher prices. And frankly this is one spot where you negotiate a entire system correctly the first time because there is no real market for second hand electronics when after the fact you decide it doesn't work for your needs. You can get upwards to a 20 - 30% off list prices if you approach the deal properly.

Spend some time on this issue, because just like your exhaustive search for a boat - the reason you did so was to find the boat that met the needs as well as price. The systems out today come in only three flavors "Cheap but can do the job", "moderately affordable but you'll still be limited", and "Expensive but worth every buck".

Like Hal - but not like Hal - I too also investigated Furono, Garmin etc... for me even when I bought the C-80 I knew it wasn't going to do the big shabang (and I klnew when the card went swipe that I should of gotten E series instead) - but it would allow the PC to duplicate the main unit display. I was also constrained by available space...Now that I have the Barberis - the money spent on the more modular system - makes more sense because I can justify where and how I can use it. You have the space and room but maybe not the desire to spend the money on a more expansive system but you should reconsider that limitation because unlike any other system on your boat - it will be the one that gets most used especially during inclimate weather, and the flexibility you get down the road is in your favor...

Just random thoughts... good luck!
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Old 05-11-2008
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xort

Don't let the power consumption steer you away from a 4kW unit. The greater ranger is good for tracking bad weather and you do get better definition in closer quarters.
Power Consumption (Raymarine):
4kW RD424: 34W transmit, 10W standby
2kW RD218: 28W transmit, 9W standby



Regarding PC display of the radars returns: I would never go with a PC only solution. I only know of two combinations of radar, display unit plus display on a PC:

Raymarine has a PC program "Raytech RNS", connected via Ethernet to an E80 / E120 it can display the radar returns by itself or over a chart (not sure about the C80 / C120 series).

Furuno does the same with a PC program "Maxsea", make sure you buy the needed options to allow radar display.

I don't know of any program showing radar returns from a Garmin radar.
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Old 05-11-2008
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My thought on PC use...
I would setup a stand alone PC with no other uses like e-mail or surfing the web.
I would put the nav PC at the nav station as thee main unit. I would hard wire a remote LCD monitor at the helm. I can use a wireless mouse at the helm to control the PC. The nav station is close to the helm and I would place the wireless transmitter close enough to make a good connection to the mouse.
My desire to do this is based on cost. I was expecting this to cost less to set up but also, I'm concerned that the manufacturers all have proprietary mapping setups and each time you want to update charts they hit you for another $150. I cannot find much info on what this really is. But since I'm going to cruise the entire east coast plus great lakes, that could be a lot of SD or CF chart cards to buy regularly. Not something I want when I could download current charts from NOAA (on a second computer then transfer to the nav computer that never goes online).

Now if I can download NOAA updates to an SD or CF card that can upload to the plotter then I'm fine with buying that system.

Anybody know if that is possible?

Last edited by xort : 05-11-2008 at 10:20 AM.
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Old 05-11-2008
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Ed..You're going through all this just to save $150 bucks once every 5 years? And going with a non-marinized solution that will cost you significantly more in the first place?
Put the plotter/radar display at your helm that gives you full control where you need it and forget everything else...it is just added complication and non-integrated stuff to go wrong. You want redundancy...put seaclear on your laptop and wire it up to your handheld GPS...want more...get mapping on your handheld built in. There is no point in a redundant screen for radar since the most likely failure will be on the mast.
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Old 05-11-2008
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Ed,
Don't have a radar as you know, but do have a wee bit of techie background. My one piece of nonvendor specific advise. Make sure what ever you get is completely NMEA 2000 compatible. All the vendor's produce their own versions (sea talk for raymarine etc..). To my knowledge only Lowrance is fully and completely compatible (as of my review last year when searching for chartplotters).
Like Jody said, Raymarine plays fair with units and software that let you translate to PC's most of the others want to sell you package deals. Read up on NMEA 2000 and you'll understand why I say go with full compatibility. I can play video's from my PC on my chartplotter, hook a webcam to my chartplotter and see my blindspots, put sonar / radar to it etc.. all on a tiny Lowrance 5200c - yet not a single big name vendor sells a unit that can talk to everything else. Why is that?
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Old 05-11-2008
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Just keep in mind that most NMEA output on Radar units is only to send MARPA targets to display systems. If you want PC display, start with the PC software and then select specific domes recommended by the software manufacturer. I believe the new RosePoint Nav 2.0 (currently in beta) and Maptech Chart Nav Pro 2.0 (Rosepoint Nav repackaged by Maptech with maps and other stuff) will support full radar overlays using specific units.
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