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  #21  
Old 06-21-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freesail99 View Post
Chopped strand mat, in fabric form, is sold on the roll and in small folded packages. It is made up of 1"-2" long fiberglass strands that are randomly oriented and typically held together with a styrene-soluble binder that acts like glue connecting the fibers. The binder is designed to dissolve upon contact with styrene in polyester resin or vinylester resin. Once dissolved, the fabric softens, allowing it to drape around curved shapes Epoxy does not dissolve the binder.
Really!

Could be a problem.
Thats another phone call then.
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  #22  
Old 06-21-2008
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sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice
Fire up your heat gun and scrape it off. I'll bet that MEK will handle the rest of the clean up.
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  #23  
Old 06-21-2008
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sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice sailaway21 is just really nice
Most of the epoxy manufacturers sell pumps that are graduated so that you get the right mix each time. They can stay right on the cans/bottles with no ill effects during storage. I believe the ones from westsystem can be adjusted depending on which tube you install for different ratios. They're well worth the investment. They're neater to use, less fuss, and remove the thinking aspect from mixing-always a benefit. (g)
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  #24  
Old 06-21-2008
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BTW, don't use a heat gun any where near an open container of MEK. And wear a good organic vapors respirator when using MEK. Nasty stuff.
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Originally Posted by sailaway21 View Post
Fire up your heat gun and scrape it off. I'll bet that MEK will handle the rest of the clean up.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #25  
Old 06-21-2008
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aw... dont make me!
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  #26  
Old 06-21-2008
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I would still wait until Monday and talk to the hardener vendor. My credibility took a major hit with what it turns out I did not know about mat, but I definitely have made some epoxy batches with too little hardener that set up okay. the reason I am sure of it is that I had some left over hardener. I had a gallon of resin and 2 quarts of 2:1 hardener from Raka and somehow I used up the resin and had some hardener left. I am glad I had it around though. I bought a resin + hardener kit that makes low viscosity for sealing and when I have wanted to use some of that resin for lamination repair or adhesive I use the little bit of Raka I had left. The low viscosity hardener smells like ammonia. Works fine, but you wouldn't want to laminate with it. I hope I have enough of it left to do surface cracks on my deck before I paint.
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Old 06-21-2008
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Polyester resins and epoxy resins can be used together if you let the previous batch dry thoroughly. For example, using thickened epoxy to fill a hole in your polyester laid-up sailboat.

When trying to get a bond to wood I've had much better success with epoxy and I think everyone else has, too. Bonding glass on glass, though, is a great use for polyester because you can use the mat. Mat makes a great bond from new to old and between layers of new. When laying up new glass to old use mat first (binding new to old), then cloth. Each successive layer will be in sets of two: mat, cloth; mat, cloth.

If you plan on putting gel-coat on the finished product this is another example of when to use polyester instead of epoxy. Gel-coat adheres better to poly, since it is poly.
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Soul,

Yes, epoxy over ester is good, ester over epoxy is beyond bad. The reason I say "beyond bad" is that it squeezes every bit of air out of there and then tacks a little so it will survive a few "yank" tests and feel pretty solid, but it will work loose all at once someday (DAMHIKT).
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  #29  
Old 06-22-2008
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Rob at Epoxy-resins.co.uk sent me a speedy reply.

He said the mix at 3 to 1 wont set.
However he also said if I put a coat of properly mixed 2 to 1 over the top it might help it to cure.

Its a bit of a judgement call and not really anyone can make without looking at the boat.
I guess if I go ahead and paint over and it does not work it will eventually delaminate. But the structurally important repairs were the first things I did and were mixed properly and are strong. Its only when im sanding the deck and it smears I know theres a problem.

Im going to do a light sand with the belt sander, then smooth off a bit with an orbital sander, then paint over with epoxy.

Id recommend Epoxy-resins.co.uk
Rob was a big help and the "boat builders starter kit" is excellent and contains everything I needed inc gloves and mixing cups.
THe mixing ratio is printed clearly on both the resin bottle and the hardener.
Im really disgusted that ive made such a school boy error, but im putting it down to the learning curve.

Regarding the epxy csm discussion.
I personally would not mix epoxy and polyester as poly contracts.
Things have come on a bit since I was 8 (29 years ago). With boat building, where youre trying to bond to wood, epoxy is definitely the best material.

Ive asked Rob to comment on whether the 300 gsm matt i bought elsewhere is suitable for his epoxy. Im pretty sure he'll say its fine but Ill let you know if im wrong (ive no pride left anyway).

Thanks for all the advice. I didnt even get a sense of anyone laughing their ass off. Im assuming that this is because youve got your own disaster stories. It would be good therapy for me if anyone wants to tell all here!
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  #30  
Old 06-22-2008
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That's cause we've all done things equally stupid...and can sympathize with you.
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Thanks for all the advice. I didnt even get a sense of anyone laughing their ass off. Im assuming that this is because youve got your own disaster stories. It would be good therapy for me if anyone wants to tell all here!
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Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
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