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Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
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  #21  
Old 08-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartley18 View Post
My thoughts exactly - thanks, TD

Spa heaters.. never thought of that! Thanks for the link.

I know you weren't talking instant, but the instant unit they do have clearly states: "No standing pilot Ultra low water pressure start IC water control device No Electrical hook up 12000 Watt - Heat Output ( 40,946 Btu /hr ) 20-min timing shut-off to avoid CO toxicosis accidents."

If you ever needed more than the 10-litre 12V 25A dual-voltage electric one, the gas one seems purpose-built for boats.
I am with you and am saving sites that have stuff I want when/if I ever get my cat.
Here is the one for me-

Gas Water Heater

The unit comes outfitted with a CSA listed ODS (Oxygen Depletion Safety shutoff device ) inside. CSA (Canadian Standards Association) is a global leader in developing and distributing standards for more than 85 years

ODS technology originated in Europe, and has been widely used in European gas heating appliances for more than 45 years with an outstanding record of safety and then adopted by U.S. manufacturers for all vent-free gas products such as logsets and camper heaters.

More details on ODS safety shutoff below.

Yes, I understand that CO can build up and kill but tell me, someone please, a 10 minute shower vs baking a loaf of bread in the oven. Yes, I know the head is a smaller space.
Please tell me.
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  #22  
Old 08-10-2008
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xort has a spectacular aura about xort has a spectacular aura about xort has a spectacular aura about
These gas appliances may be great and may be certified by Canadian & Euro officials but you'd better check with your US insurance carrier. Doesn't matter how good it is if the insurance co will stiff you if you have one. Assuming you are US based of course and stuck with legal overkill. Thank you John Edwards
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  #23  
Old 08-10-2008
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Neat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by therapy23 View Post
Yes, I understand that CO can build up and kill but tell me, someone please, a 10 minute shower vs baking a loaf of bread in the oven. Yes, I know the head is a smaller space.
Please tell me.
Given that these units don't have a pilot light running constantly, I don't see the logic either. A boat has to be reasonably well-ventilated whenever you're using gas anyway - to minimise condensation if nothing else - but I'd love to hear the answer from an "expert".

As far as the 10-minute shower vs. baking a loaf of bread: Most nights on board down here in winter we use a flower-pot on the stove for heating. If running that every night for a half-hour or more isn't a problem, why would a water heater be?

(Where's that Dog when you want him?? Probably out chasing cats again.. )
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  #24  
Old 08-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xort View Post
These gas appliances may be great and may be certified by Canadian & Euro officials but you'd better check with your US insurance carrier. Doesn't matter how good it is if the insurance co will stiff you if you have one. Assuming you are US based of course and stuck with legal overkill. Thank you John Edwards

Yep, I am.

Good point.
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  #25  
Old 08-11-2008
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Obviously the big no no with instant gas heaters is with the pilot light. No way does any sensible person, and here I am in complete agreement with TommyT, have a gas line permanently open into their boat.

Another topic admittedly but we have a gas pressure gauge on the tank that is visible from the main hatch and a hard and fast rule that stove is not turned on unless gauge has been checked first. Gas is always manually turned off at bottle after cooking as well.

While the non pilot light version is therefore somewhat safer I still don't like the idea if only from the water usage point of view. Also, in cold weather you know damn well that there is a temptation to keep the head hatch closed.

With heaters such as Hartley's flower pot which do have the oxygen depletion problem at least they are usually sighted near the main companionway and most of us tend to leave that open most of the time even when its cold. For serious cold weather I'd rather have one of the vented Dickinson oil heaters if only cos I think they are lovely, all romantic loik, makes your honey wanna cuddle up besides youse.
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Old 08-11-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdw View Post
Another topic admittedly but we have a gas pressure gauge on the tank that is visible from the main hatch and a hard and fast rule that stove is not turned on unless gauge has been checked first. Gas is always manually turned off at bottle after cooking as well.
Can't say I've ever seen anyone fit a pressure gauge on their gas line, but that's a really neat idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by otaga05 View Post
FWIW I looked at a Niagara 35 a few years back which had a Paloma brand on demand propane fired hot water heater. Don't know if it is marine rated.
Somehow I don't think any of them are marine-rated. The technology is just a bit too new and the market isn't big enough for that.
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  #27  
Old 08-11-2008
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My propane system has a pressure gauge on it as well... before using the stove, you pressurize the hoses and then shut the valve to the tank. Check the pressure five minutes later or so...and if it hasn't dropped significantly, there are no leaks.
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  #28  
Old 08-26-2008
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Dangerous demand water heaters?

Quote:
Originally Posted by btrayfors View Post
Be very wary of the instant hot water heaters powered by propane...they can kill you! There've been a number of incidents with these. A boat is not a house, and these water heaters were intended for structures ashore (no bilge to collect the explosive propane fumes). The principal danger from these heaters seems to be carbon monoxide, and deaths have been reported due to their use in, e.g., showers.

Bill
Sounds like this post is from someone who has zero experience with demand water heaters. My 1980 Nonsuch 30 is equipped with propane-fired Paloma, is 28 years old, and works perfectly. Maintenance is the key. Like any other gas appliance, on land or aboard, you have to take care of them. Properly installed, and connected to a properly plumbed propane system, they are no more dangerous than your water heater at home.

Everytime someone asks about propane-fired demand water heaters there's ALWAYS someone that screams DANGER! THEY'LL KILL YOU!

Your statement is utter rubbish.

Last edited by anchorsaweigh; 08-26-2008 at 04:25 PM.
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  #29  
Old 01-14-2009
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We use propane camp shower to heat water

We sail a Caliber 28 and have a propane-fired camp shower that we use for hot showers on cold sailing days, and hot water for dishwashing. We hang the unit from the boom, keeping all combustion outside. Using the small 1 lb. propane cylinders, it has a 4 "D" battery pack for the pump. One hose end goes in a bucket of water and the other end is a plastic shower nozzle. It raises the water temp 30-40 degrees, so any 60-70 degree water becomes a 100-110 degree hot shower. If you have very cold water (like Lake Michigan), you put the shower nozzle back into the bucket for awhile, raising the water temp, like RECIRC in a car. Sometimes hard to light on a windy day, I drilled the matchstick hole a little larger for a barbecue lighter.

While Dad likes to shower in the cockpit, for teenagers we put a little extension on the shower hose, leading it around to the porthole in the head. About $80-130 at Cabela's. The whole thing stows in a 3 gal. cat litter bucket. (We store the propane cylinders in a 4" PVC tube strapped to the stern rail, hence venting overboard.)

Look for my article on Spotlights for Sailboats in the March 2009 Good Old Boat

Last edited by hullcurves; 01-14-2009 at 02:26 PM.
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  #30  
Old 01-14-2009
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Agree with anchorsaweigh, I had a rinnai on a 35' boat in the early 90's. ultimately something broke and I couldn't get parts at that time. New owner installed a bosch I think it was and sailed to New Zealand and back with no problems. Those had pilot lights, just like an oven usually does. Since the newer ones do not have a pilot they are even safer. Propane is to be installed properly and respected, but you don't have to run from it like it's a bomb with a timer! It's not new technology, very common in Europe on boats and in most homes - they think North Americans are crazy to keep 30-50 gallons hot for use sometime so have used this type for many years. If you're really paranoid you could install it in a sealed from living spaces locker vented properly and run the water line through a sealed fitting into the boat.
PS- ever see a diesel explosion. Makes propane one look small as it packs a lot more punch, but we treat our heaters properly and do not relight one that goes out when it is still hot and full of diesel vapours. Every fuel has its uses and with respect to its usage is safe.
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