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Nicro Day-Night 2000 solar vent repair

116K views 146 replies 54 participants last post by  jfeiber 
#1 ·
I previously posted this on another forum that doesn't show up on Google searches. Thought it might be more useful here. Unfortunately, no pictures of the process. I was impatient to get it fixed and re-installed.
_____________________

My boat has three Stainless Steel 3" Nicro Day/Night 2000 solar vents that are varying in age from 5-8 years. The batteries in all have been replaced more than once, but one stopped completely. A little testing with a multimeter identified the motor as dead. A call to Nicro confirms that replacement parts are not available; you can't even buy the plastic unit to salvage the dome on the SS models. Best part is these expensive units have been discontinued and the replacement requires installation of a whole new mounting ring system. Even the customer service rep was embarrased at the ridiculousness of not being able to repair the units.

Well, since they are $160+ (if you can find them in old stock somewhere) and I have three which are eventually going to all die, I was on a mission to figure out a way to repair it - and I did!

The key is two parts. One is a simple plastic sugar cookie sprinkle container and the other is a $9 solar motor (I purchased mine online from Sundance Solar - part # 700-60062-00). Repair is a simple process if you have basic soldering skills.

1.) Remove the SS housing and cut out the old plastic motor housing at its base, leaving a 1/4" or so protruding (it doesn't have to be pretty and probably won't be.)
2.) Cut down the sugar sprinkle container (you need one that is approx 1 5/8" diameter) which will now EXACTLY fit over the 1/4" protrusion you left from the old motor housing. Just make sure to measure your cut so that your fan blade sits at the proper height in the housing
3.) Drill a 1/4" hole in the center of the twist off lid of the sugar sprinkle container
4.) Punch a small hole in the side of the sugar sprinkle container to feed the battery housing lines into.
5.) Solder in some 24 gauge wire extensions (I used old Cat 3 telephone cabling) to the solar motor and battery housing and solder the battery, motor and solar panel leads together as they were before disassembly.
6.) Glue the new motor into the twist top of the solar motor
7.) Glue the container down to the 1/4" protrusion (I used super glue for both)
8.) Apply some silicone to seal the hole where the battery wires enter the new motor housing
9.) Screw the new motor in place and watch it run again for less than 10% of the cost of a new one!

Mine started right up with power from a 60 watt light bulb!

The best part is that if the new motor ever dies, I can simply unscrew the cap, break out the old motor, glue in a new one, solder it up and screw it back on.
 
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#30 ·
For those of you that might be contemplating repairing a Nicro Solar Vent per Danny's information, above, heed his words about caution. I attempted to remove the cap of the plastic covering the Solar Panel as shown in his Photo. In so doing however, I cracked one of the Pie-Shaped panels and discovered that the wire connecting the panels to the motor had been broken--likely by me in my efforts. Finding a replacement solar panel of the right voltage and amperage to run the motor and charge a 1.2 v battery that fits into the available space is a serious pain in the neck.

I did find a replacement motor at a local hobby center that fit the available space in the motor housing and will run on .5 or more volts and I did find a solar panel that generates the necessary voltage but it does need direct sunlight to get the motor spinning as the amperage is too low with even modest shading to start the motor.

Done properly, however, Danny's repair will resurrect the vent--which in our case is the only one that will fit the available space in the overhead hatch without goofing up the handle.

FWIW I used Silicon to re-close the top of the assembly so that it can easily be opened again in the future for subsequent repairs and a better solar panel if I can find one.
 
#31 ·
Hylyte, there are some "ice box fans" that are small and often run on one D-cell battery, intended to circulate the air in an ice box. SInce those are using a low-power low-voltage motor, one of them might be a good donor source for replacement vent motors.

Using a 24-volt motor as the other poster indicated, kinda doomed to failure from the start. Most of the 1.5-volt "toy" or "hobby" motors out there will have really cheap integral bearings, they're usually not designed for a long life.
 
#33 ·
I'm sure you are correct about the motor but, considering that it was only a few dollars, it's worth a try. The Ice Box Fan is a good suggestion and I have just ordered one from Camping World for investigation but it runs off of two D-Cells and so may require 3 volts verses .5 volts. The one solar panel I have will generate 3 volts but very low amperage and it is the "starting power" that is the issue, not the voltage. We'll see.
 
#34 ·
In all my years of hvac, I never even guessed such a POS (piece of sh...) could exist at a cost over or near $100! Yes, I'm on my 2nd one! I may try and fix the first one, again, someday.

They (solar vents) only move enough air to maybe keep mildew from growing when the boat is closed up in mild weather. Other then that, it's just a novelty imho :rolleyes: "Hey and see that?" It's a solar powered fan" *gloat gloat* :D How many solar type vents would your boat need for it to have real ventilation? you don't want to know! (4 Xs the volume an hr)

Sailboat designers apparently don't or didn't consider ventilation vital to design or, discount it I guess; as a potential reason for sinking. Maybe newer boats ventilate better, but older boats are just ovens for baking people. I realize this is common to all boats with decks or and or cabins, not just sailboats

Oh! How I would love to get a chain saw and start cutting! Hinge the whole cabin top off my boat and so many others! (then watch a storm take it away):laugher

Another example of poor ventilation is your home bathroom. If it were vented properly you would not get steamed and wet walls. But, if it were vented properly your energy bills for heating and cooling would go way up.

So, here we are, with to that close, blanket like feeling in our boats unless it's really nice and breezy outdoors. Nicro vents and those like them are not going to solve that.

My solution to being comfortable in my boat... WAIT FOR COOLER WEATHER!

A few facts about ventilation.
Odors are gas like and not easily removed by any amount of air flow.
humidity also will still move into a space that is ventilated.
"air treatment" is the act of recirculating air, using filters, heat and cooling to make it healty or comfortable. Example; clean rooms for industry and medical. not your home although the HVAC trade tries.

Was this was a rant? :rolleyes:
 
#35 ·
denise, I wouldn't call them all POSes. After all, there are stainless and plastic and knock-offs out there as well. Stainless, if you've never enquired, is simply damned expensive to use for anything. Honest, ask for anything to be made up in stainless and you'll get quotes that make 24k gold seem outright cheap.

Chinese mass-stamped stainless....Yeah well I've got some cheap water tumblers stamped out in India, aside from having real sharp edges they serve a purpose at a clearance price. But to make up a solar vent, I think really only the guards over it need the strength of stainless, making the rest plastic has to be a HUGE cost saver.

Boat designers know how to vent a boat: Lots of bug dorade boxes. Damned silly landlubbers that come around buying boats, are just too dumb to buy 'em that way. Yeah, well....

Ever look at a modern building? "Every" architect knows that shades above the windows help keep it cool in the summer and reduce the cooling bill. Ever see a building equipped with them after WW2? Damned silly landlubbers. Again. (G)
 
#36 ·
The Nicro vent on my boat does exactly what I want it to: it keeps the interior air dry and thus the mildew to a minimum, and it provides just enough positive pressure to the cabin to keep the engine compartment and bilge odors from saturating the living areas of the boat when everything is closed up. When I open the boat after it has been closed for a week or two there is virtually no "old boat smell". That's why I installed it, and it does it's job.
 
#37 · (Edited)
It was just a rant.. the one on my boat has been running about a year now. :)

Hellos yes, I've worked with a few Architects over the years. One builder I used to do hvac for only built passive solar homes. That 2ft overhang really works well.

http://www.marinco.com/product/daynight-plus-vent
"Moves 1,000 cubic feet of air/hour or 24,000 cubic feet of air/day
(4" model)" what's that around 16.6 cfm? Not much, the powder room fan in your house moves around 50 - 100 cfm depending on which one you have.

I've always loved turbulators as used on barn roofs.. but on a boat.. not so pretty :) Dorade vents are nice and a "maybe someday" on my boat.
 
#39 ·
Short Lived Nicro Day-Night 2000 solar vent repair

Well, HelloSailor's prediction concerning a cheap hobby-shop motor proved correct after only two daze. Worse, when I pulled the vent out of the hatch cover to check the state of charge of the Radio Shack rechargeable battery, I managed to drop the battery compartment cover which hit the deck and smartly bounced...over the side into the silt covered bottom of our marina. Repeated dives into the murk were not fruitful. So, if this Puppy can be repaired, it will be a "day only" vent tho' I'm about ready to chuck this whole effort!

N'any case, I recently saw a post for "Generic" 4 inch diameter Nicro solar vents (old style) and I am wondering if anyone knows if these have the same dimensions as the 3" vents other than the actual deck opening of course. (If so, I may be able to swap some of the parts) Any help on this will be greatly appreciated.
 
#40 ·
After tearing apart our hatch cover assembly, modifying the hand, and finally getting the new version Solar Vent installed, yesterday morning my slip neighbor's diver banged on my hull and announced that he had found the battery compartment cover that had bounced over the side the other day. "How ever?" I asked. "Oh, just felt around in the silt for a moment or two and there is was." he responded. He declined payment but I gave him enough money for a case of beer anyway.

So, even though the new vent is in place a spinning away--and it does make a great difference in the temperature of the boat when we open her up--I am still working on reconstructing the old vent--just on GP's.

FWIW...
 
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#41 ·
Hi, interesting that so many have the same problem. I heated up the top and got the lid off with slight miscolouration of the lid edge, and found that the solar panel - of glass - had shattered, while the motor runs nicely on an 1.5 V AA battery. So I'll look up a new solar panel and glue / silicone the thing together again and attack the number two vent that seems to suffer from something similar. Mine are at least 10 - probably 20 - years old and I have no chance of finding spares, and I agree that the deck plate is desirable to avoid having the thing torn off in green water if ever. So the new ones seem to be designed only for protected waters too. Can't imagine they get a serious off-shore rating on those. By the way, the cost for steel tubes to protect these would make the investment in this dinky little toy phenomenal. It seems it is hard to avoid setting a foot on them from time to time. But there are other cheaper brands with at least 4 inch measure and chargeable slightly fat looking NiMh batteries of 300 mAh x 1.2 V. Those solar panels might fit into the same diameter as the top plastic cover. But pretty expensive solution.
 
#42 ·
The difficulties I have had with rehabilitating our old Vent have been the inability to get any specs from Nicro so trying to guestimate what I need for a replacement solar panel and finding a suitable motor. The "hobby motor" I found that fit the vent did not hold up although that may have been a issue with the first replacement solar panel I used which I discovered, after the fact, generated more voltage than necessary. I was only looking at wattage rather than taking into account both voltage and amperage when I selected the panel and it turns out to have been a 3 volt panel but with lower amperage so the high voltage may have killed the first motor.

More recently I have found a replacement panel that puts out only 2 volts but 410 mA (see 2V 410mA 0.82W mini solar panel small solar panels charge small motor AA battery | eBay) which will just fit within the vent's enclosure and may be a better fit for the motor/battery. The motor suggested as a replacement in a prior post (see Motor for Solar Projects - 1.5V to 12V DC) supposedly uses 80 mA. Assuming 12 hours a day when the battery is running the vent either wholly or partially, that's roughly 960 mA hours of power. The rechargeable battery I have is 2000 mAH so it would be discharged to roughly 48%. Assuming my panel operates at an average 60% efficiency over a 12 hour period, the average power output would be about 246 mA. With 80 mA running the motor, I'm left with an average 166 mA to recharge the battery which should be enough to bring it back up to snuff in roughly 6-8 hours.

I have received the solar panel and am awaiting the delivery of the replacement motor. When that arrives I'll give this effort one more try. The unfortunate fact is, however, I really have no clue what the heck I'm doing so this is really a learning experience.

FWIW…

PS: Having looked at several possible replacements for the Nicro Vent, none seem to be even up to Nicro's offering.
 
#43 ·
Hi again, thanks for useful info. I realise I typed 300 mAh, it should have been 3000. You are right about the mathematics, and maybe all those mA are not going into charging, depending on the motor. In my case the original motor seems OK and it works now. I saw a question in one of the posts about the little electronic components, and in the cheaper vent I used (to cannibalize to be able to retain my old NICRO with deck plates), I found two little things that read IN58!9MIC, which when checking on Google translates into 1 Amp Schottky Barrier Rectifiers, which I take is a great kind of diodes. In my case the solar panel gave about two volts (2.05 or so) and the diodes (connected in parallel between the panel's positive and the battery positive / motor positive) took off something like 0.15 or 0.2 volts i.e. the voltage on the user side was 1.8 volts. That is pretty much for the 1.2 volt battery but if it really turns out to be destroyed I can replace it yearly. Or simply remove it, after all the earlier setup did not even have a day and night function.

Regarding the quality of the cheaper ones, yes I agree; as I removed the panel etc of the cheaper one, the electrical wire connections came off by themselves, and the motor - probably essentially the same as the hobby one - was much harder to get to move with the panel, so I think the older one is still of better quality. I am curious, though, at the rating of the motor from Sundance, as it says 1.5 - 12 V and thus should not really have reacted to 3 V as overvoltage. I would be interested in trying the 0.5 - 3 V although it is small and weak, it takes 100 mA to start but runs without load on 50, on rather high revs. That is, if the data sheets are right. I do not know what the load is from those masses of cubic feet of air that is transported. Well well, apart from being an interesting experiment it might save a buck, when we do not have to patronize those expensive Marine Equipment Shops. Until next repair that is.

Hope to get to sail soon too... Rain here, hesitate to go out and get wet.
 
#44 ·
Oops, me and typing, the Schottky diode should be IN5819MIC or 1N5819MIC, According to the website it is made by FCI Semiconductors. Good luck. I suppose it is easy to get those in a shopå for electronic components and solder on the lead, but it makes sense to first find out the voltage etc, to match motor and battery. Maybe they are only intended to prevent backcurrents, but they could also have a stabilizing function. I think I remember hearing about Schottky in connection with voltage regulation as well.
 
#45 ·
Akeela--

The first replacement motor I used was from a local hobby-shop, not the motor from Sundance, and was only rated for 1.5 volts. Another member, HelloSailor, commented that he thought it would not be adequate for the task and it was not, although that may have been because of my lack of knowledge and having used a higher voltage, lower amperage panel. I have ordered the suggested motor from Sundance and hope that will be up to the task, at least for awhile. As for diodes, I did not see any in the original Nicro installation although they may have been integral to the panel itself. I have wondered about the need of a diode between the panel and the motor/battery to prevent bleed-back into the panel from the battery when that is powering the system but thought I would just try Nicro's apparent arrangement first. If the battery goes flat too quickly I may try again with a diode but I am concerned about losses through the thing as the panel I have seems to have less surface area than the original and so may put out less power overall.

At this point, this is just an experiment for my learning purposes.

FWIW...
 
#46 ·
Well--I finally got the replacement motor from Sundance and lo-and-behold, it's the same motor I bought from the local hobby shop. I also discovered that the first motor did not fail but that I inadvertently disconnected the wire from the first solar panel to that motor, at the motor itself, when I disassembled the Vent for the second time. If I had realized that, I would not have had to replace the motor at all. It seems that the first repair probably would have worked but that the rechargeable battery I used had failed and shorted out the circuit from the solar panel (although that may have been due to too much voltage). In any case, the new, larger, solar panel should provide enough power at 2.1 volts to run the motor and recharge a 1.2 volt battery without destroying it. That the new panel develops more power (i.e. amperage) is evident by the fact that it will spin the fan even in shade so long as it's oriented toward reflected sun light while the first panel had to be in direct sun light to work at all. The new panel also came with a tiny diode which I installed to prevent the panel from discharging the battery over night.

Right now the vent is sitting on my back porch spinning away, where it will remain for a few daze just to ensure it will last awhile, before I reinstall it on the boat. It is amazing the one needs go through this much brain damage to effect a repair. Nicro does itself no favors in this manner.

FWIW...
 
#66 ·
...August 20, 1012...

Right now the [rebuilt] vent is sitting on my back porch spinning away, where it will remain for a few daze just to ensure it will last awhile, before I reinstall it on the boat. It is amazing the one needs go through this much brain damage to effect a repair. Nicro does itself no favors in this manner.

FWIW...
It is now one year to the day since I reassembled my Nicro Solar Vent with a $14 USD hobby-shop motor, a $15 USD (or so) solar panel, and a $4 USD rechargeable NiCad battery from Radio Shack (as described earlier in posts #42 and #46) and set it running. Since then it has operated without cease, day and night, fair weather and foul, from below freezing temps to well over 100º F. Accordingly, I guess one can pronounce our repair a success, eh? With a little determination, one can repair these units for very little cost, particularly in comparison to the cost of a replacement.

Cheers!
 
#47 ·
Hylyte-
"In any case, the new, larger, solar panel should provide enough power at 2.1 volts to run the motor and recharge a 1.2 volt battery without destroying it. "
Wellll.... Overcharging it at 2.1 volts will indeed cause it to fail sooner rather than later. The exact voltage may matter less than the charging amperage does. Cells are designed to be charged somewhere between ~1 hour and 12+ hours, and the cells are built very differently to handle that. The common 600mA commercial cells are built very robustly, designed for a 10-hour charge at a rate around 80-90mA and about 1.5V.
Exceed the voltage OR the intended amperage, and you cook the cell. A gas vent opens, it steams out, dries out, dies young. Exceed the amperage bigtime, and it heats up and explodes rather dramatically.
ODDS are, that if the amperage from your 2.1v solar panel does not exceed 1/10th of the amperage capacity of the battery, you'll get away with it for a good long time. Just saying, you might want to run the numbers to make sure the stuff will keep you happy for a while.
For example, a NiCd AA cell is rated 600mA for "commercial" commodity grade cells, but a premimum NiMh cell can be rated 2500mA these days. There's quite a range available, with a batch of subtle differences besides price. Same for bigger cells.
 
#48 · (Edited)
The 1.2 volt NiCad batteries I have are rated at 2000mAh. I also happen to have 1.2v NiMh batteries rated at 3000 mAh. The standard commercial charger for the NiMh batteries (from Batteries Plus) seems to generate 1.52 volts which seems like a rather stunning number for a 1.2 volt/3000 mAh battery considering the charger on our boat seems to generate only about 14.6 volts to "bulk charge" our 450 Ahr 12v house bank. N'any case, from my earlier post;

More recently I have found a replacement panel that puts out only 2 volts but 410 mA (see 2V 410mA 0.82W mini solar panel small solar panels charge small motor AA battery | eBay) which will just fit within the vent's enclosure and may be a better fit for the motor/battery. The motor suggested as a replacement in a prior post (see Motor for Solar Projects - 1.5V to 12V DC) supposedly uses 80 mA. Assuming 12 hours a day when the battery is running the vent either wholly or partially, that's roughly 960 mA hours of power. The rechargeable battery I have is 2000 mAH so it would be discharged to roughly 48%. Assuming my panel operates at an average 60% efficiency over a 12 hour period, the average power output would be about 246 mA. With 80 mA running the motor, I'm left with an average 166 mA to recharge the battery which should be enough to bring it back up to snuff in roughly 6-8 hours (I hope)
FWIW at this point the effort has become little more than a science experiment, we shall see. (FYI, after 24 hours, the vent is still whirling away.)

We shall see...
 
#49 ·
Closing Comment

I have now been "burning in" our renovated vent for a week or so, and have tried both the NiCad and the NiMH batteries. The replacement motor seems to work efficiently and smoothly drawing a minimum of power from either of the batteries at night , each of which will run the fan for more than 48 hours--the extra running time coming--I think--from the installation of the diode in the positive line leading back to the replacement solar cell. The replacement solar panel seems to work reasonably well and will raise the voltage in the NiCad from 1.31 v at sun-up to 1.44+ v by the end of the day. The NiMH comes up to 1.39 v during the same (roughly) 12 hours. (By comparison, a fresh C-Cell measures-on my volt-meter-a bit more than 1.5 volts even tho' rated at 1.2 volts, so I don't know what constitutes a "fully charged" state for these size batteries.)

N'any case, with the foregoing, I am going to re-install the vent on the boat and see how long the thing lasts, and will use the NiCad battery initially as that seems to accept more charge. At roughly $14.00 each for the motor and replacement solar panel--which should last 10 years or so--the repair is certainly more cost effective than replacing the entire vent (at $160.00). We shall see.

FWIW...
 
#139 ·
Closing Comment

I have now been "burning in" our renovated vent for a week or so, and have tried both the NiCad and the NiMH batteries. The replacement motor seems to work efficiently and smoothly drawing a minimum of power from either of the batteries at night , each of which will run the fan for more than 48 hours--the extra running time coming--I think--from the installation of the diode in the positive line leading back to the replacement solar cell. The replacement solar panel seems to work reasonably well and will raise the voltage in the NiCad from 1.31 v at sun-up to 1.44+ v by the end of the day. The NiMH comes up to 1.39 v during the same (roughly) 12 hours. (By comparison, a fresh C-Cell measures-on my volt-meter-a bit more than 1.5 volts even tho' rated at 1.2 volts, so I don't know what constitutes a "fully charged" state for these size batteries.)

N'any case, with the foregoing, I am going to re-install the vent on the boat and see how long the thing lasts, and will use the NiCad battery initially as that seems to accept more charge. At roughly $14.00 each for the motor and replacement solar panel--which should last 10 years or so--the repair is certainly more cost effective than replacing the entire vent (at $160.00). We shall see.

FWIW...
Dear HyLyte - I have three Nicro 2000 vents and I'm trying to rehabilitate them. The battery boxes have fallen apart and the leads corroded. I have purchased replacement battery boxes and I'm looking to replace the motors, solar panels, and diodes. Before reading your excellent posts, I purchased an .8W solar panel with a working voltage of 6 volts and working current at 0 - 135m/A. This is very much different than the solar panel you have used and recommended. Is there a way to make this solar panel work for charging the C-size batteries? Also, I have been unable to locate Sundance Solar that could supply the necessary parts. Do you have a link for Sundance? Thank you!
 
#50 ·
Still Spinning

For those contemplating the repair effort described in the previous posts in this Thread, after two months of ceaseless operation our renovated Vent continues to operate smoothly and quietly although seemingly spinning somewhat more slowly than the original when it was new (the fan blades are a bit less of a blur). Never-the-less, a "smoke test"--a puff of smoke discharged near the over-head in the vicinity of the vent--reveals that the air is quickly cleared as the vent discharges, so the vent is doing its job quite well enough to justify the $28.00 dollar repair.

FWIW...
 
#51 ·
@Toofani: I had no problems with the motor on our vent, but the multimeter showed that the solar panel had gone south. I bought a new waterproof, 2V solar cell on ebay for about $8. I had originally intended just to mount it on the top of the old vent, ugly but functional. In the end, I was to fit the new cell inside the old vent after removing the old cell and doing a little work with a dremel tool. The fan works great during the day, but it's still not operating at night. I haven't reopened it to troubleshoot as I'm currently satisfied with it running for the day. I have too many other projects. I would say, yes, if you can solder, you can replace the solar cell for much less than the cost of a new fan.
 
#52 ·
Rachel-
I would guess your fan is not operating at night because there are two 1.25v cells in the battery pack, so it needs about 3 volts in order to charge them up. With one 2-volt cell, you can't charge the batteries and there's no power to run the fan at night. A 3-3.5v solar panel is probably optimum, a 4-volt probably would also work fine.
 
#53 ·
For what its worth, the repairs to our vent described in my posts #42, and #46, preceding, continue to work well. Our vent spins away quite merrily during the day and continues all night and/or when there is a heavy overcast. It seems our battery is recharged enough to allow out vent to operate for about 40 hours without a good dose of sunlight. If Rachel's replacement panel is not working well for recharging, it may be that a diode is needed to prevent the back flow of power into the panel from the battery. A tiny little diode was included with our replacement panel and I did use it, which may explain our success to date. So far, the system seems to work.

FWIW...
 
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#55 ·
@ hello sailor: Looking back at others' pictures, I believe the Nicro model I have is slightly different. It was powered by a single, rechargeable C battery. I assumed that a 2V solar panel would cut it for charging. I wouldn't rule out a simple, stupid mistake such as my putting the new battery in backwards. I was so excited that the solar cell was pushing the motor again, I wasn't paying much attention to the battery side of things. When I have a free afternoon, I'll crack it back open and have a look.
 
#56 ·
Rachel, if you've just got one cell (battery) in there, yes, 2v will do it and HyLyte's pointer to the diode would be the next thing to check. Of course it is also possible that an old battery is simply shot and won't hold a charge any longer. Easiest way for you to test that would be to let it charge during the day, disconnect it late in the afternoon, test the battery voltage, and then retest the next day or a couple of days later, to see if the battery holds that charge while not connected to the solar panel.
 
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