electronics question - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
 Not a Member? 
  #1  
Old 10-13-2008
28 foot irwin
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: bellingham
Posts: 41
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
diverdad69 is on a distinguished road
electronics question

Im going to be fitting my boat for gps and depth sounder, radio etc, possible auto tiller, with out breaking the bank what do you suggest?

as far as the radio goes I want it to be able to link with the gps and give coords if something is wrong...

also how far does a typical mounted VHF radio signal travel compared to a hand held.

Im looking at the ICOM 422 or 604 in radios but open to ideas
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 10-14-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 268
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 11
sander06 is on a distinguished road
The radio I went with is a Standard Horizon Quest-X GX1500S VHF Radio with the optional remote microphone. It also has the GPS hookup for indicating position when using the emergency beacon feature. Looks to be quite a bit cheaper than Icom. The distance of travel for the radio signal is antenna height related since VHF is all line of sight transmissions. The main radio antenna is usually mounted on a mast and therefore goes out quite a ways, 12 miles maybe. There's a formula for that but I'm too lazy to dig it out. A hand held radio at deck level goes out maybe three miles. I don't know, but I assume hand held radios are putting out lower power compared to a regular radio since the antenna is right by your head when in use. I only use the hand held when messing with bridges or in the dinghy.

These radios all do about the same thing as far as I can tell, the only difference being the bells and whistles. I go by price and name brand. All of my radios are Standard Horizon.
__________________
"There's a wind in my sails that protects and prevails." - "Six Months in a Leaky Boat", Split Enz
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 10-14-2008
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by diverdad69 View Post
Im going to be fitting my boat for gps and depth sounder, radio etc, possible auto tiller, with out breaking the bank what do you suggest?
Are you doing the work yourself? If so, here's what I'd recommend:

Instruments: TackTick 104 setup. The displays and the wind transducer are wireless, making the entire installation much simpler than any of the wired ones as you don't have to run wiring up the mast for the wind instruments or inside the boat for the displays. The speed/depth transducers are still wired, as are the hull transmitter and NMEA interface, but it is a much simpler installation than the others out there.

Radio: Icom makes a good unit and either of the ones you've pointed out would work. Check to see if the radio has both NMEA in and out. If it only has NMEA in, it won't plot the DSC distress calls you receive on your chartplotter. I have the Icom M504, and it has both NMEA in and out. A handheld has a working range of about 3-4 miles, and is generally limited to a max of 5-6 Watts. A masthead VHF antenna with a full-power unit is broadcasting with 25 Watts of power and has a range of 20-30 miles most of the time. VHF is usually line-of-sight limited, and the fact that a handheld is used at deck height means it has far less range than a mast-head mounted VHF antenna, which is 30'+ above deck level.

As for the Tiller Pilot, it depends on what boat you have and I don't believe you've said.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 10-14-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,710
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
Are you doing the work yourself? If so, here's what I'd recommend:

Instruments: TackTick 104 setup.
SD, he wrote "with out breaking the bank." To me, $2500 (MAP) is a lot of money.

diverdad69,

I looked at radios earlier in the season. I wanted DSC (current radio does not have) and remote access microphone (RAM). (The latter so we could better-hear/-use the radio from the cockpit.) It looked to me like the best bang-for-the-buck that would give me those was either the Icom 402 or Standard Horizon Quest-X GX1500S. (The new radio hasn't happened yet for financial reasons.)

As for a GPS: If you can still find a Garmin 498C, that is one nice little GPS that, with optional sonar transducer, will give you your depth, as well. (I have that, but still prefer the Raymarine ST60 depth sounder that came with the boat.) If you can't find the 498C anywhere, perhaps its successor would be the way to go.

A fixed radio will usually have greater range, but that's primarily due to it being hooked-up to a higher-gain antenna that's at greater height, so your question is difficult to answer. If you're going to have it hooked up to your GPS for DSC, I would think you'd want a fixed radio, anyway.

Jim
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 10-14-2008
camaraderie's Avatar
moderate?
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: East Coast
Posts: 13,878
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 15
camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough
A fixed radio is the ONLY safe choice. 25 watts vs. 5 watts makes about a 5x difference in range when coupled to a higher mounted antenna as well. Portables are for convenience and dinghies!
Sailnet has a specail on the Uniden solara w/ DSC for $93 bucks which is an excellent deal I think. UNIDEN SOLARA DSC BLACK Shop.Sailnet.com - sailing resources, shopping, sail, blogs

The Icom422 is $195 here but is all you want is a good radio and DSC...why pay double the price unless some of the other features are important to you.

On the GPS front...I'd definitely stay with Garmin these days for either a basic or chartplotting model. If you plan to add radar later...be sure to get a chartplotter that is compatible.

As to tiller pilots...I'd suggest the Simrad lineup in whatever model is appropriate for your displacement.
Tillerpilots | Simrad Yachting
The TP22 sells here for $474 by way of a price range.
__________________
No longer posting. Reach me by PM!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 10-14-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,710
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by camaraderie View Post
The Icom422 is $195 here but is all you want is a good radio and DSC...why pay double the price unless some of the other features are important to you.
Indeed. That's why I mentioned our criteria included RAM capability, which adds some cost.

The RAM, to me, should be handy. Allows one to mount the radio down below and also have full control over it up in the cockpit.

Jim
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 10-14-2008
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
I'd agree on the GPS units, but the 498C was discontinued a while back and is really tough to find now. As for the instruments... if you're doing the install yourself, yes, it is a bit pricey, but if you need to pay someone to install the other instruments, it can often be less expensive to install the TackTick gear yourself...which is very, very simple to do...and it turns out to be less expensive overall—since you're not paying for the installation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEMIJim View Post
SD, he wrote "with out breaking the bank." To me, $2500 (MAP) is a lot of money.

diverdad69,

I looked at radios earlier in the season. I wanted DSC (current radio does not have) and remote access microphone (RAM). (The latter so we could better-hear/-use the radio from the cockpit.) It looked to me like the best bang-for-the-buck that would give me those was either the Icom 402 or Standard Horizon Quest-X GX1500S. (The new radio hasn't happened yet for financial reasons.)

As for a GPS: If you can still find a Garmin 498C, that is one nice little GPS that, with optional sonar transducer, will give you your depth, as well. (I have that, but still prefer the Raymarine ST60 depth sounder that came with the boat.) If you can't find the 498C anywhere, perhaps its successor would be the way to go.

A fixed radio will usually have greater range, but that's primarily due to it being hooked-up to a higher-gain antenna that's at greater height, so your question is difficult to answer. If you're going to have it hooked up to your GPS for DSC, I would think you'd want a fixed radio, anyway.

Jim
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 10-14-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 1,807
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 9
btrayfors will become famous soon enough btrayfors will become famous soon enough
Another VHF Option

Rather than bother with a RAM microphone, one option for some folks might be to install a 2nd, completely independent and redundant VHF. You can actually buy a full VHF these days for less than the price of many RAM mics.

Install the 2nd VHF somewhere in the cockpit, attached to a VHF antenna mounted on the pushpit. This gives you full redundancy in the event of a failure of the main rig, dismasting, etc. It also gives you up to 25W transmit power which will extend the range a bit, certainly more than a handheld. And, you can leave it on all the time without worrying about charging or changing batteries.


Bill
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 10-14-2008
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 250
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 6
baboon is on a distinguished road
I also am looking for GPS and instrument info. I have read lots of spotty reviews for tacktic. The ease of instal factor is great. Some have pointed out the battery will give out overnight, others are frustrated that the batteries are not user replacable. Their customer service seems iffy at times. Any real world experience out there?
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 10-14-2008
jarcher's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Smithfield, RI
Posts: 986
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
jarcher is on a distinguished road
ICOM makes great radios and I had several ham rigs from them, but if you're looking to save a few bucks get a Unidin VHF. I paid $140 for a higher end one that has NEMA in and out, weather alert, all the bells and whistles.

If you are concerned about range, put the extra money into the antenna. also, do not buy cheap feedline. A good antenna and feedline is a better place to put the money then on a remote mic, IMO. On my 30 foot Scampi the VHF radio can be heard everywhere. Its plenty loud and annoying
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Marine Electronics For Dummies Bluesmoods herSailNet 13 01-13-2014 08:39 AM
Ladder question mcain Gear & Maintenance 14 08-03-2007 10:28 PM
Electronics Box overhead atennaro@optonline.net Gear & Maintenance 0 02-24-2006 10:09 AM
Marine Electronics For Dummies Bluesmoods General Discussion (sailing related) 4 04-09-2003 03:19 PM
Marine Electronics For Dummies Bluesmoods Gear & Maintenance 1 04-07-2003 11:56 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:05 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012