Surveyors: What to look for and what to expect? - SailNet Community
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post #1 of 27 Old 12-10-2008 Thread Starter
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Surveyors: What to look for and what to expect?

My Corsair got swamped during Hurricane Fay due to design flaws, and it is now being fixed and refurbished. The issue was that a rubber boot came off a 1.5 inch pipe in the stern where the rudder control rod passed through permitting water to wash into the stern compartment. The compartment did not drain to the bilge and had no bilge pump, so it collected water and dropped the stern until the pipe met the waterline. At that point enough water entered to reach the bilge which could not handle the volume of water. Additionally, the amas took on water through an un-valved vent hole, speeding the flooding process. The rest is history.

I do not feel qualified to determine whether the manufacturer putting drainage holes in that compartment to the bilge is better than installing an additional bilge pump, along with their adding pop-valves to the amas, etc. Since some of you may have used surveyors or are surveyors, I would appreciate any recommendations for choosing a surveyor and what I can expect from them. Thanks in advance.
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post #2 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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You're considering hiring one to find out if it is better to put drainage holes in that compartment to the bilge is better than installing an additional bilge pump, along with their adding pop-valves to the amas, etc.??

I'd just ask folks here and elsewhere what they did.

It's a shame the people handling the claim didn't give you some input on how to possibly avoid the problem in the future though.

They have a stake in the matter as well.
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post #3 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WouldaShoulda View Post
I'd just ask folks here and elsewhere what they did.
I agree, I don't see this as a situation where you need to pay for a surveyor. Either you are going to do the work yourself, in which case there will be plenty of advice available, or you are going to get someone to do it for you, in which case you choose someone who knows what they are doing......

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post #4 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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OTOH-If you are actually hiring an "expert wittness" I'd be willing to testify that boats sink in hurricanes!!
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post #5 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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I know with my own boat insurance, I have to haul my boat out(witch they will pay up to $750) or I don't have coverage in a named storm.
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post #6 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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I have never seen a surveyors report that did not have a disclaimer at the bottom.
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post #7 of 27 Old 12-10-2008 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardiacpaul View Post
Ummm, uhhhh, how do I put this tactfully.

Your boat was in a named storm.
Got damaged.
Lemme guess, the insurance isn't going to pay...
Now, being the inventive personality type, you're looking to claim that it was a Mfr. defect due to some hokey "lookie here, this is what caused the big kafuffle and because the boat builder didn't take this lil thingy right here into consideration WHILE IN A FRICKIN' HURRICANE"
I'm gunna sue.

Here is what you can expect from a surveyor.
Nothing. Not one with any scruples anyway.

Here is how I came to this opinion. Please take note of the operative words in your posting.
You wrote:
"My Corsair got swamped during Hurricane Fay due to design flaws,

Yeah? Who says?
and it is now being fixed and refurbished. The issue was that a rubber boot came off a 1.5 inch pipe in the stern where the rudder control rod passed through permitting water to wash into the stern compartment. The compartment did not drain to the bilge and had no bilge pump, so it collected water and dropped the stern until the pipe met the waterline. At that point enough water entered to reach the bilge which could not handle the volume of water. Additionally, the amas took on water through an un-valved vent hole, speeding the flooding process. The rest is history."

I do not feel qualified to determine whether the manufacturer putting drainage holes in that compartment to the bilge is better than installing an additional bilge pump,
So, I'm looking to hire a cheap expert that will put his reputation on the line and possibly tie him up in court to testify.

along with their adding pop-valves to the amas, etc. Since some of you may have used surveyors or are surveyors, I would appreciate any recommendations for choosing a surveyor and what I can expect from them. Thanks in advance.
"
Actually, the insurance did pay, Corsair is attempting to fix the flaws, which the dealer agreed about, and I am not trying to bring on a suit. I just want to make sure that the fixes are sufficient to prevent this again. The damage could have happened while sailing with a following sea.

I heard that not all marine surveyors would be able to assess design issues and thought that people on this forum might have some good advice. I did not intend to imply anything else or dump on marine surveyors, and I am sorry if that is the way my query came across.
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post #8 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardiacpaul View Post
Ummm, uhhhh, how do I put this tactfully.[/I]"
Well, you sure failed to achieve that particualr goal! I have to say that this is the kind of knee-jerk and somewhat crass response which will drive people away from the forums.

I hope that you are still with us, Triquetra. Most of us are a bit more thoughtful about our responses.

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Leith (rhymes with teeth) is the port of the City of Edinburgh in Scotland. A Leither is someone who comes from that area.

I must go down to the sea again, to the lonely sea and the sky - I left my shoes and socks there, I wonder if they're dry?
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post #9 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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Just curious, how large is this stern compartment, and why doesn't it drain itself. IMHO, having the stern compartment drain into the main bilge is probably a mistake. Instead of flooding just the stern compartment, you could flood the entire boat.

The rudder on my boat, a Telstar 28, is isolated in its own compartment and any leaks in that compartment don't really affect the boat's ability to float as a whole—certainly not enough to sink the craft. The two rudder quadrants are isolated from the interior of the main hull completely. The compartment has drains, allowing any water that does get in to drain overboard—preventing the compartment from filling up with water and causing the problems you experienced.

Might it not be a better idea to install drains to limit the amount of water that can collect in the compartment instead of allowing it to drain into the main bilge??

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post #10 of 27 Old 12-10-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triquetra View Post
I heard that not all marine surveyors would be able to assess design issues...
You are correct.

A Naval Architect or structural engineer who happens to be a surveyor may be what you are looking for.

Meanwhile, there are some tri-maran owners here who may have some ideas.
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