cleat/cam question

[jayoung]

Installed a Garhauer Rigid Boomvang on my Mirage 25, and want to run the line back to the cockpit. Currently both halyards run back through twin rope clutch. Rather than install additional cam cleat on cabin top, or switch to triple rope clutch, I was thinking about installing a cleat on the lower mast, to tie off the jib halyard. I''ve added a roller furling last year, and don''t really make adjustments with the jib halyard. Does this sound OK, or should I think about a different plan of attack? Anyone add a cleat to the mast? Difficult? Should I add a cleat on each side, and run a single bolt through the mast, rather than rely on self-tapping screw? Any advice appreciated.

[tmdata]

I sail a Capri 25. My spinnaker halyard ties off at self jamming cleat 3'' feet off the deck. Has never been a problem. I intend to replace it this off season with a mast mounted cam cleat about 6'' feet off the deck to make spinnaker handling a little easier for the foredeck.

A majority of the boats I''m familiar with that have roller furling, cleat the halyard off at the mast and hang the halyard coil off the cleat.

I would recommend drilling and tapping the two cleat mounting screws into the mast and not worrying about a bolt through the mast.

[paulk]

Bolts sound like a good idea for a jib halyard that''s up all the time. We used self-tapping screws for a halyard hook for the spinnaker of our Soling, and ended up having a bigger hole than we wanted in the mast from the electrolysis/oxidation of the aluminum vs steel screws, which eventually pull out or strip their threads. Use an inert bedding compound or other goop to avoid the oxidation problem with the bolts.

[noctaluca]

I have an Ericson 35 with a roller furling jib. I am currently putting in a ridged boom vang (marine products, pnumatic), and running lines aft to cockpit. I plan on not running the jib halyard back and using one of the existing cleats on the mast. The rigger I am working with thinks this plan is good. Also, either tap new threaded bolts into the mast for the cleat (not through bolts) or use self tapping screws.
Good luck,
Bill

[MikeField]

I''m assuming an aluminium mast here. Before mounting your cleat, you should make sure that there''s some internal blocking inside the mast at your selected point. If there''s none, I''d be trying very hard to run fastenings right through the mast inside an internal spacer. You need blocking or the spacer to stiffen the mast wall where the load''s going to come on. (And then I''d probably put another cleat on the other side while I was about it, just for good measure.)

Whether or not there is any blocking or access to insert a spacer is of course another question.

A jib halyard takes a good bit of tension (especially if you set up the luff with a downhaul,) and if you simply tied it off to a cleat fastened only into the mast wall, I think you could expect trouble before too long -- either the bottom and then the top fasteners tearing out, or the mast under the top of the cleat crushing in. Or both. (I assume your jib isn''t set flying, but if it is then you lose some mast support and possibly the mast too.)

Sorry to sound pessimistic about this. If there''s no blocking, can you perhaps get access for a spacer via an exit point for internal wiring or main halyard or some such? If not, I''d try to think of some other way to tackle the issue.

[hamiam]

Drill it, tap it, and install the cleat. There are various products on the market that can be used to separate the metals. I think that the Mike above is far too worried; the wall of your mast, unless you have other problems, is quite strong and, if the roller furling system is anything like mine, the load on the cleat with not be extreme. The alternative of putting a fitting in the deck is fine if you spend the time to dig out a radius of core around the hole and then seal the whole thing with adhesive.

[MikeField]

Well, yes, I do admit to being a bit conservative in matters like this. And for that reason, I wouldn''t be mounting a halyard cleat on deck without putting a turning block in front of it firsts. Cleats aren''t designed to be pulled up on. If you do use a turning block, though, then you can lead the halyard right back to the cockpit if you want, where it will be a good deal less awkward to make fast to your deck-mounted cleat (and where you might also find a sheet winch available that you can use on the halyard.)

[noctaluca]

On my Ericson 35, the winches have welded backing plates that hold the big load durring hoisting and continues to hold the load when the halyard is up and cleated off. Think of it this way. The winch bears the weight durring hoisting and while secured to the cleat. The cleat simply keeps the end secure. To confirm this for yourself think about hoisting the sail. You winch it up then take the trailing end by hand to the cleat. If you can hold it by hand durring this transfer their surly is not too much stress on this cleat. If this still does not convince you then try uncleating it under a load. The winch will take the load and you will be able to still hold on to it by hand. Hope this makes sence.
Bill