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  #21  
Old 04-28-2009
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I would advise to call a lawyer and have him on the back burner. But don't let him get involved unless you ABSOLUTELY have to. I went this route. In my part of the country a lawyers go for $250 to $400 an hour. The guy I had also said if goes to litigation then he gets a 1/3 of the "recovery."

On the hourly rate He wanted a $5,000 retainer up front. Either way, a lawyer can eat up a lot of money out of a settlement.
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  #22  
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Sorry to hear about these circumstances.

I want to be clear here: I would NOT purchase a boat that has been previously underwater. Given the C36 has many, many listings in brokerage at any given moment (it's not unique or rare), it's an easy decision to exclude from consideration. The boat would have to listed at a significant discount to market before many would even take a look at it.

My guess is that you will not get the boat totalled unless you can prove the total repair, plus accelerated depreciation (if the insurance co will consider) is in excess of 80% of the value. The repairs on their own probably won't get you to that threshold. You might be there with loss of use, accelerated dep, etc, etc.

You definitely need to start getting a list of potential lawyers together, even if you are not calling them right away. See how it plays out first, but you might end up having to fille a lawsuit to get yourself whole. I am not a lawyer, but I think launching a boat without verifying through hulls is potentially negligent behavior by the yard.

Last edited by jason3317; 04-28-2009 at 01:49 PM.
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  #23  
Old 04-28-2009
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I understand, will do. Sorry to hear about this... very sad to have it happen right at the beginning of the season.
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Originally Posted by ghughes20 View Post
I'd rather not post the name of the yard. You can send me a private message and I will reply.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
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  #24  
Old 04-28-2009
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This is sad indeed, sorry to hear about this. I think that you may have more luck getting your own insurance company on your side and pushing the case for totalling the boat. After all, if the boat is fixed, your insurance company is the one that defines what condition everything must be in to continue insuring it.

I contemplated what something like that would mean for my boat - and it is scary (because although she's insured for a reasonable amount, that amount is not enough to buy another boat just like her and not even 1/10 of the time and money I personally put into the boat). Boats are not cars and monetary value is only part of the problem.

Even in my current winter storage yard which is hardly the top yard around, they ask you to go on board as soon as the boat hits water (with lift straps still around) and check all thruhulls etc for leaks, very first thing. Still, it happens and one silly thing like that can cause a whole lot of trouble.
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My hope is that you have an agreed value policy, which would be the basis of negotiation with the yards insurer. Even if they offer less, you might still be better off taking somewhat less, if it means getting out of this boat since prices are down in this economy.

As others have said, the repairs may not be enough to have the boat totaled outright, but if you push, perhaps you could get a negotiated settlement where you get paid, then the insurance company sells the boat to the yard who fixes it and sells it to recoup some of their costs. That way the loss is split by the yard and the insurer and you start over with boat having no submarine experience.
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  #26  
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i agree with brak when my boat got splashed they let it sit on the sling for 5 mins, then we both checked it out for leaks they should have done the same.

also if they want to try to repair it make sure up front you keep saying repaired to my satisfaction. ie we will sand and refinish the sole, you say only if its done to my satisfaction.

or i will offer ya 2 grand if they total it
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  #27  
Old 04-28-2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brak View Post
This is sad indeed, sorry to hear about this. I think that you may have more luck getting your own insurance company on your side and pushing the case for totalling the boat. After all, if the boat is fixed, your insurance company is the one that defines what condition everything must be in to continue insuring it.
Yes; first I must say that I am sorry for your loss. I could not imagine going to the yard and finding out they had let my boat sink and had not bothered to walk through it and check for water rushing in or that the bilge pump was operable.

I'd say that first you need to contact YOUR insurance company; tell them the situation and get them working for you. Tell them you are NOT making a claim against your policy but you would like them to work with the yard's insurance and that you would like legal representation to be provided if such service is available as a part of your policy.

I would not contact or sign on to a lawyer unless you cannot reach an agreement with the yard on replacement value or repairs that would fix everything. As for loss of hull value I can't say for sure but I'd guess that you are probably looking at ~50% value of the boat for a boat that was submerged.

You also need to contact your mortgage provider if the boat is not fully paid for, but check your paperwork because in the event of a loss like this your mortgage might require payment in full for the principal immediately. I don't know how you handle this but if you need to pay off the loan you will either get stuck in default or you will need to be paid for the total loss so you can pay off the mortgage.

The boat can be gone through and repaired; the question is what is the total cost for repairs? If the engine was submerged I would be pushing for a new engine. I would have your mortgage provider hire their own surveyor to check the boat if it is mortgaged since they stand to lose also. I would also look for a surveyor who specializes in sunken or wrecked sailboats so he can determine if the boat is a total loss or what it would cost to repair.

If you take a settlement for the total loss; and you consider yourself good at DIY work you might consider buy-back of the totaled boat. Replacement of all electrical systems that were submerged would be required; possible engine issues down the road, but the rest is clean-up and minor repair work. If you had a 100k loan and it was paid for and you put ~20-25k in repairs back into it you would now own a 50k (resale) boat for 25k invested and be out from under the mortgage.
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  #28  
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This is not actually a bad idea, if you really like the boat and have the time, skills and motivation to restore her.

Quote:
If you take a settlement for the total loss; and you consider yourself good at DIY work you might consider buy-back of the totaled boat. Replacement of all electrical systems that were submerged would be required; possible engine issues down the road, but the rest is clean-up and minor repair work. If you had a 100k loan and it was paid for and you put ~20-25k in repairs back into it you would now own a 50k (resale) boat for 25k invested and be out from under the mortgage.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #29  
Old 04-28-2009
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Now, if that would only work for HOUSES!
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  #30  
Old 04-28-2009
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I have contacted my insurance company and they will perform their own survey. In addition, they fully understand that I will be claiming them if the other side holds things up, so they have a vested interest to make sure I'm happy with the result.
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