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tedsouder 11-17-2009 10:44 AM

Advice Needed - New Rigging
 
I have a 28' Beneteau and am replacing all the lines. I have been given the option of using either Sta-Set lines or Low Stretch Endura Braid lines. There is roughly a $500 difference between the two.

We are just casual weekend sailors and don't do any serious racing or overnights. We want to get something that will last and we like to take care of our boat but don't want to overspend if we don't need to.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Ted

JohnRPollard 11-17-2009 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedsouder (Post 542807)
I have a 28' Beneteau and am replacing all the lines. I have been given the option of using either Sta-Set lines or Low Stretch Endura Braid lines. There is roughly a $500 difference between the two.

We are just casual weekend sailors and don't do any serious racing or overnights. We want to get something that will last and we like to take care of our boat but don't want to overspend if we don't need to.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Ted

Hi Ted, Welcome to Sailnet!

My first thought on your question is that it doesn't necessarily have to be an either/or, all-or-nothing decision. In other words, not all your running rigging needs to be super low stretch, but some of it would benefit from low-stretch characteristics.

On a boat your size, I would probably want all my halyards to be reasonably low-stretch. It doesn't necessarily have to be Endura, though. A product comparable to Sta-Set X (a lower stretch version of Sta-Set) would probably be fine. On the other hand, regular Sta-Set or comparable would be fine for most of your sheets, vang, etc.

For sheets, it's sometimes nice to upsize the diameter by 1/16 or 1/8" for better feel in your hands (provided they will still run fair in any blocks through which they pass).

I would suggest that you shop around a bit and compare offerings from New England Ropes, Samson, Yale Cordage, etc.

QuickMick 11-17-2009 01:48 PM

I just took delivery (today) of replacement halyards/jib sheets. I found a place in Daytona Beach that makes their own rope, got 280' of 3/8" white with black tracers poly double braid--low stretch and tensile rated at 4400 w/a 30% margin of safety built in: very comparable to newengland rope . 99 bucks plus ups ground. 35 cents a foot is 1/3-1/5 the cost of the others stuff i priced. this guy was great, and he will get all my business. let me know if you want his info.
Quinn

KeelHaulin 11-17-2009 01:55 PM

One issue with the Sta-Set X is that it is a parallel (non-woven) core so you will need special procedures for eye splicing it. I have not done this but others on the forum can help I'm sure. The Sta-Set X is about the highest strength option for low cost; but one issue is that it is a bit unruly once it has worn in as it gets hard and likes to hold hassles and twist. Vectran is similar; while dyneema remains more pliable.

You might also look into Samson XLS Extra-T; or Yale Vizzion. Samson Warpspeed is about twice the price per foot; but it also is nearly twice the strength. You definitely want a low stretch line for your halyards; it's just a matter of how low stretch you are willing to pay for. We use the 1/2" Yale Vizzion as it is what the boat was equipped with when I bought it. At times I wish it was lower stretch; but the halyard length is over 60' to the clutch. We just give it a 2'nd grind to take any slack in the luff out. Overall it is good for a budget halyard; fine for daysailing and cruising.

donradclife 11-17-2009 02:31 PM

For casual sailing, you will probably prefer the Sta Set sheets, as they are larger diameter and softer. The halyards could be something with less stretch, as discussed above. If you have older self-tailing winches, the modern (more expensive) lines are smaller diameter and stiffer and won't work as well as the doublebraid.

(Poly)ester is another name for Dacron, and is fine. (Poly)pro is short for polypropelene, which much cheaper and floats but is quickly damaged in the sun.

tedsouder 11-17-2009 03:42 PM

Thanks everyone, this is super helpful. I will talk to the marina about some other options or a mix of the two.

RainDog 11-17-2009 04:24 PM

I would go with the Sta-Set. It is cheap, nice on the hands, easy on the winches, easy to splice, and knots very well. It is very stretchy compared to some more high-tech products, but not that long ago Sta-Set was the new miracle low-stretch rope. If you used 3/8 Sta-Set for your halyards it will elongate 1% under a 440 lb load (which is probably a larger load than you will ever put on it). If your halyard is 30' (from top of mast to winch), that is an elongation of less than 4 inches. If you do not race, to me the upsides of using Sta-Set are worth an occasional extra turn on the winch handle.

I actually used Sampson XLS for everything, but I think it is pretty much the same as Sta-Set. For serious racing, or a 45' boat, I would switch to the expensive stuff. For casual use on a 28 foot boat, I would stick with the double braid.

tedsouder 11-18-2009 09:40 AM

Thanks Rain Dog!

blt2ski 11-18-2009 10:49 AM

Not sure a 440 lb load is quite right for a halyard. You may put 440 lbs on it in the initial pullup, but what happens when you have a 30 knot breeze? that 4" stretch now becomes something more.

I have xls-extra thru out. I actually prefer it over staset. It does not soak up water like staset or equal seems to do. Not that the line I use does not soak up water either, but less so. ALong with IIRC about 1/10 the stretch. For halyards I feel this is a better way to go, even for casual cruisers, as you will not have to fiddle with them as much. Sheets, in puffs, they will stretch more, giving you a bit of slack could be good.......then again, it could cause a bit more heeling due to sail shape loss.

In the end, it depends upon "your" performance expectations. For the little extra in cost, smaller lines for the strength equal, I like the xls extra. I have found I have fewer tangle issues with lines a bit smaller, vs larger diam lines like staset needs. If wearing gloves, I have not had any handling issues with smaller lines either.

A lot of this is personal in how we sail etc. Granted I do race a bit. Wat I also like about the xlsextra, is the definite color choices, I use red/blue tracer for jib lines, green/blue for spin gear, and cream/blue for main sail. I do have some lessor stretch lines, but again, try to keep the colors appropriate for the sail at hand. Also makes it easier for newbies, if they do not know where the jib sheet is, grab the "red line!" works real well!

Good luck
Marty

zz4gta 11-18-2009 11:14 AM

I don't like stay set or stay set x. Too many other choices that are easier to splice, strech and creep less. But they do cost more. I usually try out line on a different boat and decide if I want it on mine. Also, try pricing out some hightech line one size smaller. Usually the strength is plenty, and you'll save some money as well. Things like a mainsheet doesn't need to be 1/2" in dia. Try apex in 5/16". Great feel, strong, floats and doesn't absorb water. And b/c its strong and a blend, you don't need 1/2" for strength or feel/grip. You save money by downsizing to a higher tech thinner diameter.

Lots of options for your needs. No boat should have all the same type of line (that's just lazy). Also, you can make your own halyards using a cheap double braid that feels good and then tapering to a high tech single braid to save money as well. However, this requires research and a lot of measuring, splicing, stripping, tapering, whipping, etc.

My suggestion, call Annapolis performance sailing and talk to their line guy.


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