Took the windlass apart today - found something interesting things - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Gear & Maintenance
 Not a Member? 
  #1  
Old 02-26-2010
Bene505's Avatar
Glad I found Sailnet
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,543
Thanks: 5
Thanked 37 Times in 36 Posts
Rep Power: 7
Bene505 will become famous soon enough Bene505 will become famous soon enough
Took the windlass apart today - found something interesting things

After going all summer using the Hercules* method of raising the anchor, I've finally gotten around to opening the windlass up and seeing what the problem is. (*Grab chain and raise by hand. Get a great workout. Get all covered in muck. Pull. Pull. P u u u u l l l.)

See Sailnet Post - w1ndlass just goes click

First, I took the windlass off the boat. After rebuilding both the "mystery blower" and our washdown pump in the last few weeks at home, I saw how great it is to actually spend time with your family while working on a project, instead of disappearing all day to a cold, far away, cluttered-with-projects boat to make progress. With a lot of snow on the ground today, and time indoors to spend on a project, this approach really paid off.

Here's a picture of the windlass on the bow, taken while working on removing it. (I had the motor cover off in this picture).


One of the bolts was pretty tough - the washer and nut were partially tabbed in place, so I had to chisel through some fiberglass to get a wrench around it. Here's a shot of the tabbed-in-place bolt.


The I used a dockline tied to the jib halyard to lower the very heavy windlass to the ground. The spinnaker halyard would have been better, but it rained halyard in the fall while I was putting winter lines up. (There's another trip up the mast in my future.)

Back at home, I commandeered the dinner table for a day. With a little bit of liquid wrench, I managed to get a few parts off. Here's a video of my getting the first few parts off. I was learning as I went, as you'll soon see. (I used Liquid Wrench, not PB Blaster as I said in the video. Inside the house, I didn't want everyone breathing the fumes all day.)

Click here for video (10 Megabytes)

I could not get the gipsy (the thingy where the chain links fit in) off it's shaft. And one of the allen-wrench type bolts was really stuck. So a quick call to our car mechanic was in order. Plowing through all the snow in the driveway, I got to his shop, handed him some money and a great Unibrau beer with the words "I know you time is valuable so I'm giving you this for just looking at this thing". (Very true and I really like having a happy mechanic that I can call.)

Bill Anzelone got the gipsy off the shaft with a "pop" that made me jump. I didn't expect a loud noise and such a sudden motion when it snapped off. Then he went to work on the partially stripped bolt. He applied heat, tried a few things, and in the end got the bolt out by hammering the next size allen wrench (hex shaped) driver into the bolt and then using an impact wrench. I NEVER would have gotten that bolt out without Billy's help.

Here's a shot of Billy.


He also took the electirc motor off the windlass. There, laying between the ridges on the worm gear was a small piece of metal. Yeah! That was the cause of the windlass just going "click". I still have no idea where it came from. It doesn't match anything on the parts diagram, that's for sure. (Maybe BullyRuffin' put it in there, thinking that it was me who put those bolts in his engine bilge. A.k.a., how to drive a meticulous sailboat owner nuts.)

Mystery piece of metal that was lodged in the worm gear.



Billy Anzelone and I couldn't get the next disk-thingy off and we didn't want to break anything when the parts breakout should be consulted first. So he loaned me the cooking pan and helped pack everything back in the car. My homework was to 1) drain the oil, 2) check for other loose parts sitting in the oil, 3) check the parts breakout, 4) see if I could slide the shaft out without taking the disk-thingy off the shaft.

Windlass sitting in our car, now partially taken apart. The body of the windlass is filled with oil, so it had to stay upright. Everything else was wedged in next to it, to make sure it didn't tip over.


I ended up doing my homework exactly as he said. Here's a shot of the windlass back on our dinner table. The allen wrench bolts are all out and the shaft is ready to slide out. SO I THOUGHT! I had to remove the key on the right first. (The thingy shaped like a mini loaf of bread that is embedded into the shaft.) I was wondering why the shaft wouldn't slide out all the way. Then Grandma - of all people - pointed it out. I guess it pays to marry an engineer as she did many years ago.


Removing the key. In the end, I put the vice grips in the middle of it and wiggled it out.


Disassembled at last!!!


Now the second discovery. There's a spring that holds the latching thingy against the bumpy thingy, so the windlass doesn't go into free-fall on it's own. The spring was broken and one of the bolts that holds it in place was bent.


Also the other piece of the broken spring was lying in the oil inside the windlass. Billy Anzelone cautioned me to look in the oil for other pieces. He's good!


Note the bent screw


For those of you wondering what the inside of your windlass looks like, here's a picture. Half way down the hole you'll see a rubber "O' ring. I have the "seals kit" for this windlass and plan to replace the seals. Of course, that means I'll have to get that stubborn disk thingy off the shaft because there's a seal behind it.


This thingy needed cleaning. I scraped with an old screw driver to get rid of some of the oxidation. If anyone knows a good cleaner to use, let me know. I think this piece is not aluminum. Bronze maybe?


Here's a before and after where I cleaned one of the springs. I'll need to re-lube these, so I'm planning to ask Lofrans what type of grease to use. (I have grease that came with Defender's outboard winterization kit. Maybe I could use that.)


Now I better order the new parts from Lofrans and clean up the dinner table before hitting the sack tonight. Next time I'm going to completely cover the table with newspaper before starting. I think I played it a bit risky this time.

I intend to post an update after the parts arrive. Meanwhile, I'm wondering if I should use some On&Off to the outside of the windlass to restore it to it's previous beauty.

All in all, a lot of progress today!

Regards,
Brad

P.S. Here's some windlass eye candy. Its a picture of our boat when it was new and a member of the Moorings fleet. Note how shiny the windlass was a decade ago.
__________________
Posts you might like:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by Bene505; 02-27-2010 at 11:13 AM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 02-27-2010
Stillraining's Avatar
Handsome devil
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: LaConner,Washington
Posts: 3,477
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 9
Stillraining is a jewel in the rough Stillraining is a jewel in the rough Stillraining is a jewel in the rough
Nice post...I liked it
__________________
"Go Simple...Go Large"

Relationships are everything to me..everything else in life are just tools to enhance them.


The purchase price of a boat is just the admittance fee to the dance...you still have to spend money on the girl...so court one with something going for her with pleasing and desirable character traits others desire as well... or you could find yourself in a disillusioned relationship contemplating an expensive divorce.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 02-27-2010
tager's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 991
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
tager is on a distinguished road
CLR should work.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 02-27-2010
rdw rdw is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 35
Thanks: 4
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
rdw is on a distinguished road
Seeing all the detail should give some of us less experienced a little courage to tackle a similiar task. I enjoyed your post.
rdw
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 02-27-2010
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,950
Thanks: 80
Thanked 72 Times in 66 Posts
Rep Power: 8
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Bene, dude, you are fearless. Thanks for these great posts.

I'm going to go the marina and take someone's windlass apart.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

S/V Dawn Treader - 1989 Hunter Legend 40
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 02-27-2010
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Brad—

I'd highly recommend using DuPont Teflon Bearing Grease. If you can't find that, I'd recommend using DuPont Krytox bearing grease as a good alternative.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 02-27-2010
jrd22's Avatar
Courtney the Dancer
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: San Juan Islands., WA, USA
Posts: 3,813
Thanks: 3
Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts
Rep Power: 14
jrd22 will become famous soon enough
Good job, good post. I'm glad to see the bigger Lofrans windlasses are built better than the manual one we had, it was the cheapest, most poorly built thing I've ever taken apart (except for maybe a Chinese made 10 speed bike).
__________________
John
SV Laurie Anne

1988 Brewer 40 Pilothouse

Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 02-28-2010
Bene505's Avatar
Glad I found Sailnet
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,543
Thanks: 5
Thanked 37 Times in 36 Posts
Rep Power: 7
Bene505 will become famous soon enough Bene505 will become famous soon enough
I took the cover off the electric motor (as Philsboat suggested on the AS site), removed a lot of dust and checked the brushes. The brushes look good with lots of life left on them (I think). I can only image that the ton of dust that came out was from an older set of brushes. The PO probably changed brushes without removing the motor from the windlass, so he couldn't shake it around like I did to remove the dust. Looking at the smoky color of the inside of the motor case, and the lack of any discoloration on this motor, I'm thinking this may not be the original motor. See the 6th picture in this thread. Anyway, when I removed the cover a pile of dust fell out. Here are some pictures. There was probably 10x as much dust that came out total.

Removing the cover


Some dust


Here's a movie of me vacuuming dust (for those with a lot of time on their hands, I imagine). At this point, the 2 screws were still in the pan.

Click here for video (7 Megabytes)

Here's the shot of the 2 screws after I was done vacuuming. Oops.


I got the screw back, by digging into the really full vacuum cleaner bag (did it outside). It would have been harder if the bag wasn't almost completely full.

And then I got to experience that again, after I vacuumed both screws up.

Here's a shot of one of the brushes. All the brushes looked about the same. I didn't take it apart any further. There was a lot of tension in the spring and, frankly, I didn't want to mess with it. If anyone thinks these brushes need to be changed, please let me know.




I noticed there was a lot of rust around parts of the O ring that goes between the cover and the rest of the motor housing. I scraped some of it away (with the vacuum catching the scrapings) to help the O ring get a better seal. Not sure what to do about this. Option 1 is to wire brush it and paint it with rustoleum (or something else). Option 2 is to use some waterproofing grease around the O ring (like when you seal an underwater camera housing). Option 3 is to do nothing, simply put it back in place as-is. Anyone have any thoughts on this? I have a long list of project yet to do this spring, so I'm opting for option 3 if option 2 isn't practical.

Rust around the O ring


-----

I didn't mention this previously, but the shaft for the brake is a bit bent. Rather than getting a new one for $134 IIRC, and then attaching it to the little "steering wheel" at the top of the shaft somehow, I'm going to try to straighten it myself. The though goes something like this. "Wow that's a lot of money. Hey, I have a vice. I'll straighten it myself." I guess I'll have to post my results with that. The brake still works fine, but it's a little annoying that the "steering wheel" moves from side-to-side as you turn it.

-----

In other news, I went to Ace hardware and got 2 new bolts like the bent one and the exterior one that got a bit stripped. $1.30 each. That's much cheaper than getting the bolts as part of "Kit B" from Lofrans ($74 IIRC). I also got a couple of nylon washers to replace some very worn ones that protected the outer housing that covers the motor. The nylon washers were $0.20 each. The washers are twice the thickness of the Lofrans ones, so I'll have to see how they work, and maybe go to a different hardware store to get thinner ones.

I got the CLR. It says on on the bottle to not use it on aluminum. So I'll try it on a out-of-sight part of the aluminum case and see how it looks. I think there's a lok of gunk that needs to be scubbed away with dishwashing soap first. So I'll don my rubber gloves, grab the green scubby pads I just got, wash, rinse, apply the CLR, then rinse again. At least the work sink in the basement will look clean.

Finally, I got a nearly identical spring from the hardware store. $1.10. Then I brought it home, looked at how the wire guage was much thinner and how it was shiny instead of dark (maybe less carbon) and I chickened out on using it. Bock Bock Bock! This way I don't have to listen to CD and Dog telling me about how foolish I was for choosing a small spring that gave out when I really needed that latchy thingy to keep the anchor chain from going into free fall in 400 feet of water, with the broken spring jamming in the worm gear of the now useless motor. (And they'd be right to say so!) Instead, I just spent the $30 plus shipping on the Lofrans site. Anyway, all these costs seem pretty small when you consider that I'm getting a $4865 windlass back in operation. (Check it here on the Defender site.)

That's it for now.

Regards,
Brad
__________________
Posts you might like:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. .
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 02-28-2010
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Brad—

Hope you checked the bolts from the hardware store with a magnet. Good marine grade stainless steel is NON-MAGNETIC. The cheaper stainless steel is magnetic.
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 02-28-2010
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 20
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
thinplaces is on a distinguished road
I would replace those brushes, what do they cost $15 a piece?

It also looks like the gear (that the worm gear drives) is worn.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The E-List: Great things to do today with Lorne Mallin (Vancouver Province) NewsReader News Feeds 0 05-09-2006 05:15 AM
Windlass - Horizontal or Vertical? PBzeer Gear & Maintenance 8 03-03-2006 05:51 AM
Manual Anchor Windlass rclampitt Gear & Maintenance 4 12-03-2002 06:04 PM
Ten Things We Wouldn't Cruise Without Sue & Larry Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 12-12-1999 07:00 PM
Ten Things We Wouldn't Cruise Without Sue & Larry Cruising Articles 0 12-12-1999 07:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:59 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.