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  #61  
Old 02-06-2011
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Maine Sail i just read your post for the first time you have shown me that rebedding the gear on my boat should not be as hard as i had thought, thank you.

Marty
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  #62  
Old 02-06-2011
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I would add a couple of points.

First, butyl tape should be your choice for any through-bolted hardware that is above the waterline, with the exception of anything that is exposed to diesel, gasoline or other petroleum products on a regular basis, since they will damage the butyl tape.

Second, when using the countersink bit to bevel holes in the gelcoat, I would recommend running it in reverse. This helps prevent it from chipping the gelcoat and also allows you better control over the depth of the countersinking.
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  #63  
Old 02-07-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freesail99 View Post
For port lights, I think butyl tape is perfect as it forms a nice flexible gasket. I see no difference if the frame is metal or plastic as far as butyl tape is concerned.
Does it matter what the port light is made of? Specifically, I have a couple aluminum-framed port lights in which the window pane itself is Lexan. I'm assuming the butyl tape will work just fine with the Lexan?

And I also will join the chorus of thousands saying thanks so much for the detailed post about how to bed using butyl tape. I found a local RV place and bought two 50-foot rolls of the stuff for a whopping $8 each!

Yesterday I went up to my boat where it's on the hard and used some of the butyl to re-bed a small hatch above the dinette, which had been leaking slightly.

I discovered that some previous owner had bedded everything with what certainly appears to be white household door and window caulk. And all of it is leaking. After reading your how-to, I'm planning on pulling and re-bedding everything with the butyl tape.

Thanks!!
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If he used silicone household caulk, rather than acrylic or butyl caulk (which is not the same as the butyl tape in case anyone is wondering), you're likely going to have to sand the fiberglass lightly to get rid of the contaminants from the silicone caulk, or nothing, not even butyl tape, will stick to the area properly.

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Originally Posted by ilikerust View Post
Does it matter what the port light is made of? Specifically, I have a couple aluminum-framed port lights in which the window pane itself is Lexan. I'm assuming the butyl tape will work just fine with the Lexan?

And I also will join the chorus of thousands saying thanks so much for the detailed post about how to bed using butyl tape. I found a local RV place and bought two 50-foot rolls of the stuff for a whopping $8 each!

Yesterday I went up to my boat where it's on the hard and used some of the butyl to re-bed a small hatch above the dinette, which had been leaking slightly.

I discovered that some previous owner had bedded everything with what certainly appears to be white household door and window caulk. And all of it is leaking. After reading your how-to, I'm planning on pulling and re-bedding everything with the butyl tape.

Thanks!!
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  #65  
Old 02-07-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
I am going to inject some strong opinion here so please move on to the next photo if you don't want to hear it. I truly dislike and disagree with the Don Casey "two step", "wait to tighten and form a gasket" method of bedding deck hardware. In my opinion this method is probably one of the leading causes of deck core rot on the planet. Believe it or not, but I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I do however feel as if Don Casey wrote that technique to guarantee boatyards future revenue.:doh:
Think about it? If the sealant cures, to form a "gasket", and you then move the bolt while tightening it down on the "second step".... you lose!
In fairness to Casey, he clearly specifies NOT to turn the bolt while tightening the fastener.
"After the sealant has reached full cure, tighten the fasteners by turning the nuts only to put the sealant under compression. Now you have a gasket, but when the space between the deck and the hardware inevitably expands under load, the seal has a much better chance of remaining intact."
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Old 02-07-2011
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It is hard to tighten the nut without moving the bolt. And if the bolt moves the only way to guarantee a proper long term seal is to re-do it all.

I prefer Maine's method of countersinking the bolt holes a bit to form an "O" ring of sealant around the bolt and tightening once only.
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  #67  
Old 02-08-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L124C View Post
In fairness to Casey, he clearly specifies NOT to turn the bolt while tightening the fastener.
"After the sealant has reached full cure, tighten the fasteners by turning the nuts only to put the sealant under compression. Now you have a gasket, but when the space between the deck and the hardware inevitably expands under load, the seal has a much better chance of remaining intact."
And in fairness in the real word of boating I can assure you this rarely ever happens based on the sheer number of failures I have witnessed of the two step procedure. There are literally tens of thousands of boats with wet decks as a result of using the two step procedure.

It's also not just the bolt issue you can also make the gasket too thick and actually induce movement in the hardware. The other major factor is cure times. Considering PU sealants are moisture cure even a lab scientist does not really know just how cured your 4200 is under that stanchion, so how do you? Some of these sealants can take a month or more to fully cure underneath a stanchion or large surface area item. Who waits that long for the second step? When attempting this method there is a happy medium that you ideally need to hit. Full cure is far to late and minimal cure is, well, useless if you were trying to achieve this quest for the ultimate "gasket".

Butyl, well some of it, is by nature the perfect density and makes the perfect gasket material. Because it never hardens, always remains flexible and tacky, and does not mostly "squish out" like a PU does it makes for a very good and long lasting seal. Add a countersink to it and you have a bedded fitting that will be dry for a very, very long time.
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Last edited by Maine Sail; 02-08-2011 at 08:04 AM.
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  #68  
Old 02-08-2011
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Cathodic Corrosion

MaineSail,
Looks like you are using a aluminum cleat with stainless screws. Will the Butly tape provide adequate isolation from the metals contacting and causing cathodic corrosion?

Also, what is the best way to maintain stainless standing rigging when it gets a rust colored tarnish look? Is a scotch pad or metal polish ok to use on cables and fitting?
Thanks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by casey1999 View Post
MaineSail,
Looks like you are using a aluminum cleat with stainless screws. Will the Butly tape provide adequate isolation from the metals contacting and causing cathodic corrosion?

Also, what is the best way to maintain stainless standing rigging when it gets a rust colored tarnish look? Is a scotch pad or metal polish ok to use on cables and fitting?
Thanks
Butyl tape should provide a fairly decent galvanic isolation layer. It is very difficult to squeeze all the butyl tape out of a space between two surfaces, even if the surfaces are nearly perfectly matched.

As for standing rigging, A scotchbrite pad will help, but treating the stainless steel is probably going to help for a longer period of time. I've written a review of Spotless Stainless on my blog. It is a product that is designed to clean and help treat stainless steel by passivating it. You can read the review here.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #70  
Old 02-09-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitiempo View Post
It is hard to tighten the nut without moving the bolt. And if the bolt moves the only way to guarantee a proper long term seal is to re-do it all.

I prefer Maine's method of countersinking the bolt holes a bit to form an "O" ring of sealant around the bolt and tightening once only.
I completely concur. I'm simply pointing out tha Casey does address the bolt issue (for what it's worth). However, I'm sold on Butyl and Maine's system. Just re bedded a 30 foot toe rail with it. No cure time to deal with, easy to clean up and about $5 in material. Whats not to love! Still can't imagine why I get blank stares when I ask chandleries if they have it... "what kind of tape???"
I would think the yards would be using it! Maybe that brings us back to the "conspiracy theory"!

Last edited by L124C; 02-09-2011 at 12:57 AM.
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