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Mainsail reefing dilemma

7K views 18 replies 10 participants last post by  knothead 
#1 ·
I am wrestling with how to provide reefing capability on my Helms 25. Apparently it originally had roll around the boom reefing. Aside from the lack of any crank to spin the boom or mechanism to lock the boom to prevent rotation (the only equipment that came with the boat that clued me to the roller reefing feature was a boomclaw and the fact that the sail has no reef points and was stowed rolled around the boom by previous owners), the other problem I will face if I decide to try and make this work is the well known drawbacks of this type of reefing system: No outhaul capability, poor sail shape due to boom sag. I am considering going with a harken "single line" jiffy reefing system, meaning I will have to add reef points, as a reasonable compromise instead of trying to get the "roll around the boom" reefing to work. Would one set of reef points combined with a CDI roller reefing system on the head sail be a reasonable compromise affording fairly good flexibility in handling different wind conditions in an inshore/coastal cruiser? I''m 90 percent leaning towards the latter option, but would welcome anyone''s two cents to try and confirm my current opinion or talk me into making a 25 year old obsolete reefing system work. Feel free to respond here on the board, or in private to my email: aflanigan@comcast.net.

Thanks,

Allen Flanigan

Alexandria, VA
 
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#2 ·
Allen,

That roller boom reefing was obsolete from start!! I have never seen anybody in the aftermarket come up with anything to make it work. Our ''72 Ranger 26 came with the hardware. A PO abandoned it and installed reef points!!

So, take the mainsail in for a couple of reef points, add purchase to the outhaul, and, maybe, consider a loose foot modification to the mainsail (As long as it is in for the reef points).

I will let others flame about your consideration of the CDI!!
 
#3 ·
Thanks, John, for responding.

Any modifications to the main will be done by me. I''m not aware of any flaws in the CDI furler designs; they''re not silver plated, and they''re probably not rugged enough to suit bluewater sailors, but the CDI FF4 and the Schaefer snapfurl system were honestly the only ones that fit my budget.

I did pick up the harken model 430 single line system at a really low price, so that''s what I''m working with. It''s designed for one set of reef points only. I suppose I could add a second set of points and use a two line jiffy system down the road if I find I want more reefing capability than a single set of points gives me.

Thanks for your opinion.

Allen Flanigan

Alexandria, VA
 
#4 ·
IMHO that one set of reef points should be fine for what you need. Talk to the sailmaker so the boat stays somewhat balanced under the reduced sail area. If you need to reduce sail in a big way, you can always strike the jib (or conversely, the main) entirely. Of course, if it''s blowing hard enough for that, you''ll have already gotten back into the harbor... Practice on a light day so you know how it all works. Based on what we hear about summers on Chesapeake Bay, you may never need to reef anyway! ;-)
 
#6 ·
GordMay, how right you are. If I knew in advance when a reef would be needed I could strike the main and set a handkerchief. Hence the appeal of a system that will simply and reliably reef the main while retaining decent sail flatness and shape.

Maybe if I spent more time working overtime and less time on the boat, I could afford to pay a sailmaker to make these modifications for me. But that would be somewhat counterproductive, eh? ; > )

I am already thinking of how I can use the Harken 430 system to reef at two locations if needed. I''ll set it up for a lower set of reef points, and have a carbine hook or similar quick release shackle at the "clew" reef point so that I can thread the reefing line through it when I want to reef at the upper (2nd) set of points. Up front, I''ll try putting a hook with an eye on it threaded on the reefing line, which can be engaged with the upper tack reef point. This SHOULD give me the ability to properly tension the tack and clew at the upper set of points while not interfering with the normal "single line" operation for reefing to the lower points.
 
#7 ·
GordMay, how right you are. If I knew in advance when a reef would be needed I could strike the main and set a handkerchief. Hence the appeal of a system that will simply and reliably reef the main while retaining decent sail flatness and shape.

Maybe if I spent more time working overtime and less time on the boat, I could afford to pay a sailmaker to make these modifications for me. But that would be somewhat counterproductive, eh? ; > )

I am already thinking of how I can use the Harken 430 system to reef at two locations if needed. I''ll set it up for a lower set of reef points, and have a carbine hook or similar quick release shackle at the "clew" reef point so that I can thread the reefing line through it when I want to reef at the upper (2nd) set of points. Up front, I''ll try putting a hook with an eye on it threaded on the reefing line, which can be engaged with the upper tack reef point. This SHOULD give me the ability to properly tension the tack and clew at the upper set of points while not interfering with the normal "single line" operation for reefing to the lower points.
 
#8 ·
A couple of points came to mind while reading this.

1. If your boat is designed to have main reduced you are better off reefing main than furling a jib.

2. Jiffy reefing would be easy and fairly cheap to implement. Ensure that a sailmaker puts in the grommets so there is adequate support to the surrounding sail.

3. My experiences with a loft are that they charge by the hour and the work you need done requires very little time. It will not cost very much to install two gromets in the main! The roller furling of Jib will certainly cost far more than any Jiffy reefing modification.

My 2 cents. Hope you have a great sailing season!

Mike
 
#9 ·
In respect to the possibility of "Just adding a couple of grommets" to your sail, there will be reinforcing required at those points. It is necessary to disperse the point loading on the sail where the grommets are placed.

Wind loading on a sail is far from linear, it is more of a log curve. As wind speed increases, the loading builds rapidly. The wind load increase from 5 to 10 kts is better than 400%. The increase from 10 to 15 kts is about 200%.

As you attempt ro reef, you will be putting a good deal of strain on your reef points, and then they will have to be capable of controlling the sail once it is trimmed. You probably notice other boats when they are sailing have complete clew and tack reinforcements at the reef points. An absolute necessity, as you will rip simple grommets out and possibly destroy your sail in the process.

Have you sailed on "Jiffy Reefed" boats before? The process can be done quickly and efficiently once it is set-up properly.

Oh, and don''t forget to leave your clew reefing line(s) rigged, always. What good is a reef point if it is impossible to rig when you need it most.

RD
 
#10 ·
I have reef points on my sail put in by the sailmaker. They work well but I really like the roller furling genoa. It is a fast way to take down sail fromm the cockpit and be safely at the helm. I know it''s expensive but it is a really efficient system. Try reefing a friends main sail in mild conditions and then think how it would be if you were alone and a storm come in quickly. My system is designed to allow partial furling with decent sail shape. Nice when those squalls come in so fast, just pull the reefing line and sail is reduced. Takes about 1-2 minutes from the cockpit. Just my thoughts. Tom
 
#11 ·
Now try visualizing if you were alone and a storm come in quickly and the reefing jambs. There is nothing that is quicker, and more reliable than a two line slab reefing system, and frankly it is the only safe way to go when short handing a smallish boat. The problem with roller furling systems besides for their tendancy to jamb under load, is that they result in reefed sails that are the wrong shape for heavy air sailing. Instead of being bladed out as they should be in heravy air, roller furled sails tend to be powered up which means more heeling and helm problems. Even with the new foam luff systems, in a blow of any real length the leech and foot creep toward each other powering up the sail rather than being properly bladed out.

In the worst conditions with furling It is NOT a fast way to take down sail from the cockpit. You can roll the sail up but the increased windage in a real blow is enough to cause a knock down on its own. (been there, done that and already wore out the teeshirt) Dropping the sail means going forward and being down a sail that is only held in a luff groove which is not the easiest thing to do short handed in a breeze that is too big for the sail in question.

Jeff
 
#12 ·
Every boat should have a way to reef the main. There are lots of options, but the actual sail modifications should be performed by a qualifed sailmaker.
As regarding roller furling systems for the headsail, almost any system, properly installed will serve well. The problem most people have can be directly traced to improper or incomplete installation. Halyard wrap is by far the most common problem. The second most common problem is that people don''t bother to read the manual.
 
#13 ·
Actually, in my sailing experience the real most frequent cause of of a jambed furler, is that the jib is rolled out in pretty light to moderate conditions, but as the wind builds so does the force required to furl the jib. this greater force pulls the furling line into the looser wrapped coils and seriously jambs the furler. This is especially prevalent when single-handing because it is hard to keep enough tension on the furling line and sheet at the same time.

Jeff
 
#14 ·
Goes back to what I said about installation and reading the manual in order to learn how to operate the system. A ratchet block installed as the aft most lead block will usually provide enough tension on the furling line to allow it to wrap around the drum properly. This assumes that the first lead block is positioned 90 degrees to the drum, the line is the proper size, etc. etc.
 
#15 ·
Again, while everything can be installed as well as posible and according to the manual, I have experienced so many jambed furlers, especially on boats that were sailed short handed, that I can say with certainty that sooner or later you will get caught in a blow taht sooner or later will jamb your furler to the point that a single-hander will not be able to free it. I love these pie in the sky claims for roller furlers but in reality they are a jamb up waiting to happen.

Jeff
 
#17 ·
For shorthanded sailing, one of the safest configurations is to go with a main that has slab or "jiffy" reefing, AND either a mast track and slides or luff groove and slugs. That way the sail stays attached at all times. You can shorten sails very quickly, as long as you are familiar with the technique. Bolt-Roped mains & jibs are great for racing and that "Perfect Foil" shape, but are just too scary shorthanded.

For the head sail, good old fashioned hanks on a wire headstay. Again, the sail stays attached and can be dropped quickly. Not as sexy as a roller furler, or as pretty as a twin groove headstay, but who cares about that stuff in a blow on a heaving foredeck!
 
#18 ·
On a 25 ft boat, one reef in the main to reduce it about 30-35%, and a downhaul system for the headsail would provide alot of different sail plans very inexpensively. A line to the head of the jib to a sheave on the pulpit and then aft down the portside to the cockpit. On the foredeck a canvas is tethered to the bottom of the pulpit, with velcro strips on its edges. The headsail is collapsed by releasing the jib halyard, and flaking the jib down onto the canvas by using the downhaul to dowse it and the sheets to keep it taught and aft and on the deck, and folded up and velcro''d. The smaller jib goes up thru the hatch and the larger one pulled down same way. Changing out jibs instead of furling permits you to still go to weather: furling gear, it''s hard to do after about 1/3 is furled in. My C-22 sails well and balanced with one slab reef in the main and a storm jib, in winds over 20 knots (lake sailing, no swells). The main goes from 100 ft2 to 70, the headsail from 100 to 33. Trying this is inexpensive, if you are not happy with it, then at least you know. My downhaul was under thirty dollars, installed: line, sheave, and velcro''d canvas. More sailing, less motoring.
 
#19 ·
Jeff, I''m sure that you''re experience is much greater than mine. But in my limited experience sailing a 27'' from San Francisco to Saint Petersburg, delivering a 35'' from Florida to the Netherlands and installing a hundred or so furlers of all sizes and makes, I think you may be a little prejudiced against the whole idea. I am suprised that you haven''t used the old cliche "Roller Fouling". I remember being in 40 to 50 knot winds for 5 days in the Gulf of Papagayo with just a small piece of the genoa out most of the time and I was real glad I didn''t have to crawl around on that pitching foredeck every time the wind let up enough to allow us to carry more sail. And even more glad when I could reef from the cockpit when the wind picked up again.
I know stuff happens, but I repeat, a properly installed and operated roller furling system will make for easier, more pleasant and often safer sailing.
 
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